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RHYTHMS: HAS ANYONE CREATEAD AS MANY AS ILAIYARAJA?

Topic started by The Fan (@ spider-wj073.proxy.aol.com) on Tue Oct 27 00:10:58 EST 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

This is one topic that somehow escaped most of IR fans. I think it is because we have all taken for granted Raja's creativity that weaves in an distinct and unique texture in the form of complex and unbelievable never ever heard before beats or rhythms. I was listening to Senorita, I love you' from Jhani. The exuberance and brilliance of the song's rhythm has left me wondering why and how in the world has such a rhythm never been done by anyone else in the world. What about 'Poongatre Un Per Sollu' in Vetri Vizha, or Vallayosai Kala Kala vena' in Sathya or 'Vanam Kizhey Vandan Yenna' in Thoongathe Thambi Thoongathey. Has anyone of you heard rhythms in these song before and after? Long before the song Muqabla, Mukkala came, IR used the western beat for a song in the mal version of My Dear Kuttichathan. You got to hear that song. There are some now making claims that Mustafa, Mustafa song's beat has been copied by IR in 'Ilavenirkala Panjami' in Manam Virubunthey Unnai. Let us list all the FIRST TIME INVENTED ONLY BY ILAIYARAJA rhythms (I am thinking there at least 500 distinct and new rhythms the only IR is the first in the world to use in his over 4,000 songs) I have not heard any composer who has has the versatility to INVENT more than 2 or more different rhythms for a song. Maybe, there were a few who used the standard heard before type rhythms in a song. So let us start listing. This is one of the facets of IR which has been overshadowed by his stunts with the orchestra and melodic surprises.

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Responses:

• From: Sankaran (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Tue Oct 27 00:22:17 EST 1998
  
  Some of the good rhythms IR used are as follows:
  
  
  1. "mottai mAdi, mottai mAdi, oru love jodi, love jodi" - Anjali
  
  2. "mAsi mAsam ALAna ponnu" - some Rajini movie
  
  3. "Ey unnaithanae" -kAdhal parisu
  
  
• From: raaja_vetti (@ horus.erlm.siemens.de) on: Tue Oct 27 01:52:54 EST 1998
  
  4. raasaavE unnai naan eNNiththaan, pala raaththiri - maan... listen to the lovely arrangements of rhythm.. its terrific stuff! stays in the background and adds emotion to the song! No where it attempts to overtake the song but still fits in very well!
  5. maamaan oru naaL malligaippO kuduththaanaam - listen the beats in charanam! very very innovative... Had it been Deva, it would had been a 'gaanaa'! but IR shows his class apart! It might sound more terrific in digital I guess!
  6. karuththa machchaan, nenjukkuLLa ennaththa vachchaan - do I need to say something for this?!
  7. machchaanaip paaththeengaLaa - traditional instruments mixes nicely and its certainly foot-tapping!!
  
  
• From: shankar (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Tue Oct 27 02:58:58 EST 1998
  
  8.Asaiya kAthula Thoodhu vittu (johnny)
  9.punnagayil minsaram (bharatan)
  10.deepangaL pEsum (dhevadhai)
  
  
• From: shankar (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Tue Oct 27 03:00:04 EST 1998
  
  Oops, I left one...
  one of the simplest beats i've heard...
  11.otha ruva thArEn (nAttuppuRa pAttu)
  
  
• From: shankar (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Tue Oct 27 03:01:35 EST 1998
  
  one more...
  12.viLakku vaippOm (AthmA)
  
  
• From: cram (@ 206.103.12.102) on: Tue Oct 27 04:57:42 EST 1998
  
  guys,
  aasaiya kaaththula, vilakku vappom, malaikkoyil vaasalil are all based on the same beat. IR has repeated it once again in a song from Raajavin Paarvayile.
  
  
• From: Madhan (@ 202.41.117.3) on: Tue Oct 27 08:04:20 EST 1998
  
  "varudhu varudhu ilangaatru" from BRAHMA
  "sollividu velli nilavey" from ADIMAI PADAI
  "siva rathiri" from MICHAEL MADHANA KAMARAJAN
  
  
• From: cram (@ 206.103.12.102) on: Tue Oct 27 09:14:13 EST 1998
  
  how can anyone overlook vaan megangale from puthiya vaarppugal? i have already dwelt on this song in another thread, but i won't tire of singing its praises. raaja was simply celestial in this song; the delicate blending of santoor, violin, flute, veena...what a song, maan!too much.
  
  another purely-IR number is oru kiLi uruguthu, from anandha kummi. fantastic blending of drum beats, flute, etc. great female duet.
  i guess rOjavai thaalattum thenral from ninaivellam nitya could also figiure in this list. but then, there are so many.....
  
  
• From: cram (@ 206.103.12.102) on: Tue Oct 27 09:17:15 EST 1998
  
  u could also consider thenral ennai muththam ittadhu (oru Odai nadhiyagirathu), kuyile kavikkuyile, puthiya poovithu pooththadhu.
  
  
• From: mahadevan (@ 202.54.13.211) on: Tue Oct 27 09:19:41 EST 1998
  
  "CHINNA RAASAVEY" FROM WALTER VETRIVEL....copied ten times over by various MD's eg: Sirpi's song in
  "Captain", "Sendoora pandikku" in the film Deva by Deva
  
  
• From: shankar (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Tue Oct 27 09:54:56 EST 1998
  
  cram,
  IMO,Asaiya kAthula thoodhu vittu and the other two songs are NOT based on the same beats.
  
  
• From: cram (@ 206.103.12.102) on: Tue Oct 27 10:26:31 EST 1998
  
  shankar,
  listen carefully to the songs and u can see that there's only a change in pace of the basic beat in the songs. while its slowest in aasaiya kaathula, it becomes slightly faster in the other two, especially vilakku vappom. at least, that's IMHO. somehow, i am always reminded of the other songs whenever i listen to any one of them.
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 129.252.22.246) on: Tue Oct 27 12:28:56 EST 1998
  
  1. meetadha oru veenai - poonthottam - 5 beat pattern
  
  2. thanni karuthiruchu thavala satham keturuchu - gramathu adhiyaayam? the beginning of the song has MV singing in a slow pace but a faster rhythm in the BGM.
  
  
• From: balaji (@ schubert.crhc.uiuc.edu) on: Tue Oct 27 13:03:41 EST 1998
  
  sangeetha megam - udhaya geetham.
  madai thirandhu - nizhalgal.
  dil bharjaane, kokkarakko - kalaignan
  potri paadadi penne - devar magan
  aathaadi paavadai kaathaada - poo vilangu
  as fan says, there will atleast be 500 of these.
  
  
• From: SR Kaushik (@ nova20.cs.wisc.edu) on: Tue Oct 27 17:15:39 EST 1998
  
  IR has used several innovative ghatam beats.
  
  1. Potri paadai penne - Devar Magan
  2. Swamikku poo parikka - ?? (*ing Prabhu)
  
  Some great drum beats
  1. Ninnukori varnam - first interlude
  2. Raja raja - both from Agninakshatram
  3. Kokila Kokila - Kokila(Telugu)
  4. Konji Konji - Veera
  
  
• From: SR Kaushik (@ nova20.cs.wisc.edu) on: Tue Oct 27 17:17:31 EST 1998
  
  I forgot to add the song "Ennavenru solvadhamma" from Raajakumaran. The small piece used to come to the main tune from the charanam is one of his best efforts.
  
  
• From: Anush (@ cad7.icsl.ucla.edu) on: Tue Oct 27 18:20:33 EST 1998
  
  Raakku muthu raakku - yejaman
  Azhagaana manjapura - yellame en raasathan
  oru koottil - kolangal
  ennai thaalatta - kaadalukku mariyathai
  raaja raajathi - agni natchatram
  raajathi raaja un .. - mannan
  
  All these songs have hi-funda drum beats.
  
  
• From: balaji (@ schubert.crhc.uiuc.edu) on: Tue Oct 27 18:55:26 EST 1998
  
  3 guys from iitm 98 batch in consequent postings!!hi anush!!
  sorry for the digression.
  
  
• From: balaji (@ schubert.crhc.uiuc.edu) on: Tue Oct 27 18:56:36 EST 1998
  
  raghav: samikku naan pooparikka is from vietnam colony.
  
  
• From: SitaRam (@ portal.ameritech.com) on: Wed Oct 28 15:02:36 EST 1998
  
  The Best feettapping rhythm I have ever heard in recent years from anyone is Raja's song in PONNUVEETTUKARAN, the song is Kettukkamma, Kettukkamma. How did this person ever conjure tunes so perfect each time with a perfect rhythm? Only God knows. However, the disappointing thing is, in many years I have never heard a more disappointing interlude than in the Kettukkamma song, what a perfect number but somehow IR slipped once in a billion times.
  
  Has anyone heard this song. Get it and enjoy it a hundred times
  
  
• From: Anand (@ ) on: Thu May 10 22:27:13 EDT 2001
  
  o vasantha raaja, idhu oru nila kaalam, paruvame pudhiya paadal
  
  
• From: kk (@ 172.140.255.187) on: Thu May 10 22:39:55 EDT 2001
  
  is The fan = fan = comment = srikant?
  
  
• From: comment (@ 65.9.136.158) on: Thu May 10 23:03:44 EDT 2001
  
  no...i am not the above fan..who started this thread, (which imho is a big joke.)
  
  
• From: KSS (@ 66.74.57.152) on: Fri May 11 00:09:16 EDT 2001
  
  IR excels in Misra Chapu Thaalam. One of those hundreds of songs is Meendum Meendum Vaa from Vikram. How many variations of beats can this guy give for Misra Chapu ? ..... Literally countless variations.
  
  
• From: Vijay Venkatram J (@ 202.54.33.161) on: Fri May 11 14:55:41 EDT 2001
  
  Friends,
  I think I can welcome you all to Maestro Ilaiyaraaja Fans Club founded by me at Yahoo! This is because I feel you all have a superlative sense of music - that is why you love Ilaiyaraaja! Same here too! Let us enjoy His rhythms now!
  
  Maestro Ilaiyaraaja Fans Club:
  
  http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/maestroilaiyaraajafansclub
  
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.149.4) on: Fri May 11 16:57:25 EDT 2001
  
  Vijay..have you taken your GMAT already ?? :)
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.53) on: Sat May 12 02:31:02 EDT 2001
  
  Anush
  
  oru koottil - kolangal
  
  Correct me if I'm wrong, but somewhere I'd heard mentioned that "Oru Kootil" was composed by KR....and the synth drum and beat used was unfortunately very similar to the "Porale Ponnuthaiye" from Karuthamma which was released earlier.
  
  
• From: Vijay Venkatram J (@ 203.197.154.154) on: Sat May 12 07:00:33 EDT 2001
  
  Kiru,
  What is GMAT? I don't understand!
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.254) on: Sat May 12 11:47:40 EDT 2001
  
  GMAT- Great Mastero Abase Throng
  
  
  
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 64.160.55.214) on: Sat May 12 12:08:24 EDT 2001
  
  cosmician are u sure Karuthamma was released earlier ?
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.53) on: Sat May 12 12:22:45 EDT 2001
  
  Hi Sabesan
  
  Yes...I heard the launch of Karuthamma and specially that song on Chennai FM...much before "Kolangal" was released...anyway it'd be better if more knowledgeable people give their views :)
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 64.160.54.179) on: Sat May 12 13:13:24 EDT 2001
  
  cosmician.... i checked www.tamilcinema.com.... and yes Kolangal got released in 95 and Karuthamma in 94.....
  
  but i doubt if the song "Oru Kootil" is by KR - cause its too IRish.... also i try to get the similarities between the 2 songs u mentioned, but could'nt bring it....
  
  
• From: Karthi (@ 63.21.181.159) on: Sat May 12 15:41:31 EDT 2001
  
  How one supports the rhythm with percussions is more important than the rhythm itself. And I think IR is NOT that creative in his percussion patterns compared to his predecessors! Infact, it's IR's repetitive use of same kind of rhythms for most of his duets in the 80's which brought a boring quality to his music. IMO, the last best duet of IR with an interesting rhythm is Andhi Mazhai Pozhigiradhu.
  
  
• From: Karthi (@ 63.21.181.159) on: Sat May 12 15:46:05 EDT 2001
  
  Though not relevant to the topic, I thought of putting more specifications into what's being told as an intro to the thread...
  
  I read the topic again and was surprised to note the words "melodic surprises"! There can be two kinds here. Those in the interludes or the orchestration & those in the tune. Which one are you referring to? If it's the former, yes, IR is great. If it's the latter, a big SORRY! IR cannot give surprises in his tunes like MSV does.
  
  

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