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Why did Viswanathan and Ramamurthy break-up their
partnership? What was the difference between VR
and MSV music styles?

Topic started by Sathiya Keerthi (@ panorama.nus.edu.sg) on Fri Jul 4 21:48:07 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

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Responses:

• From: Sathiya Keerthi (@ panorama.nus.edu.sg) on: Fri Jul 4 22:01:11 EDT 1997
  
  I have always wondered why the successful Viswanathan-Ramamurthy pair break-up their
  partnership. Who was the cause of this?
  Whoever caused it - that break-up- I
  feel, did a big disservice to TFM.
  
  My next question: It is generally known that
  Viswanathan was the more active and creative
  partner in VR. So, what was Ramamurthy's
  contribution? If you see the last few VR
  movies, such as Ayiraththil Oruvan, Vennira
  Adai, and the first few MSV movies such as
  Petraaldhaan pillayaa, Kalangarai Vilakkam,
  Anbe Vaa, I think there is a difference in
  the quality of music between them: the VR
  music definitely having a superior quality
  compared to MSV's. Also the tune sweetness
  and gap music were much better in VR songs
  than MSV's. So Ramamurthy definitely had a
  good role in VR, but perhaps, in a (slightly)
  secondary and silent way. Can we discuss these
  questions?
  
  
• From: Thenraja Kaliappan (@ atl-ga10-25.ix.netcom.com) on: Sat Jul 5 18:02:05 EDT 1997
  
  I have heard MSV's proximity to LR Eswari as the reason for the split. But no one would know the real reason. Because, neither MSV or TKR have openly told reasons. Whatever the reason be I agree with Sathiya Keerthi that it was a great loss to TFM.
  
  Styles of MSV-TKR together and MSV alone are totally different. May be TFM entered a different era with MSV and probably MSV was desperate to show TFM that he could do better than what he did with TKR. I personally liked both styles.
  
  MSV had done excellent work for almost all MGR films, Anbe Vaa and U.Su.Vaa the pick among all.
  
  
• From: sathyakumar (@ bones.deneb.com) on: Mon Jul 7 01:25:36 EDT 1997
  
  TKR would have provided the violin touches + helped in
  interlude music + writing notes for isiak kalainjargal.
  He would have been more of an assistant most of the times -
  except songs like ENGE NIMMATHY.
  
  Why did they separate ?? I never heard anything on this -but
  it was very obvious that MSV was the main force and people
  would have thought that MSV would provide the same kind of
  music - I guess that is why no one (like kannadasan, Gemini, sridhar..)
  tried to pacify them and patch up the differences.
  
  Few movies of MSV, after breakup, such as:
  Ramu, kuzandhaiyum theivamum, nenjirukum varai
  all had the touches/resemblances of VR; then MSV
  changed to his own style.
  
  
• From: revive (@ ww2.ssbcd.co.om) on: Thu Jun 17 03:33:04 EDT 1999
  
  I think, Ramamurthy had much more role to play in the MSV-VR combo. Anybody pls explain and revive this thread. We can discuss more about MSV-VR's contribution to TFM.
  
  Also, I would like to know the contribution of Joseph Krishna who is shown as "Assitance" in MSV movies.
  
  
• From: sun (@ ns1.qtel.com.qa) on: Sun Oct 10 05:39:22 EDT 1999
  
  quite a nice topic to discuss/....
  first me an MS fan to the core....has to agree the combined music was the best.....and to date has been best sellers...
  reason for the separation....well whatever it be....loss to TFM...we the music lovers....and i should say to MS-TK cos they missed the bus!
  
  is it not true that over the years MS tunes were repetetive and the orchestration goin from bad to worse...(when finally Illayaraja came in.)
  
  
• From: PNSundaram (@ spider-wn022.proxy.aol.com) on: Sun Jan 16 21:24:10 EST 2000
  
  I think that M.S.V has originality.In one interview in 1997, Ramamoorthy did say that he was good at violin but MSV always came up with the tunes. But, I agree that "two heads are better than one." Look at what happened to Shankar after Jaikishen died?
  
  
• From: SHANKAR (@ 194.170.168.8) on: Sun Jun 18 13:46:53 EDT 2000
  
  Mr Sun's finding is really absurd on MSV's orchestration. That too he is saying "ilayaraja
  finally came in" No one can deny the orchesatration in his songs were bits in pieces
  for atleast 5 years from the begining. You can see when change over from Pallavi to Anupallavi
  to Saranam. But it was boosted as different style in those days. But Ilayaraja is smart enough learn the art and over period he has improved a lot. MSV is the only composer who has
  ability to change over between or within the song smoothly/sweetly - in particular without any apaswaram ! Yar Antha nilavu for old song.
  Ninaithale inikkum after ilayaraja's entry.
  Thaneer Thanneer pure village style, Nilave malare
  sophisticated background. In each and every song
  please watch the way he handled the rhythm.
  Poor MSV. He doesn't know what is publicity for
  music in his peak days. He is the one and only composer who used TMS very effectively. Dear
  Tmaizhargale ... I am yet to listen a real
  Tamil Voice like TMS.... who never swallows words. Take Thavaputhalvan Ezhaam kadalum vanum nilavum ....Full credit goes to MSV.
  Good orchestration, synchronisation, continuuity,
  melody.. tumes not swallowing the words of lyrics,
  blending everything in to equal proportion and giving it can only be done by Mellisai Mamannar the one only MSV.
  
  SHANKAR
  
  
• From: sathyaram (@ 202.169.131.8) on: Sun Jul 9 09:54:33 EDT 2000
  
  Someone out there mentioned that it was MSV's proximity to L.R.Eswari that caused the split - well he could be right as MSV did play a very important role in LRE's life - in fact I remember in one Malarum Ninaivugal LRE mentioned "En vazhkai ennum Kuthuvilakule thiri yai aetri innum eriya vitrukirar MSV!!!!"
  
  
• From: thiarasu (@ 202.42.255.254) on: Fri Apr 20 14:43:28 EDT 2001
  
  the only indian music director who came out and talk about music is only illayaraja.
  
  
• From: Kadhiravan (@ 198.81.17.58) on: Thu Jun 28 10:13:41 EDT 2001
  
  Of Course, WE should give credit for whatever MSV did to the tamil music, whether he did alone or he did with TKR. He was the only who used TMS effectively in all his songs. It is a group effort
  We cannot separate one from the other;one might say his songs were hits because of Kannadhasan. But Kannadhasan would say it was because MSV tune.
  I heard from someone that MSV learned the style from SMS.
  
  
• From: haris (@ inet-netcache1-o.oracle.com) on: Mon Jul 16 13:57:09 EDT 2001
  
  In a recent cassette series (4), in which MSV gives intro to each of the songs, he doesnt' talk a word about TKR's contribution in any of the songs. Its really a mystery as to in what way TKR contributed, that makes him a co-MD rather than a assistant... OR is it just the MSV is shadowing TKR's contributions???
  
  
• From: RS (@ 203.124.0.247) on: Mon Dec 17 10:17:45 EST 2001
  
  Testing
  
  
• From: rs (@ 203.124.0.245) on: Mon Dec 17 11:01:15 EST 2001
  
  There is a general tendency to not give due credit to TKR for the VR compositions. I share herewith some interesting news in this ongoing saga.
  
  I recently bought a tamil book called Thirai Isai Alaigal, written by Vamanan. In the chapter on VR, Vamanan quotes TMS in tamil:"During the VR era, TKR also had a significant role in composing mettus for the lyrics, and MSV allowed this. That was the reason why the songs composed by VR are such great hits". TMS further indicates that TKR possesed a mastery of the 72 melakarthas.
  
  In the same chapter, Madurai GS Mani, who played in the VR orchestra, says that the challenges posed by Hindi songs among the tamil public during the late 1950s and early 1960s could only be met by MSV-TKR.
  
  In another section of the chapter, TKR complains that there was a conspiracy, after his split from MSV, to keep him out of tamil film music. He mentions that false rumours were spread by vested interests, obviously alluding to hearsay that MSV was the dominant partner in the VR combination. He mentioned that he was unable to understand why the tamil film industry did not make use of his talents.
  
  While VR were in Singapore in 1999 for felicitations for their contributions to TFM, a souvenir magazine was released by the sponsors, GMT jewellers. In a remark referring to the VR days, TKR indicates that they worked as an inseparable duo. In the same issue, Music Director, Arvind Siddharta extols the virtues of the duo and quotes KVM as saying," In making a song appealing to the masses, there is no equal to VR".
  
  A famous playback singer who has sung several songs for the duo personally confided in me that during the VR days, TKR also handled the orchestration.
  
  One could see a distinct difference in the compositions of MSV after his separation from TKR. The VR compositions are definitely superior in terms of orchestration and sweetness of the songs.
  
  After the duo rejoined sometime in 1994, they composed for the film, Engiruntho Vanthan. You should hear the songs in that film, especially the title sung by SPB - it is an amazing melody and, in my opinion, is the best and most difficult song sung by SPB. Even Anantha Vikatan {or is it Kumudam?)favourably commented on this song and the other songs in the film. Compare the songs in this film, where MSV and TKR composed music together, with the other films in the 1990s that MSV composed on his own --irumbu pookal, avasara polis, gnanapaarvai, pathini pen, jodi senthachu, silambu, aerikarai poongatre, neenga nala irukanum, thool parakuthu, kaathal mannan, etc. You could see a dramatic difference-- the less said about those MSV songs, the better.
  
  On a logical basis, the VR combination which went strong for nearly 14 years. could not have stuck if it was just a one man show!
  
  Let's give TKR his due credit.
  
  
  
• From: maryjane wahten parker (@ 24.53.76.170) on: Fri Aug 23 11:45:32 EDT 2002
  
  to venum: I hope you no that we taped into your file and we no all you secrects oh ya we are going to hert you so bad becuse we kinow all about you now :)
  
  
• From: N.Chandrasekar (@ 141.209.34.125) on: Sat Dec 7 15:02:02 EST 2002
  
  i AM FOLLOWING FROM MY VERY EARLY YEARS TKR-MSV.MY COUSIN WAS 2ND ACCORDIAN TO SG.MANGALAMURTHY WHO WAS IN VR TROOP.
  I also know PL.Sriramulu &Diwakar and many others in VR troops.They are all praise for Ramu(TKR)&he so sole brain behind the entire Music in VR films.
  TKR composition continued even in films around 27
  in nos which was relesed after August 1965 but came in the name of MSV.This will be evident if you hear the BGmusic after these songs,starting from NEE to CHANDROODAYAM.But MSV with help of
  Kannadasan(who was in Congress at 1965) did played dirty trick and put his name in all 27 films.Unforunately TKR who is master musician is not good in presentation &didn't use his good relations with MGR.It is bad state affair of Tamil
  Film which did not use the great musician TKR
  (grand son of Malkotai Govindaswami Pillai,a
  Great Violnist in ealy 20th century &son of KrishnaPillai,violnist in Govinraju Pillai's Troop)
  Chandrasekar.N
  MountPleasant,Michigan
  
  
• From: MRK Raju (@ 66.188.44.58) on: Tue Apr 15 15:22:42 EDT 2003
  
  I was a reccording assistant with CRS and then withTKR in VR troupe between 1947 to 1953.In mid 1949 MSV came to CRS to join his troup but CRS refused & it was TKR who took pity and forced CRS to take him.
  During those days CRS & TKR were very close &both had regards on each other.Genarally TKR will play the tunes in violin and CRS will approve and BGM swaras were mainly done by TKR.Though TKR was not named as asst.MD in titles he was next to CRS.When CRS died in 1951 TKR was shocked and before he could react MSV went in hurry to Banumathi &told he will compelete unfinished portion left by CRS,( it is different story that TKR had redo all MSV's tunes during BGM recording ,and ungrateful MSV did not include TKR name In title)
  CRS was totally unhappy about MSV signing for film GENNOVA since as per CRS ,MSV has no knowledce on musical composing and if CRS was alive for another month he would have sent him out.
  This is the reason why TKR was not keen to join wih MSV but NSK,ALS.GN Velumani &BS Ranga persuaded him to become a CO-MD.
  MSV knowing his shortcomings was very loyal to TKR.
  TKR will play tunes in violin and MSV will play the tunes to Producer/Directors and play back singers.All BGM swaras ,selection of instrument mix were by TKR and PRwork/showbusiness were by MSV.This was trend from1951 to August 1965.TKR was very poor in communication and in selling himself though his best MD in INDIA.
  Splilt came because of MSV's greedy/Kannadasan&CVSridhar"s enemity with TKR and not because of TKR's Alcholisim as mentioned by your Mr. Manisekaran.
  TKR , after 1960, started giving 1or2 tunes for selection to director because he is better judge of tunes and he will not give tunes for badly written lyrics(eg. Atamanathan's lyrics in film "Marakka MUdiyuma" which was latter written by "MK" ).TKR refused to change his tunes for film "Kadalikka Neramillai" as demanded by Sridhar.So Sridhar was unhappy with him .TKR refused to Finance for Kannadasan for his film "Karruppanam" and so he instigated MSV to
  spilit with TKR and promising to help him.He really helped him by applying his political pressure on all producers of 27 films for which tunes were compeleted and were under production to delete TKR"s name.This films were released between September 1965to1968,eg. "Chandrodayam".It is great loss to TKR from which he could not come out.
  MSV composed his first tune on his own,after "Gennova" in film "ANBEVAA",the last song and one for film Nadodi, His first full fledged music was in Balaji"s film Thangaikka in March 1967. This is the rason peple thought he is the origanal in VR but which is totally wrong.This eident from tunes composed after 1967.
  TKR is the MD and MSV is good PRO.
  
  
  

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