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Is TFM in a vicious cycle of degeneration?

Topic started by rajaG (@ 208.24.179.211) on Tue Sep 26 15:43:14 EDT 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I have checked the archives and for some reason a topic with a similar heading is gone!
So here's is some food for thought.

1. Actors like Ajith, Vijay, etc commanding MDs to copy from "English CDs" and set them to Indian lyrics.
2. MDs like Deva, Sirpi copying left, right and center, in situations excluding item 1 above.
3. Bad pronunciation of singers.
4. MDs like SAR repeating the same tune over and over and over......you get the point (and many times in the same film)
5. ARR not putting any effort in re-recording at all- merely playing the songs in the movie with slower/faster versions.
6. ARR, Srikanth (Deva's son), etc blatantly indulging in lip-synch activities. Other lesser known artists, engaged in karaoke singing. While this does not directly affect TFM it speaks for the lack of confidence in the talents of the artists.
7. Many occurences of really stupid lyrics - though most of them may be blamed on the director/producers adamant insistence or same boring situations.
8. Absence of thespians who could inspire Kannadasan, TMS, SPB, PS etc to give their best.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Sharma (@ 61.6.38.132) on: Mon Feb 24 20:16:36 EST 2003
  
  Kiru, why is my posting not relevant to this thread? The question this thread asks is "Is TFM in a vicious cycle of degeneration?" and my answer is "No, it is not." Is that too difficult to understand or are you actually annoyed that I am upsetting convention here?
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Mon Feb 24 20:55:42 EST 2003
  
  Sharma..I have a different opinion from that of yours. I gave some specific points why I think so (ICM and WCM techniques not used in songs). If you can take a song and explain the nuances to me, I can try to see your point. Note, I jumped into the discussion only in the context of mythila mentioning the raagams etc.
  Good or bad song is a subjective thing. So the only way to assess quality, is through technical analysis.
  
  
• From: suresh (@ 202.88.155.34) on: Tue Feb 25 00:08:07 EST 2003
  
  Udhaya
  Interesting selection. I second your comments on HJ, "Aagaya Sooriyanai" literally opened my ears to his precocious talent and I've now run through his repertoire that suggests high promise and lot more than the tag of an ARR clone. We can expect more from him for sure..
  
  Heard Sirpi's "Varushamellam Vasantham", and VS "ALLi thantha vAnam? I think they're worthy additions to your list. I'm also curious to know what you think of ARR's "Azhage Sugama" from ParthAle Paravasam. I've long been fascinated by "manmatha maasam" from this film, but to me this duet epitomises ARR's trend of "lyric aesthetics" - I get the feeling that the lyrics have been crafted (never mind their innate quality) to just-fit the music and singing so seamlessly, it's almost like he plays around with these elements like the layers in (Adobe) Photoshop.
  
  
  
• From: Raj (@ 196.12.48.184) on: Tue Feb 25 07:38:05 EST 2003
  
  Udhaya
  Very interesting to note that not even one of the songs from "En Mana Vaanil", "Ramana" , "Solla Marantha Kadhai" have appealed to you.
  Wonder if like HCIRF'slook for the IR-tag in the cassette before appreciating a song, you specifically look for a non-IR tag.
  
  I wouldnt have posted here because I find the atmosphere in this DF nauseating but seeing your name tempted me to post. If you can put your mail-id, I would rather mail you.
  BTW, Remember me?
  
  
• From: Raj (@ 196.12.48.184) on: Tue Feb 25 07:38:32 EST 2003
  
  Oops.. didint notice your mail-id is already there!
  
  
• From: Raj (@ 196.12.48.184) on: Tue Feb 25 07:47:03 EST 2003
  
  udhaya
  One more query.. what's your take on "Album"?
  
  
• From: mythila (@ 137.237.13.20) on: Tue Feb 25 10:25:30 EST 2003
  
  I recently heard Anbesivam songs. They are good. I also like a song from 5 Star (thiru thiruda is very appealing.)VS is one to watch out for after his 'Un samailyal araiyil' in Dil and 'Kannale meiya meiya' in ATVaanam.
  His 'ore manam' from Villain , though melodious , is not very fresh , where he has used his favourite Dharbari kanada again (traces of Malare mounama and kaatre from Rythm are evident).
  Harris arrested me with Vaseegara number and mudhal kanave in majnu. But his 12B 'poove vai pesum ' charanam is a direct lift from ARR's 'jennal kaatragivaa' song which turned me off after the high expectations he created.
  Iam sure many would agree with me that the lovely kalyani raaga based number' Neengatha nenjam onru' song in Vidiyum varai kaathiru and 'Anandam Anandam nee thandadu' from pootaada pootukkal are second to none of the songs Udayaa has listed.
  Infact 'Anandam anandam nee thandadu' song is a subject by itself .
  Today's songs have lots of novel sound, intelligently crafted lyrics, very good vocal support , foot tapping rythm, techical sophistication .
  Whether they have a haunting quality is something which only time can tell.Again this word 'haunting' is very subjective.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 66.81.130.192) on: Tue Feb 25 12:38:31 EST 2003
  
  Raj,
  Sure I remember you. I honestly haven't heard any IR song that grabbed me since, TIME and Bharathy. If you or others take that as a bias, I can't help that. Although, why would I hate the father and enjoy so many songs by the son? Karthik Raja is another that hasn't really lived up in my estimation. I liked a few tracks from "Ullam Kollai Poaguthae", and a few from 'Ullaasam" long before that.
  
  mythila,
  Haunting quality is indeed very subjective. My aim is not to force my opinion on others or change others' POV. I just offer the worthy stuff out there as an alternative to exalting the past and dissing the present. I won't harass you for your taste nor do you have to justify it for me. Thanks for considering some of the songs in my list. All I'm suggesting (not preaching mind you) is if you give some of the new stuff a chance, you are likely to be surprised. If you're unwilling to even consider new stuff, it's really no one else's loss.
  
  
• From: Kalpana (@ 203.94.234.14) on: Tue Feb 25 13:28:55 EST 2003
  
  " MDs like Deva, Sirpi copying left, right and center, in situations excluding item 1 above"
  
  I would like to know why and how these guys are succesful.During MSV and IR's period were there MD's like deva who blatantly copied and were successful ? veda,chandra bose,shankar ganesh etc.Is deva the most profilic among the current MD's ? If he is,i am afraid that does not augur well for TFM.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 66.81.130.192) on: Tue Feb 25 13:34:38 EST 2003
  
  suresh,
  When I first read your post, I thought you were being sarcastic, however unsuccessfully. Then I reread and decided to give you the benefit of the doubt. The thing that threw me at first was your comment about adding Sirpi to my list as well as Alli Thandha Vaanam which is not one of VS' best. And you went on to credit ARR's knack for picking lyrics for songs like "Manmatha Maasam," which has the words "manmatha maasam" repeated in various ways stretched and pulled like a cartoon animal for most of the song.
  
  In case it was an attempt at sarcasm, ARR wasn't alone here either. IR has done it in the song "Ninaivellaam Nithya", MSV has done it in the song "Ninaithaalae Inikkum," but Maragathamani bested all of them with "Nivedha" from "Nee Paathi Naan Paathi." The song has only one word, "Nivetha" and is executed in an extravaganza by SPB. SPB builds a swara maaligai with that one word.
  
  Coming back to your queries about "Paarthaen Rasiththaen". I liked only "Manmatha Maasam" from that movie. "Azhagae Sugama" is now one of many ARR numbers with the aching solitude of the male voice set to spare music.
  
  Thiru,
  I forgot to have you mention other good songs that you think I missed in my list. I was only going by what I have heard and found in the internet over the past few months. Please do add to what's good out there. Thanks.
  
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 66.81.130.192) on: Tue Feb 25 13:45:23 EST 2003
  
  Kalpana,
  You've named the three prime copycats of the past: veda, chandra bose, and Shankar-Ganesh, though all three gave some memorable originals. Deva was hot for a 5-year period post Annamalai. The past few years he has surely been relegated to the second or third tier. YSR and VS are hottest now closely followed by HJ, Barathwaj, and a host of others. IR and ARR have become seasonal players in TFM. Sirpi may very well have become a real life sirpi in the streets of Mahabalipuram, who knows?
  
  
• From: Thiru (@ 168.166.80.205) on: Tue Feb 25 14:27:36 EST 2003
  
  udhaya, What I listen to is what others tell me that its worth listening.. with the amount of movies getting released and the number of music directors in the TFM scene now, its not possible to listen to each and every song and judge it in one listening.. when HNRAI audio was released, i heard it a couple of times and termed it as rubbish.. I didnt listen to it for until last month when I watched the movie... and now it looks like a good album to me... but same is not the case with every album... I listened to April Madhathil several times but it doesnt grow over me.. Coming to the point, i agree to your point that 'if you give some of the new stuff a chance, you are likely to be surprised'.. at the same time, I feel that we are left with no other option but to listen to some of the sub standard songs like 'gemini gemini', 'dhool', 'kadhal pisase' etc... some of the MDS (to some extent IR & ARR included) have exploited our weakness to accept whatever they compose, be it copied, inspired or re-created... though i dont expect each and every movie to have 1 good song atleast, I do expect atleast one in 2 new movies.. You have listed a lot of songs, and most of them I havent even heard... not sure whether all the songs you have listed might be to my liking... but i will now have a second thought before pressing my remote when any of these songs are played...
  Some of the recent songs which were really good as someone poined out, 'Album' by KR is missing... 'pillai thamarai' is really a good song and the beginning of 'Kaadhal vaanoli' is good as well... 'Bala' had one or two good songs..
  
  
• From: raja m (@ 24.44.133.72) on: Tue Feb 25 14:36:00 EST 2003
  
  Udhaya:
  
  C'mon man Vaadi Vaadi from Alli Thandha Vaanam is a great one from VS. Prabhudeva was the perfect fit for the song.. listen to it again :-)
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 66.81.130.192) on: Tue Feb 25 14:41:14 EST 2003
  
  raja m,
  Okay, I will give it another try.
  
  
• From: s0 (@ 63.246.174.232) on: Tue Feb 25 18:57:46 EST 2003
  
  Udhaya, your approach to music is nearly utopian for me to achieve. It seems almost impossible for me not to attatch myself to a particular artist and expect a lot out of him/her. especially after reading newtfmpage for some years. you are gifted.
  kiru is right. It is extremely difficult not to become opinionated.
  
  kiru, my views:
  It is like tennis. I've been a great fan of Sampras for many years now. now, even if I watch the greatest of games by Hewitt et al, I wouldn't go beyond exclaiming "Ahh. that's a good shot" or "Nice passing shot/volley". No pin-up posters or near-death experiences during tense matches!! Maybe this is a transitionary period and I'll really cling on to someone . Till then, I'll stick to watching famous old games or other old ones that I haven't seen. Those are as good as new to me.
  Similarly, I do really like some recent albums. Songs in Parthale Paravasam, Alavandhan, Manadhi Thirudi Vittai, Nandha, Album, Bala, SMK, KV.. are in my recent collections. But, I don't feel the same way with YSR, Vidhyasagar.. as I felt with IR, early-ARR. some songs like Vaseegara made me sit up and notice. but they were few and far in-between.
  Some of the old songs that I come across in these pages are totally new to me. I'm content with listening to them for now, building a good collection of those, expanding to MFM, HFM etc..
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Tue Feb 25 20:47:21 EST 2003
  
  s0..I know what you mean. I catalog my music collection artiste wise. But I go more by style. One of the music trends that I dont like nowadays is the snobbery in the so-called 'cool' music. I am critical of certain cultural degradation as portrayed in some gaana songs. Still I like mustafa mustafa and gaana songs like 'anna nagar aandAlu, ayanavaram gopalu. ICF edukkaraan dhandAlu. To me, gaana, is a genre, that if nurtured well, has lot of potential to grow. If you are a chennaiite, you know that ICF is between anna nagar and ayanavaram and there is really an 'outdoor gym' where people go to do their exercise. I did. If I remember right there is dog 'kennel' as well and the track is used by ICF sports people for tranining.
  
  I am also getting into MFM, with constant egging on by my wife. I got a CD with Punyam+Kochu Kochu Santhoshangal. Very good music purchase that I ever made recently.
  
  

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