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Hindi Is Sweet, Tamil Is Not

Topic started by Neel D (@ 24.99.73.50) on Thu Jul 31 08:28:30 EDT 2003.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Hindi is sweet, Tamil is not - Says Karthik Raja

In an interview aired Tuesday (July 28) on Singapore's Oli Tamil Radio, to a question Karthik Raja replied that he likes composing for Hindi movies because the language is so sweet and makes his composition sound sweet. He went on to say that he thinks that that sweetness is missing in Tamil.

When the interviewers (two women) asked him about the current generation of singers he said that after SPB and Hariharan there has been no new male singer who is versatile. He added that the new male singers are all so monotonous.

The two women interviewers spoke in pure Tamil and only in Tamil. Karthik Raja's vocabulary was about 70% English and 30% Tamil. (At the end of the interview, the interviewers thanked him for his efforts to speak in Tamil.)

The interviewers asked who were the singers in his latest album, Karthik replied "Vijay Parakash, from Mumbai". The interviewers repied, "yeah, north indian singers' voices do have a vaseegaram".

I was so impressed at the maturity, diplomacy and the pride in heritage of the interviewers (the two Singaporean women).

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: AV(R) (@ 132.206.72.95) on: Mon Aug 4 20:57:23 EDT 2003
  
  Raj - Your posts on this thread were simply wonderful. Indeed, very eloquent. Thanks a lot. I also remember your very informative posts regarding some nearly forgotten instruments like the sarangi. Thanks again.
  
  
• From: !!!!! (@ 68.77.22.143) on: Mon Aug 4 22:16:10 EDT 2003
  
  so,where are we now. is karthik raja now reconsidering udit narayan?
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 213.42.2.8) on: Tue Aug 5 08:17:03 EDT 2003
  
  Mr."This thread is smacks of bigotry ",
  
  Thanks. That was good.your posts in this thread are as relevant as Karthik raja to TFM.
  
  
• From: !!!!!! (@ 68.77.22.143) on: Tue Aug 5 21:39:59 EDT 2003
  
  This is not bigotry, pal. this is called dialogue and understandin, by spitting the dirt out, one becomes clean for good.... yes, language is like mother of fahter, sweet to the person born to it. not a bad topic, indication that there were hardly any bigots in this forum. keep it up folks!!!!
  
  
• From: Naamam podu, saar (@ 68.77.145.173) on: Thu Aug 7 13:29:28 EDT 2003
  
  hey fellas, weird things can get. the points i brought out is very much in focus in this below article. anybody recall in this thread when I said Hindi is mostly Persian origin and "little Indian!" here we go fellas, read this and convince the northeners that they need some originality to themselves. Bollywood should be called Pollywood or Arabollywood!!!!
  
  also, Isq, (pyaar or prem is nice sounding); also fukuth, thaakath, hakath, hukum, zulph are poetic words that make me wonder how? ha, but they come from arabic/urdu!!! Salaam Mumbai!!
  
  http://sulekha.com/redirectnh.asp?cid=314644
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 195.229.241.231) on: Sat Aug 9 11:08:22 EDT 2003
  
  Hindi Lessons : Chapter 1
  
  If it the word is "bhal" then you feature it in a Govinda movie with jhatkas and matkas dance.
  
  In the same sentence replace "bhal" with "Zulfon",you can have anyone from Pankaj udhas to Hariharan to make it sound like a ghazal.you can add "wah!Wah!" in between.
  
  
• From: BA (@ 66.81.79.43) on: Sun Aug 10 13:17:23 EDT 2003
  
  Even if KR thinks that Hindi is sweeter than Tamil, he should not comment about it in public, since tamil is his mother tongue.
  
  And what is the craze about saying, I cannot speak in tamil. Tamil is the oldest living indian language and one should be proud of it.
  
  IR-ukku ippadi oru pillaya?
  
  A clear case of sour grapes....
  
  
• From: RR (@ 203.199.213.3) on: Sun Aug 10 22:25:21 EDT 2003
  
  BA, How can we expect anythingelse from someone
  who called Carnatic music "boring"?
  RR
  
  
• From: Richard Vijay (@ 211.24.39.168) on: Mon Aug 11 00:49:39 EDT 2003
  
  I wonder now why his Three Roses sounds teribble.He is already a flop in Tamil and tuning in into Hindi to survive.Give him a wish to compose more Three Roses tunes,LOL.
  
  
• From: swami (@ 202.146.71.49) on: Tue Aug 12 07:31:48 EDT 2003
  
  Karthik raja's music is always complicated.The greatness about Ilaiyaraja is that he made music sound simple and goes straight to the heart.Karthik Raja's statement about singers is mean and arrogant probably because of frustration.Every new singer has a certain freshness abt him or her and they have all proved themselves.If he accepts singers as they are and learns to appreciate their strengths and exploit them then he will grow not alone as an m.d. but as a human being as well.He should take a leaf ouf of A.R.R who has created a revolution.Think simple,be humble and don't talk,Mr Karthik Raja.And what has he done in life to talk so much?He happens to be the son of a great father.That's all.Listening to his father's and A.R.R.'s compositions may make him humble.God save him.
  
  
• From: Mumbai Ramki (@ 203.193.152.200) on: Tue Aug 12 08:07:45 EDT 2003
  
  I do not agree with what KR has said about Tami /HIndi -Sweet etc .But his comments about new singers is very very valid !!!!!
  
  AFter SPB ,Yesudas there is no versatile singer (and the current singers are bit monotonous which is very very TRUE .
  
  Swami ,
  The same KR has parised karthik in his Three roses interview .
  But at the same time ,we do have good singers ,if not versatile !!! Balram ,Karthik ,Madhu Balakrishnana re really good but the variety they have is less ,i guess
  
  
• From: raj (@ 203.164.71.136) on: Tue Aug 12 11:02:58 EDT 2003
  
  OK... TAMIL is definetly 10 times better than HINDI... but can anyone proove that KR told this??
  may be some anty KR guys kati vita katu kathaya irukalam..
  
  
• From: raj (@ 203.164.71.136) on: Tue Aug 12 11:04:02 EDT 2003
  
  OK... TAMIL is definetly 10 times better than HINDI... but can anyone proove that KR told this??
  may be some anti KR guys kati vita katu kathaya irukalam..
  
  
  
  
• From: Ravi (@ 192.147.58.6) on: Wed Aug 13 06:39:42 EDT 2003
  
  Raj, could be possibly True because even in his interviews I have hardly heard him speak in Tamizh though he is IR's son and he was brought up in TN.
  
  
• From: Raj (@ ) on: Thu Aug 21 17:46:13 EDT 2003
  
  Naamam Podu saar: I read the article in the link you provided. The writer wants the language in 'Hindi' movies purified to the level of Hindi he learnt in the south -a Sanskrit derivative. He seems to understand that the language 'Hindi' movie songs is actually Hindustani or Hindi-Urdu. Hindi and Urdu evolved from Hindustani. If you eliminate all (almost) Persian-Arabic -Turkish words you get Hindi or High Hindi a term used bu linguists. If you eliminate most of the Sanskrit you get Urdu or High Urdu. Hindustani is the outcome of an attempt around 12th century to marge Urdu and the Hindi dialects around Delhi, the seat of Moghul power. Urdu itself is a word from Turkish meaning army or camp. The language spoken in the army camps came to be known as Urdu- a mix of Persian,Arabic and Turkish-languages used by the rulers and army chiefs. The language of the ruled and the soldiers happened to be various dialects like Khariboli, mythili etc. HIndustani is the combination of the languages of the ruler and the dialects of the ruled.
  This language permeated the music that came to be known as Hindustani classical music. Unlike Carnatic music, Hindustani music was chamber music for the ruler and his/her vassals. The rulers being Moghuls, Sanskrit was banished and Persian,Arabic and Turkish took its place along with Hindi dialects. It was common to see poetry written in Hindi with lines in Persian. Amir Khusro was one such poet (of Turkish origin).
  That is, music in the north from 12th century (or earlier) has been using Persian and Arabic along with Hindi dialects. That tradition was/is being followed in movies. In fact, Hindustani can be written in Devanagari or modified Persian script. The novelist Premchand is known to have used both in writing his novels. The writer of the article wants purified Hindusthani or the Sanskrit derivative he learnt in the south. It is not going to happen. The colloquial language in the north is not the Hindi he learnt. It is their language, their movies and their songs.
  The same comment can be made about Tamil movie songs. They have lot of Sanskrit words. The language itself has been cleaned up in the last 50 years. But, colloquial Tamil has a lot of Sanskrit words and so do movie songs. In the words of one of my north Indian friends replacing the Urdu words in songs would not result in the same melody as heard with Urdu words. Samething applies to Tamil movie songs. Enjoy the melody just as we enjoy carnatic compositions in Telugu,Kannada and Sanskrit.
  
  
• From: Cinema Virumbi (@ 203.197.220.195) on: Fri Aug 22 01:44:08 EDT 2003
  
  
  Raj,
  
  I found your Hindi/Urdu analysis interesting! I all along wanted to know one thing:
  If Hindi is derived from the dialects of the North ('the language of the ruled' as mentioned by you) and if Urdu ('the language of the rulers' as mentioned by you) had its origin from Persian, Arabic and Turkish, then how did they evolve a common structure of sentences? ( i.e., main vahaan jaa rahaa hoon, meraa naam raajaa hai, hindustan hamaaraa vatan hai etc., is the common structure and if you change the nouns (mainly) and verbs (occasionally), the language changes from Hindi to Urdu!)Was the structure taken from the original dialects of the North and only the nouns (and verbs) taken from Arabic / Persian / Turkish?
  
  
  
• From: prem pyaar mohabbath ka matlab sas spssx (@ 68.77.7.129) on: Fri Aug 22 02:51:33 EDT 2003
  
  Raj, as long as Indians are open minded, everything is fair. Language is for communicating. the thing is South Indians should not neglect their languages and go for the glamorous Hindi (quoting KR!) south lingos are soft, gentle sounding and not harsh at all. (language is a mirror to the heart of the people. over the centuries northerners may have become more lawless and cruder because of thier native languages takin a beating? do you think so?) But, Hindi is considered harsh sounding by many linguists, that antithetical of sankrit or tamil. only after Kamalahasan joined Hindi films his name changed to Kamal Haasan - a difficult way to say kamalahasan. by the wya, is Haasan Kamal kamal haasan with a beard?
  
  
• From: Rajesh (@ 167.202.196.72) on: Fri Aug 22 05:49:07 EDT 2003
  
  Raj,
  that was interesting points. but, how about Sanskrit ? i would like to know the history of Sanskrit. Is it older than Tamil ? my friend says Sanskrit is not indian, but it comes from European origin. if so, when did it enter india ?
  
  
• From: tamizhikku amudhu endru peyr (@ 68.77.7.129) on: Fri Aug 22 16:54:24 EDT 2003
  
  Rajesh, then Tamil also came from Europe. both sanskrit and tamil rode on the same donkey. along the way, tamil learned sanskrit and also how to sound like an as ;--)
  
  

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