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FUSION Music in TFM

Topic started by Deepu (@ pc109.renewal-iis.com) on Wed Jun 17 09:10:17 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

TFM Music directors have the unique advantage of using FUSION Music. IR and ARR have knowledge in both Western and Indian Classical music. ARR is the one who uses this technique quite often these days. IR is great in fusing Western Classical and Carnatic music. What do you think folks? Is is a good sign for TFM? Don't you think this will bring World Music to every village in India? We have the unique advantage of knowing both worlds of music unlike Hollywood Composers. Tabala and Mridangam samplers are being used in lot Hollywood movies and commercials recently. TFM has a lot of songs with this technique being used.
1. Background score from the movie 'VEEDU' (How to name it)
2. Poove Sem Poove , un vaasam vaarum ( Yesudoss/IR's score)
3. En Veetul Thottathil ( Gentleman)
4. Margazhi Poove ( May Maadham)

and many many more...

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Anand mahadevan (@ 205.147.245.41) on: Fri Jun 19 12:29:19 EDT 1998
  
  raja,
  The point I was referring about L.shankar is that his fusion exposition is'nt convincing.I have a few tapes of his fusion stuff and the music does'nt blend.I recently bought a tape which had L.shankar attempting to fuse western and Carnatic and it sounded awfull.He might be great violinist but his experimentaion with fusion does'nt match his other skills.
  Also the so called "Jugalbandhis" are to say the least nice to listen but technically they do'nt have anything to boast off.They clearly sound distinct and do'nt gel with one another.This where I am stunned with IR.He is able to absolutely fuse diff kind of musical forms and
  it gels great."how to name it" is a great example.
  Anand
  
  
• From: Deepu (@ pc109.renewal-iis.com) on: Fri Jun 19 13:09:58 EDT 1998
  
  Sundari Neeyum - Sundaran Nyannum ( Mich-Madan-Kam-Rajan) is an excellent example of IR's Carnatic-Western fusion. Fusion music is like Client-Server Technology in the Computer field. Best of both worlds.
  
  
• From: S.Suresh (@ dwarpal.wipsys.soft.net) on: Mon Jun 22 01:10:17 EDT 1998
  
  Sree,
  
  I will try to give you the list of articles tommorrow.
  
  
• From: sree (@ orchid.cs.concordia.ca) on: Mon Jun 22 10:10:05 EDT 1998
  
  S.Suresh:
  Thank you.
  sree
  
  
• From: Sundar (@ pm1-233.phl.infi.net) on: Mon Jun 29 09:05:50 EDT 1998
  
  Hmm,
  
  How about Ilayaraja fusing Dvorak with TFM ?
  
  "chittukkuruvi vekka paduthe
  pettaikkuruvi solli tharuthe"
  
  Or is that another thread ? ;)
  
  Sundar
  
  
• From: Arun Prakash (@ 1cust218.tnt2.det2.da.uu.net) on: Tue Jun 30 18:26:46 EDT 1998
  
  To all,
  
  What do you mean by FUSION MUSIC? Is it just using a rhythm box with some base patterns on the keyboard with the voice singing some carnatic scale? example AanadhaBhairavi. It has become unfortunate that any song with Aandhabhairavi raga phrases with the "SO CALLED" Fusion Orchestration does become a hit.This cannot be labeled as "FUSION MUSIC". I would rather call it as "FASHION MUSIC". The father of real Fusion Music is the one and only IR. IR is the only "complete composer" who is completely proficient in all forms of music including Western Classical, Rock and Roll, Western Pop,Indian Carnatic and Hindustani. His blend of Western Chord Progression,Counterpoints with our Carnatic Raga moods which was something Phenomenal which anybody in the past did not think of.The whole TFM world was stunned in 1977 when IR came out with numbers like "Andhapurathil oru Maharani" from Deepam sung by TMS and SJ in the raga Mayamayavagowla with the background interludes being perfectly fusioned with Western notes and Indian Melodies. The way he arranged music for Chinna Kannan Azhaikiran (SJ) version in Reethi Gowla is something that nobody could have imagined.That too particularly for a raga like reethi gowla.
  
  The examples that is given above is just a sample for IR's Fusion brain.
  
  
  Arun Prakash.
  
  
  
• From: buddy (@ panorama.nus.edu.sg) on: Tue Jun 30 21:09:24 EDT 1998
  
  Hi,
  
  I beleive that one of the best Fusion in TFM is Mappilaiku Maman Manasu from Netri Kann by IR.
  
  Its amazing.
  
  
• From: Raswan. (@ 2cust40.tnt2.det1.da.uu.net) on: Wed Jul 1 17:12:00 EDT 1998
  
  Hi friends and Fanatics of IR,
  
  Can you please stop praising IR for a while. I still feel IR did many things because he had lot of technical aspects which the yesteryear MD's lacked. No doubt IR is good. But he is not a genius compared to yesteryears MD's. Mr. Arun prakash has written that in the past no music director did think of what raaja has given. I cannot accept that point since given the facilities and techincal aspects any yesteryear's MD could have performed as or more than what IR had done. If anyone says IR is a supreme composer then it is shame on all those yesteryears MD's who had us in Melody for the past 30 to 40 years. Is IR technically supreme? He did not have any competition from his contemporaries. If any yesteryears music director who passed away when raaja came to the field had competed with raaja then surely IR would have had a stiff competition.The timing was perfect for raaja. that was his Luck. As for Fusion music there were MD's like G.Ramanathan who created a magic by creating song like "Yaaradi Nee Mohini" as mentioned by Mr.Srikanth.
  
  Folks I like to listen to IR but too much praises on IR makes me feel that all the great music meastro's of yesteryears and their phenomenal hard work has been reduced to dust by one Raaja?
  
  It is a fact that I can't accept at all. Raaja ruled for 20 years.Now allow someone to come to the forefront and let us hear some good music by a new talent (KR etc.)
  
  Enough of Raaja please.
  Thanks
  
  Raswan.
  
  
• From: buddy (@ panorama.nus.edu.sg) on: Wed Jul 1 21:29:38 EDT 1998
  
  Raswan,
  
  This topic is about fusion and evryone has every right to express their views.
  
  U can't ask others to stop talking about IR.
  
  
  
• From: Arun Prakash (@ 2cust46.tnt2.det1.da.uu.net) on: Wed Jul 1 22:41:51 EDT 1998
  
  Buddy,
  
  Do not worry. Just ignore this Raswan and go ahead.
  
  They have not understood IR's music and his understanding of fusion. I will come with more details since I do not have time.
  
  
  
• From: Arvind Kumar (@ 38.29.70.126) on: Thu Jul 2 01:03:55 EDT 1998
  
  Mr Arun Prakash,
  
  how come yours and Raswan's email address is same.
  
  
• From: buddy (@ synergy.nus.edu.sg) on: Thu Jul 2 02:42:06 EDT 1998
  
  Mr. Arunprakash alias Raswan,
  
  What's this all about.
  
  Goin nuts......
  
  
  
• From: arun prakash (@ 1cust140.tnt2.det1.da.uu.net) on: Thu Jul 2 08:09:23 EDT 1998
  
  Dear Aravind & buddy,
  please don't confuse yourself.Raswan & myself are not the same.both of us stay in the same house.should we not have different opinions?.dont worry go ahead
  
  
• From: Prakash Balakrishnan (@ gate3.ca.us.ibm.com) on: Thu Jul 2 16:27:43 EDT 1998
  
  out of Topic...
  So,
  Arun Prakash & Raswan... There will always some kind of Stromy,Tornado situation in your home...:):):)!!!!
  
  
• From: rjay (@ 204.220.169.94) on: Fri Jul 3 05:40:33 EDT 1998
  
  By same house, did you mean same brain?
  
  
• From: rjay (@ 204.220.169.94) on: Fri Jul 3 05:59:26 EDT 1998
  
  Ashok's view of fusion is very interesting - fusion should be fusion of concepts such as
  counterpoint, harmony etc. A nice distinction.
  
  At the same time, I think there is a place for
  even surface level fusion - like the ones
  Srikanth has quoted. People who do not
  know the intricacies of Western or classical music may still recognise there is something that
  is western about it.
  
  Instead of saying that is not fusion or that is poor
  quality fusion, we can distinguish between deep fusion vs surface fusion (conceptual fusion vs textural fusion if you will)
  
  There is a place for both in the listener's ears.
  
  thanks for enlightening discussions guys!
  
  
• From: rjay (@ 204.220.169.94) on: Fri Jul 3 06:02:25 EDT 1998
  
  Anand,
  
  Extremely sorry for calling you Ashok! Somehow I had an association Ashok Mahadevan in my mind inspite of the fact that
  I have read your excellent primer on Indian Classical Music.
  
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 205.218.142.217) on: Fri Feb 19 16:29:50 EST 1999
  
  Revived for new surfers to the newtfmpage.
  
  
• From: eden (@ 202.54.71.144) on: Fri Feb 19 23:28:56 EST 1999
  
  Deepu
  I feel the Pallavi of `Enn veettu thottathil' is recycled from `Sundari neeyum'. (Both are fusion songs though).
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ 1cust229.tnt8.chi5.da.uu.net) on: Sat Feb 20 12:06:12 EST 1999
  
  Hi,
  En veetu thottathail is remake of a carnatic number NAADAvinchukaladhinanamonamo.
  I dont see anything near to sundari neeym
  
  Srikanth
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Mon Feb 22 13:39:32 EST 1999
  
  Sorry guys, one basic question. What is fusion ? To me, most film songs are "fused". It could be Carnatic and folk, Carnatic and western or even Carnatic and Hindustani. Most film songs are a fusion of everything, a raaga melody base with western BGM or folksy BGM etc. Probably you are all referring to cases where the individual "fused " components exist with their own characteristics ,but have been blended together. Obviously, IR pioneered all this in film music atleast. In the song "Poonkathave", there is a distinctly WC oriented solo violin piece which later bends towards the raaga the song is based on thereby maintaining the link with the charanam. Super piece !
  
  Please comment and advice.
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Mon Feb 22 14:49:40 EST 1999
  
  Sorry guys, one basic question. What is fusion ? To me, most film songs are "fused". It could be Carnatic and folk, Carnatic and western or even Carnatic and Hindustani. Most film songs are a fusion of everything, a raaga melody base with western BGM or folksy BGM etc. Probably you are all referring to cases where the individual "fused " components exist with their own characteristics ,but have been blended together. Obviously, IR pioneered all this in film music atleast. In the song "Poonkathave", there is a distinctly WC oriented solo violin piece which later bends towards the raaga the song is based on thereby maintaining the link with the charanam. Super piece !
  
  Please comment and advice.
  
  
• From: Murali Sankar (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Tue Feb 23 12:15:12 EST 1999
  
  Dear sriram,
  
  I feel that fusion is the combination of two or more forms of music (classical) without digressing from the rules laid down for the individual styles. I shall make it clear by the ensuing discussion.
  
  Take the case of madhyamavathi. Now to write the chord prograssion for playing madhyamavathi in "1" kattai, we have the basic swaras as "C D F G A# " where A# refers to A sharp. Now I know D G A# make a chord, D F A# make another chord too. I am yet to fix my "scale" chord ie the chord involving C. Any scale chord has to be "S G P". If G = G1, it is minor and if G= G2 it is major. I find to my amusement that I do not have a G in the ragam at all. So I am free to choose, ideally speaking, G1 or G2. In other words I can choose C or Cm. when I start playing, I find that somehow C does not but Cm fits. where did I get this from ? Intuition. But if I check group chord theory book it says that (Cm,Gm and A#) go together. thus I am convinced that my set of chords for Madhyamavathi is (Cm,Gm and A#) and not (C,Gm and A#).
  
  egs for this category are : eeramana rojave, thulli thulli
  
  Let us examing "Harikamboji". It has G2. Now I am compelled to use (C,Gm and A#,D#m, F) and also G!!. I wonder why In the world I should use G when the N2 is not present in the ragam. But When I play any song in HK I find myself perfectly comfortable playing a combo of G and Gm rather than Gm alone. Where does this intuitive chord come from ? Group chord theory .
  
  egs
  
  Pazamuthir cholai is an excellent eg of this.
  
  This is not all. What we have examined is the simplest of all cases. Come to naattai odr chala naattai. They have both G1 and G2!! (By G1 I mean R3) I need to use a combo of C and Cm apart from G and Gm (though the R2 is absent !). Thus the chord buid up goes on and no wonder why anand Mahadevan's guitar teacher finds IR amazing in chord progression.
  
  Cases like the progressions for "kanakaangi", "Varaali" are highly complicated. but IR just finds the right chords and much more than that.
  
  hope this gives everybody an idea of how fusion (IR ?!!) works. It is not just carnatic alapana followed simultaneously by Drums :))
  
  

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