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Yesudas attacks ARR's version of Vandhe mataram

Topic started by Anand Mahadevan (@ tnt01-abe-119.fast.net) on Tue Oct 6 21:02:25 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

http://www.tamilcinema.com/cinenews/news/cinenews.htm

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Responses:

• From: Srikanth (@ inet21.us.oracle.com) on: Tue Oct 6 21:26:18 EDT 1998
  
  Can someone translate what KJY has said in English...Please!! (Reason:- I don't know Tamil)
  
  I am eager to know what his comments were.
  thanks
  
  
• From: aruvi (@ spc-isp-tor-uas-71-44.sprint.ca) on: Wed Oct 7 00:12:40 EDT 1998
  
  Srikanth
  I will try my best to translate it english.
  
  " Yesudas states that a.r.rahman has diseased the song Vande Mataram. He said this at Thiruvananthapuram Swathi Thirunaal music college at a student function. He says that new singers have not left even Vande Mataram alone. They have diseased it by using ragas of their own choice. Not only that but they have ruined its music too. He says that the song has its own raga which can be sung by all.
  
  P.S
  I don't know how well the use of the word 'diseased' fits in. The tamil word used 'Unnapaaduthirathu' which means to disable( physically disabled).
  
  
• From: balaji (@ schubert.crhc.uiuc.edu) on: Wed Oct 7 00:19:24 EDT 1998
  
  why is KJY against such things??? he is the one who has tried to sing kabir's songs in the same raaga as aiyappan songs. he is also not known for sticking rigidly to a particular raagam in the carnatic world(atleast in the past). he may have his views on ruining music , but this is the first time i am hearing him talking like this. normally he tries to give some explanation for the liberty taken with carnatic music in film music.
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 129.252.25.54) on: Wed Oct 7 02:20:42 EDT 1998
  
  KJY is absolutely right. no one will get patriotic feelings after listening to ARR's vande maataram. the original vande mataram was a lot better.
  
  
• From: NagasubramaniaN (@ fw.baan.nl) on: Wed Oct 7 02:47:16 EDT 1998
  
  hai.,
  I agree with vijay., ARR's VM may be a musical hit but it failed to make an impact in indian minds., i'll even say that like 'mukkala mukkabula';'thayya thayya.,';'sambo sambo'; 'hamma hamma' & all other famous tamil words., people were singing 'vandeeeeeeeee maaaaaaaataram' in high pitch.,,
  I like the second song of VM album- the original & melodic version., it is more real & nice.
  NagasubramaniaN
  
  
  
• From: kumar (@ blrp49.verifone.com) on: Wed Oct 7 05:19:41 EDT 1998
  
  Didnt KJ sing 'mar mari ninnee'?
  which was composed with diff raga by IR.
  and ARR's VM is just another song that used the words vandemataram. Why KJ also join..
  'athai patti' kind of cribing attitude?
  
  
• From: UV (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Wed Oct 7 07:04:05 EDT 1998
  
  mari mari ninne was never a degraded version of the original,it was just a change in raga. But this VM is of some cheap pop song's caliber.can u tolerate mari mari ninne sung in the tune of singAri sarakku???
  
  
• From: NagasubramaniaN (@ fw.baan.nl) on: Wed Oct 7 08:36:44 EDT 1998
  
  hai.,
  great UV., i liked ur approach.,
  kumar., do u think IR has spoiled 'mari mari ninne.,'? i don't think so.,
  In VM we can't say that ARR has spoiled it., he has reduced its greatness by treating it as a simple dance (or kaththu-shout) number
  NagasubramaniaN
  
  
• From: D.Srikanth (@ slip-32-101-16-109.il.us.ibm.net) on: Wed Oct 7 08:52:29 EDT 1998
  
  Hi,
  Speculation on VM ???
  As an Indian ARR has the right to use the song in VM, I dont know what KJ's problems are.
  KJY is known for these kinds of comment. It is better we dont give any importance to this.This album is now more than 1.5 years old,why didn't he come out with this earlier? it is incorrect to say that VM tunes are degraded. Entire India has accepted this and they are humming it till date. It sounds good for an average pair of ears. I consider this as one of the best contribution from TFM to our country.
  
  Srikanth
  
  
• From: Anand Mahadevan (@ freedum.proxy.lucent.com) on: Wed Oct 7 09:48:12 EDT 1998
  
  Srikanth,
  I am not sure why we should'nt give importance to this.Its coming from a respected musician who was addressing young music students.I personally was appalled to hear ARR's version of VM.Its once again a cheap inspiration.
  If ARR was serious,he could have done some orginal numbers rather than prototyping on a national song and sporting a junkie hairdo.
  
  
• From: Viswa (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Wed Oct 7 10:31:47 EDT 1998
  
  Srikanth,
  "Entire India has accepted this and they are humming it till date. It sounds good for an average pair of ears. I consider this as one of the best contribution from TFM to our country."
  
  Ennappa idhu ? Going by the response it has evoked and the impact that it has created, what you say may be true - that it has managed to get a nationwide acclaim. For an average pair of years, it may be appealing. But for a discerning listener (like you)- I'm really surprised that you consider it a remarkable piece of music ! Musically, in what way is it remarkable ?
  
  
• From: Viswa (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Wed Oct 7 10:33:18 EDT 1998
  
  Oops, years should be ears ! I'm doubtful if its appeal will last for a pair of years :-)))
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ proxy1.dpn.deere.com) on: Wed Oct 7 10:48:54 EDT 1998
  
  Hey guys,
  it is again - "Pazaya Kurudee Kathava thradee"
  viswa: I meant the physical ears
  
  It impress Musically many ways look for old posting here by Sridhar Seetharamam on Arr using unconvetional chord patterns.
  VM is good! no question about it.
  
  it is again - "Pazaya Kurudee Kathava thradee"
  
  Srikanth
  
  
• From: Thomas (@ nb24ppp121.cac.psu.edu) on: Wed Oct 7 10:57:18 EDT 1998
  
  You have to remember that this comment is coming from the same guy who a few years ago said that Lata Mangeshkar should stop singing. I mean who is he to say who should sing and who shouldn't? Lata is still singing becuase MD's call her to sing, not because she knocks on their door begging to sing. So this comment on ARR is very typical of Yesudas' arrogant nature.
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ gate3.ca.us.ibm.com) on: Wed Oct 7 11:16:03 EDT 1998
  
  Thomas:
  It is no secret that Lata's voice has become old and practically unbearable these days. I first noticed it as far back as "Maine Pyar Kiya". Her singing alongside SPB, heigtened the contrast.
  
  Sorry for the diversion guys, but can someone tell me if the lyrics of ARR's VM are the same as the original ? I don't know because I heard only two words that I could recognize. But if the lyrics are not the same, then ARR has full freedom to do whatever he wants. Either way he has full freedom, but if the lyrics are different then should refrain from claiming that it has degraded the original VM. Come one guys, how many of us really stand up when we hear even the National Anthem ? Why this selective patriotism ? Of course, NOT for one moment do I agree that ARR's VM is good. It is a far worse piece of trash than even some of his worst songs. All the same we cannot decide if ARR has the right to use VM for his music. It is just another marketing tactic - and VERY successful at that !
  
  
• From: Ravi (@ envy.cs.umass.edu) on: Wed Oct 7 11:34:31 EDT 1998
  
  Srinath: The lyrics are not the same. ARR has actually used the orginal vandE mataram without impairing the tune. I even liked his additional score to that piece. It certainly didn't change the tune. I am not even sure that KJY was talking about ARR's VM. None of his actual words refer to ARR (atleast as per Aruvi's translation.. I cannot see tamil fonts from home.) There might be other attempts at re-tuning the song that might have provoked KJY's ire.
  P.S. I am not a great fan of other pieces in VM either. :-).
  
  
• From: shankar (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Wed Oct 7 11:51:17 EDT 1998
  
  thomas,
  Do U really think what KJY told about Lata is wrong??
  Check her voice in Kuch nA kahO (1942 A L S),it's terrible.
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 129.252.22.246) on: Wed Oct 7 12:05:19 EDT 1998
  
  adding to the above, lata in jiya jale sounded shaky.
  
  
• From: Shashi (@ eed02990.mayo.edu) on: Wed Oct 7 12:15:09 EDT 1998
  
  Hi I agree with Ravi--I cant view the original quote by KJY (and even if it is original--we still assume the reporter is reproducing it verbatim). So why assume KJY is
  talking about ARR's VM. Could he be talking about Raja's VM in Kaalapani (Which I consider is fantastic) or Ranjit Barot's new VM (I have not heard this so far).
  So lets not assume KJY is talking about ARR's VM. I also agree that ARR has given the original VM with some wonderful chords/harmony/chorus etc. I once
  played it when one of my staunch Bengali friend was visiting and he felt the peice was very well done ( I am not saying he is any kind of authority but just as an
  example if Salil Chowdhry did a good job of a Bharathiyar song I may appreciate rather than accuse him of a poor attempt at trying to interpret something only a
  tamilian can do best) Secondly the song Maa tujhe salaam/thaai maNNe vaNakkam... song has the words Vande Matharam in it but as Srikanth said any Indian or
  for that matter anybody can use this phrase in their composition. I think the song certainly delivers and is a worthy composition to say the least. I do agree that some
  of the arrangements do resemble the arrangements in 'Circle of life' from the Lion King but there is no direct lifts or copying. Just the imagination of the phrase Vande
  Maataram as ARR did definitely deserves credit.
  
  
• From: Nitin (@ moff351-24.lib.berkeley.edu) on: Wed Oct 7 13:10:11 EDT 1998
  
  I think Yesudas' comment should be ignored:)
  
  
• From: SR Kaushik (@ nova13.cs.wisc.edu) on: Wed Oct 7 14:49:06 EDT 1998
  
  While I think ARR's VM is rather average, I don't think KJY has any right to comment on it, as the lyrics were different except for the words Vande Mataram.
  
  As far as the alleged comments on Lata by KJY, while they may be independently true, they are not to be expected from him, simply because of this. KJY's voice itself has degenerated now. His voice shivers. He used to be great in the early 80s, but age is catching up with him. This voice shivering is seen clearly in the charanam of "Kannale kadhal kavithai" of "Atma", charanam of "Kalyana then nila" (Mounam Sammadam), and several other songs.
  While he is able to sing difficult turns, he goofs up simple tunes where steady singing is required.
  
  
• From: Srinivas (@ scproxy3.sc.intel.com) on: Wed Oct 7 15:23:14 EDT 1998
  
  Kaushik,
  I do not find any problems with KJY's singing in any of the songs that u mention. :-)
  Moreover, I think KJY did a COMMENDABLE job in "DEva SangEtham" from GURU. All things considered, I don't think his voice has really deteriorated!
  I won't support any of his comments, but I do agree with his views on Lata's voice.
  As far as VM is concerned, I do not really like any of the songs except the second song (the orchestrated version of the original VM).
  
  Bye
  Srinivas
  
  

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