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Kannadhaasan Vs. Vairamuthu TFM Symposium Topic 5: Nagaichchuvai Paadalgal

Topic started by Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on Mon Aug 3 20:53:03 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

For a good understanding of how to approach this ongoing symposium, please refer to the thread, "Kannadhaasan Vs. Vairamuthu TFM Symposium Topic 1:Iyarkai Varnanai" before you post. Let me reiterate that this is not a patti mandram, but
a research symposium.
Please show TFM examples of both poets with regards to just their Nagaichchuvai Paadalgal for this thread. Please provide the name of the song whose lines you excerpt and the name of the movie if known. Here are the symposium categories, the bold topics are yet to be discussed:
1)Iyarkai Varnanai
2)Kaadhal Paadalgal
3)Thaththuva Paadalgal
4)Vaarthai Prayoagam
5)Nagaichchuvai Paadalgal
6)Samudhaaya Seerthirutha / Puratchi Paadalgal
7)Vingyaana/Naveena Karuthoottum Paadalgal
8)Ilakkiya Moolam Ulla Paadalgal
9)Kadhaikku Porundhiya Paadalgal(situational songs)
10)Kavidhai Milekarkal (Poetic Milestones that the poets will be remembered by!)

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Responses:

• From: ss (@ 206-232-14.iptr.aol.com) on: Mon Aug 3 21:17:21 EDT 1998
  
  "Aattukutti Muttai ittu Kozhi kunju" nice song by KD.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Mon Aug 3 21:22:01 EDT 1998
  
  VM has always shown his lighter side when the song and situation allowed it. Kannadhaasan's list here will be a great revelation for me, I can only think of one or two by him for this category.
  
  Song: Pournami Neram; Movie: Paalaivanachchoalai
  In this song, a bunch of out of work graduates celebrate the new year on the terrace of one of their homes. The singer pokes fun at his friends
  by exaggerating their personalities to comic effect:
  
  pournami neram paavai oruththi minnal polae munnaal ponaal
  pinnal kandu pinnaal sendru ponnu oorukku pudhuso endraen
  kaalil ullathu pudhusu endraal po maelae kaetkaathae
  . . .
  vaanoliyil naadagaththil
  oomai vaedam poattavan
  aamaiyidam thoatravan
  engal veeran
  
  raaman vaedam poattaalum
  rendu seethai kaetpaanae
  rendu seethai vandhaalum
  soorpanagai paarppaanae
  . . .
  payyil ulla ettanaavai
  paththu murai ennuvaan
  saththamindri ennuvaan
  kanja raaja
  
  thaen nilavae poanaalum
  thaniyaaiththaanae poavaanae
  uppu illai endraalum
  kanneer vittuk kolvaanae
  
  
  
• From: Prakash Balakrishnan (@ gate2.ca.us.ibm.com) on: Tue Aug 4 12:33:24 EDT 1998
  
  Udhaya...
  There is a dispute I raised in Part 4 itself..
  Once everyone discuss about that then we will continue this Part.
  
  Sorry about that...
  
  If you still feel that I was wrong then continue this topic.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Tue Aug 4 13:15:50 EDT 1998
  
  Prakash, there is no dispute there. You clearly stated your judgement based on what was gathered in that topic. I appreciate that. If enough people side with you, then we will proclaim your poet as the winner in that category. That is how this symposium works, I don't get hand out judgements on my own. I just give my own summation at the end of each topic. So did you and so can everybody. Until now, all topics have come to surprisingly unanimous decisions, but topic 4 could very well come to a full debate which should be interesting. I think we can simultaneously go on with both topics 4 and 5, since 4 should conclude soon.
  
  
• From: Prakash Balakrishnan (@ gate7.ca.us.ibm.com) on: Tue Aug 4 15:37:02 EDT 1998
  
  Udhaya,
  "your poet", "My poet" ellam kidaiyadhu. I also pointed out good songs of VM. Same way you also mentioned lot of KaNNadhasan songs.
  
  OK.. come to the subject....
  here some good "Nagaichuvai PaadalgaL" from kaNNadhasan...
  
  1.varavu ettaNa selavu pathaNa adhigam iraNdaNa kadaisiyil thunthaNa...
  
  2.viswanathan vElai vENdum, visvanathan vElai vENdum,
  madimElE madi katti kodi kodi sethuvaikkum seemanE...,
  
  3.kadhalikka N-eramillai kadhalippar yarumillai......
  
  4.seettu kattu raja, raja, ooty malai roja, rosaaa.
  
  mElum paadalgaaL thodarum...
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Tue Aug 4 15:57:25 EDT 1998
  
  Prakash,
  I just said "your poet" to save the suspense and not give away who you proclaimed the winner in Topic 4. Anyway, please check my response in Topic 4 as well.
  
  
• From: Raman (@ 28.houston-18-19rs.tx.dial-access.att.net) on: Tue Aug 4 16:27:39 EDT 1998
  
  Varavu Ettana Selavu Pathana was written by vaali.
  
  
• From: Raman (@ 28.houston-18-19rs.tx.dial-access.att.net) on: Tue Aug 4 16:34:47 EDT 1998
  
  Hello Udhaya I hope you have good collection of
  vairamuthu's songs.
  Please note one thing. Vairamuthu's songs had the great music of Ilayaraja (atleast 75% of them).
  Ilayaraja can score as many as 30 tunes for one song of vairamuthu.
  Whereas Kannadasan can pen as many as 30 songs for one tune of any music director.
  Kavithaikku Ilakkanam Kannadasan.
  Don't even attempt to compare vairamuthu with that great Poet.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Tue Aug 4 17:04:25 EDT 1998
  
  Raman,
  As you can see the attempt has begun and is very well succeeding to this point. Surprisingly many of us here love Thamizh more than we like Kannadhaasan. Thamizh oruvanukku mattum sondham ennum nambikkaikku naangal vidhivilakku. Maybe you don't want to mingle with us objective weirdos, I understand.
  
  
• From: kiruba (@ slipper.watcom.on.ca) on: Tue Aug 4 23:46:17 EDT 1998
  
  This is in reply to Raman.
  
  I had the impression Kannadhasan wrote the songs and later they were set to music.
  Whereas Vairamuthu had to write to Ilayaraja's tune. I thought this was cited as one of the reasons for the good quality of lyrics in old songs.
  
  But you seem to present the story other way. Even though I think Kannadhasan is great. I feel Vairamuthu had to work with these constraints.
  
  Correct me if I am wrong.
  - kiruba
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ sf-dnpqb-125.compuserve.net) on: Wed Aug 5 02:34:10 EDT 1998
  
  It is a well known fact that KD loved a challenge and all the difficult sandhams dished out by MDs would be met with a flurry of words ( in MSVs, IRs words varthaigal avarukku vanthu vizhum). Most of the songs in Policekaran magal, nenjil ore aalayam , nenjam marappadillai etc had tunes composed first and then the lyrics written by KD .
  
  Thanks
  
  
• From: Prakash Balakrishnan (@ gate3.ca.us.ibm.com) on: Wed Aug 5 13:48:08 EDT 1998
  
  Sriram,
  
  Not only the films you mentioned. KaNNadhasan prefer to do "Paattukku Mettu". He did that for many movies and songs. But KaNNadhasan is capable of handling both Paattukku Mettu & Mettukku Pattu.
  
  OK come to the point...
  Few more KaNNadhasan N-agaichchuvaip paadalgaL
  
  porandhaalum pombaLaiya porakkakudathu...(Policekaran magaL)
  
  AvaL:-jigu, jigu N-aan engine,
  Avan:-dagu, dagu N-aan vaaNdi
  AvaL:-engine vegam illamiyin vEgam en pinallE thodaradhE
  Avan:-engine mattum rail-aagathu, ennai vittu pogathE...
  
  unga ponnana kaigaL puNNagalaama?
  udhavikku varalaama? samatham varuma?
  ohi, sandhEgam thaana???.... from kadhalikka N-eramillai
  
  kaadhal enbadhu edhu varai?
  kalyaaNa kaalam varum varai.
  kalyaaNam enbadhu edhu varai
  kazhuthila thali vizhum varai...(From pEN??)
  
  What about the Sirippu song sung by NSK in the film "Raja Rani"... is it by KaNNadhasan??
  
  Some VM songs
  
  oorvasi, oorvasi...
  Take it easy policy...
  vazhaiyil vellavE vaaLibam...
  
  senthamizh N-aattu thamizhachiyE sEla udututha thayangiriyE...
  
  Odakkara marimuththu, otta vaai marimuththu oorukkuLa vayasu pasanga sowkiyama???.....
  
  BTW please discuss about the N-agaichchuvaip padalgaL in this part. We will do other discussions after all the 10 topics are over. What do you all say??
  
  mElum padalgaL vaarum..
  
  KaaNamal ponavar pattriya arivippu...
  
  1. Sathyakumar(Bones)
  Miga Nagaichuvaiyayai ezhuthuvaar. kadandha sila N-attkaLaga ivaraik KaaNavillai. Deva-vai ivarukku Miga pidikkum.
  
  2. Ramki
  Ivarum oru kiNdal peRvazhi. KByin Rasigar, Deva-vaiyum pidukkum. Michigan, USA-il irukkiraar. TFM enbadhu ivarukku alwa sapiduvathu pol. Ivarukku TFM-Encylopedia endru oru patt peyarum uNdu. Ivarai pala N-attkaLagak KaNNavillai..
  
  iruvaraiyum kaNNdu pidiththu izhuththu vaarungaL..(Sanmanam ellam kidaiyadhu :):):))....
  
  kaaNamal poona innum silar...
  Kanchana, Sathya Keerthi (Indiavukku poittarnu therikiradhu), Rajaraman (Romba N-aatkaLagavE kaNNavillai.. velai endru saljappu:):):))
  
  
  
• From: Prakash Balakrishnan (@ gate4.ca.us.ibm.com) on: Wed Aug 5 15:19:48 EDT 1998
  
  innum sila KaNNadhasan paadalgaL
  
  pattikaada? pattaNama? ReNdum kettaan lakshaNama?? .... from Mattukaara VElan
  
  ennadi rakkama pallaku N-ELippu en N-enju kulunguthadi.... from Pattikaadaa? PattaNamaa?
  
  from Siruppu to Azhugai...
  
  kadavuL amaiththu vaiththa mEdai iNNaikkum KalYaaNa maalai.... from avaL oru thodar kadhai
  
  Jr, Jr.. iru manam koNda thirumaNa vazhvil idaiyinil N-ee yEn mayangu kiraarai??... from AvargaL
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Bharat (@ isdbsd1-inet.ci.mil.wi.us) on: Wed Aug 5 17:17:59 EDT 1998
  
  In Jeans, VM takes the comic route to illustrate the Americanization of a pAAtti:
  
  vArAyO thOzhi vArAyO thOzhi
  vAA vandhu lOOttiyadi
  vAAliba thOzhi vayasAAna thOzhi
  my veettu sweety adi
  .
  .
  computer pAAttukku karagAttam neeyAdu
  MTV channelil shahshtikkavacham nee pAdu
  
  and so on.
  
  In kAdhalan, he writes about everything from ration problems to love problems in rap form:
  
  pEttai rap...
  oraNNa reNdaNNA
  kadana gidana vaangi
  aNda guNda adagu vachu...
  
  In punnagai mannan, he writes quasi-slapstick lyrics for a Chaplin vs. Chaplin encounter:
  
  mAmAvukku kudumaa kudumaa
  aRai oNNe oNNu...
  .
  ennappOl mEEsai vachchAn pollAdha AALu
  pOOnaikkum mEEsai uNdu ennaannu kElu
  
  In Gentleman, he gives up on women thus:
  
  nAAnga jeans pant thaan pOttAAkka
  nEEnga baggy pantu-thaan pAAppEEnga
  etc
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Wed Aug 5 17:39:48 EDT 1998
  
  Bharat, I have heard that "pettai rap" was written by the director, Shankar. Any confirmations?
  
  

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