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Tamil music today : Ilayaraja's marked absence

Topic started by ramesh rajagopalan (@ 210.214.104.5) on Mon Aug 28 13:40:53 EDT 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I'd like to divide this query into 2 parts .

Tamil Music today :
Music in today's Tamil movies has been largely reduced to cacophony.Most songs ,in an attempt for fast paced music , are neither hummable nor melodious.Copying has become shamelessly rampant.
Devaa,raajkumar,vidyasaagar etc .wallowing at the bottom of the barrel are sorry excuses for music directors .For every good song these guys compose ...they compose / copy ten cacophonies. Songs copied from Titanic to Daler Mehndi make a person ( used to the melodies of Raaja and MSV . KVM sick to the heart ).
ARR is a source of relief . His scores are decent (though some have been copied ). His plagiarization is not as rampant as the others .
His scores especially for MR & Shankar really stand out .

Ilayaraja Sorely missed :
In such a sceanrio , the Maestro is sorely missed.I'd like to know why he composes music for so few movies these days.In a way it is good that he will not be overworked and maybe he can go on to compose some symphonies and instrumental albums.However my main query is why has IR's music scores in movies decreased ?Some of the top commercial hits these days have pathetic music and IR's movies inspite of having excellent songs are not making it big ...please comment




Does the audience really like such mediocre music ?? What ills plague the Tamil film music of today ? Guys please express ur self

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Responses:

• From: MS (@ 129.252.23.185) on: Mon Aug 28 18:00:35 EDT 2000
  
  Vidhyaasaagar needs to be excluded from your list, IMO.
  
  
• From: Swami (@ 63.22.249.85) on: Tue Aug 29 00:56:55 EDT 2000
  
  Its not only the music, the way in which it is delivered to us (pronunciation I mean), is even more horrible (there are a few englipeesh people who would love that delivery though). More than irritating to the core, it makes me sad about the plight of the next generation of music listeners have to go thro. Just look at the MD's the previous generations grew with,
  
  * G.Ramanathan, Ghantasala, S.V.Venkatraman
  * MSV, KVM
  * IR ( he ruled one full generation)
  * Deva, SAR, ARR ( he did give a fresh change, but it lead to the downfall of music ......IMHO)
  
  Just look at the singers. How many can you challenge and bet, for having perfect shruthi and giving a perfect delivery. Sans Unni everyone introduced by ARR are pain in the a*s. One thing we can pray for is, God save music.
  
  I'm happy with my "valai oosai kala kala vena....." and "putham puthu kaalai....". Atleast in TFM, let me be happy to live in the past, rather to dare to live in the present.
  
  
• From: nvd (@ 161.142.78.82) on: Tue Aug 29 01:09:31 EDT 2000
  
  Vidyasaagar can't be included in the Deva's series because VS also maintains originality in his music as ARR. Just that VS has no opportunity these days,,or else he could be in the p(a)lace of Deva or SAR and with much more clean music (IMHO).
  
  
• From: karthi (@ 63.15.178.73) on: Tue Aug 29 01:27:40 EDT 2000
  
  IR's music has nothing new or refreshing to offer and that's why it doesn't click any more.
  
  
• From: Vijay Venkatraman J (@ 202.9.164.244) on: Tue Aug 29 03:26:15 EDT 2000
  
  Dear Karthi,
  I suppose you are avoiding listening to Raja with pre-fixed ideas that He is not scoring good! I strongly oppose your stand and request you to listen to the following albums CAREFULLY and note how He comes hand in hand with today's generation:
  1)Kanna Unnai Thedugiren - Oorurangum Nerathil (If you don't like this song I am afrais you are not modern)
  2)Ilayavan - Nilavin Amudhu,En Jeevan,En Idhayam
  3)BHARATI - A Special Category
  4)Kannukkul Nilavu - You moderners must at least like Roja Poonthottam and Nilavupaattu
  5)Hey Ram - Is the stuff in this piece of music stale to you?
  I suppose I've given enough samples! So please be clear about what you are saying!
  
  Vijay.
  
  Please join Maestro Ilaiyaraaja Fans Club at:
  http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/maestroilaiyaraajafansclub
  
  
• From: Karthik S (@ 12.10.193.123) on: Tue Aug 29 04:59:33 EDT 2000
  
  I dont mean to demean IR, but the spark does wear out with age. Its bound to happen to the best of the best. ARR will become stale 10 to 15 years from now, or maybe even much earlier.
  
  Theres no point wallowing about why past leaders dont lead anymore. Its more sensible to change with the times and learn to appreciate newer trends. Of course, if you still wish to stubbornly stick to the bygone era, you always a have a rich bank of music left for us by IR, KVM, MSV and the likes. We can always listen to them and please ourselves.
  
  Why do people want them to come back and demean themselves. Case in point - Lata Mangeshkar. I think nuts like Jatin Lalit merely try to cash in on her name and use her. Her voice shows her age and it'd be a brilliant thing if she retired gracefully now. But JL are hell bent on defaming her by giving her more work. But its un-Indian to call her voice 'ageing'. You could be ridiculed for saying so, for she's a legend. Yes she's and she'll always be, but why do people forget stories like 'emperor's new clothes'?
  
  IR is better if he sticks to few good movies (with solid themes, like Sethu!) for which he can intelligently mould his music. But even in a movie like Kannukul Nilavu, I saw the spark reach its rock bottom in a song like 'oru naal oru kanavu' (IMHO - not generalising - please)...it sounded to me a like a nursery rhyme. I think sethu was his best album in recent days with every song being sculpted to perfection!
  
  Karthik
  
  
• From: Karthik S (@ 12.10.193.123) on: Tue Aug 29 05:03:31 EDT 2000
  
  Deva, Vidyasagar and Adityan can come up with decent stuff provided they work with a decent director. Vidyasagar's score for Bharathiraja's Pasumpon was damn good. So was Deva'a score for BR's Tamilselvan. Adityan occasionally comes with some good scores but mostly falters. I'd not blame the composers - I'd rather blame the directors who keep on churning oldish nonsense in the name of movies.
  
  Its the director's vision which is limiting these compoers to being mere copy cats ot cacophony masters.
  
  Karthik
  
  
• From: Subbu (@ 192.39.71.67) on: Tue Aug 29 09:51:30 EDT 2000
  
  Karthik,
  
  I am pained to read your mails in many threads criticising IR. Though it was ok listening to a different viewpoint, now you seem to be reaching the limits.
  
  I strongly object to your chosen example; 'Oru naal oru kanavu' - It's a beautiful song - with an amazing chord/arpeggio progression, superb melody and the matchless IR style interludes.
  
  Digression:
  And your comparision to a Nursery rhyme sounds immature. I would say 'Chinna Chinna Aasai' in Roja is also N.R. like tune but a beautiful one. Before you start belittling N.R. next time, pls listen to a child. 'Kuzhal inithu... Yaazh inithu enbaar....'
  
  
  
• From: kk (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Tue Aug 29 10:01:08 EDT 2000
  
  subbu, you are right. its a great song.
  only KJs was jarring in it IMHO.
  
  
• From: STS (@ 208.222.192.2) on: Tue Aug 29 13:34:43 EDT 2000
  
  Karthik S,
  
  You sound childish when you say Oru Naal Oru Kanavu is like N.R. I believe it is the best song in the movie. I start wondering about the new definition for music, TFM lovers trying to give.
  
  
• From: s arun (@ 195.107.47.196) on: Tue Aug 29 17:08:15 EDT 2000
  
  Dear Mr.Karthi,
  
  Do you intend sparking of another row by writing something as silly as 'the spark does wear out with age'?
  You also sound immature when you compare something physical(Latha Mangeshkar's vocal cords) with something which is not physical (IR's musical abilities). In one of my earlier threads(IR vs ARR) last year, I had pointed out that music is a very subjective thing & everyone is different in their perception of music. Hence it's sad that, to your auditory cortex(area of brain involved in hearing) a good song sounds like a nursery rhyme.
  May I also vehemently remind you that current-status in film world has got nothing to do with your real abilities(be it music or anything else)
  
  
• From: KITKAT (@ 203.106.109.76) on: Tue Aug 29 20:39:29 EDT 2000
  
  Kuzal inidhu ----- tham makkal mazalai sol kelaadhaar.
  Why do u want to force us to adopt only IR's music as our child's mazalai. Any TFM for that matter is our child"s mazalai. Why only IR's ?
  
  
• From: Theva (@ 207.245.235.134) on: Tue Aug 29 23:07:15 EDT 2000
  
  There is no use in talkin' about ARR and IR in this group, nor give a little criticism 'bout IR. Bcoz no one in here will accept it.
  
  Datz what I've learned at newtfmpage.
  
  
• From: Karthik S (@ 12.10.193.123) on: Tue Aug 29 23:42:30 EDT 2000
  
  Folks...
  
  Even the most hard core ARR fan would agree that IR's songs till about 1990 were absolute gems. Its only that we have a problem with his present day compositions. The so-called childishness in my statement is again in the eye of the beholder! I could call you childish for not trying to see my point and act stubborn - like a child! But I'm not in for a IR vs ARR fight. I have grown up with IR's brilliant music but I also find it inappropriate in today's world. It does sound a bit outdated to me.
  
  And thats what I had expressed the way I feel it. I pretty well understand that this group is full of HCIRF, so theres hardly any point in even talking about IR in the slightest negative way...but as I always claim...people should NOT forget the story of the king who roamed the streets naked and when a child pointed out that he was indeed nude, everybody else started to realise it too. So its just a matter of time before IR or Lata reach such a position. I think they are digging their own grave.
  
  On the other hand Raja is doing a REALLY god thing with his project to create a music research foundation. With his immense knowledge of music, gained over the years, he could bring about a new wave of musical understanding in today's generation - and not try hard to please them with his present filmi compositions.
  
  Karthik
  
  
• From: future_man (@ 136.206.35.10) on: Wed Aug 30 05:39:32 EDT 2000
  
  Dear Karthik,
  
  Please stop ....all nonsense threads!
  Either make something interesting to comment
  or better be a silent reader!
  
  
• From: Subbu (@ 192.39.71.67) on: Wed Aug 30 06:10:58 EDT 2000
  
  future_man : Your request seems to be pretty decent and straight forward.
  
  Karthik - I restrict myself not to react to your 'grave' stuff etc. But pls consider future_man's request before IR listens to you.
  
  
• From: Karthik S (@ 12.10.193.123) on: Wed Aug 30 06:46:26 EDT 2000
  
  Futureman and Subbu,
  
  If you cannot take criticism (I was being as polite as possible, cos I respect IR as a human immensely), I think you should be the one to leave the thread.
  
  Nobody forced you to read thru the criticism that boils your blood so much...hey as someone else noted, music is a matter of personal opinion...and I posted my opinion based on what the thread was all about.
  
  This is about Ilayaraja's marked absence. I was just trying to point out that it is not by choice but is actually forced upon him. If you cant see sense in it, fine, I have no issues. You are entitled to your opinion as much as I'm to mine. But we start such threads to explain ourselves to others...as to why we think the way we think...But dont go on asking people who dont agree with you to shut their mouths. How many can you shut? You'll keep shutting every mouth till you reach ur grave!
  
  Now thats fanatism for you. Learn some patience and some logic, so that you can retaliate with sense. Shutting my mouth wont help you much.
  
  That reminds me of Thanthai Periyar...he was a staunch atheist...so when somebody confronted him with the question "what would you have to say if somebody proves tomorrow that god indeed exists? where will you hide your shameful face?"....Periyar was absolutely cool and said "I dont have to hide my face in shame my friend. I'll simply agree that god exists, after my contention today is that since nobody has been able to prove it I believe god doesnt exist. After a proof whats the point in denying it?"
  
  Criticism is necessary to examine your own beliefs.
  
  Karthik
  
  

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