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Serious doubt Reg IR music

Topic started by yaaro (@ 62.6.139.13) on Wed Aug 18 15:25:28 EDT 2004.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I am a diehard IR fan.
There have been gigabytes of material posted analysing IR's music-whether it be carnatic or western or folk. I hardly have seen any other MD's music being analysed and dissected as IR's.
I am a zero as far as musical technicality is concerned.
What I am curious is whether other MD's creations are not as complex as IR's-or is it that only IR's fans are music savvy-or is it that we are really complexi-fying his music.The last, I am sure is not the reason .
For eg the only comment I can remember for ARR is the famous ''kedharathukku sedharam'' comment for ennavale..

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Responses:

• From: app_engine (@ 136.1.1.101) on: Wed Aug 18 16:01:26 EDT 2004
  
  yaaro,
  the interesting thing is all your answers are correct:-)
  
  -that IR's music is really complex (HTNI is a `simple' example for complex music:-))
  
  -that IR's admirers are musically savvy (in other words, IR captivated a large group of listeners with his variety and quantum of output of whom a sizeable are musically savvy)
  
  -that IR's admirers complexify it (this is based on IR's statement that he is just doing what naturally comes to him...only others try to explain in all kinds of ways...music is verum saptham...even dog barking is music etc.:-))
  
  On the other hand, you cannot conclude that IR is the ONLY composer to give `complex' music...there had been other compositions before and after IR that are equally challenging. Unfortunately, the focus before the advent of IR was on MGR, Sivaji, Kannadasan...after the days of IR, it has been meandering between cassette sales, visual impacts -picturisation aborad etc, cable TV promotion, marketing gimmicks, MD'yOda thala mudi:-), `graphics', `loops-borrowed souds-ctrl-C/V', `big-banners', `big-directors', `big-heroes' etc...and the focus on music is unfortunately LOST!
  
  
• From: hehehewalrus (@ 130.127.104.27) on: Wed Aug 18 16:21:27 EDT 2004
  
  The last reason is incorrect. In fact several guys who are inspired to learn and appreciate the tiny details of music after listening to IR's meticulously tuned melodies and orchestration.
  IR tune-aiyum rasikalaam, orchestration-um rasikalaam, thats called completeness
  
  
• From: kamalanath (@ 15.219.201.68) on: Wed Aug 25 13:38:10 EDT 2004
  
  Take any IR's song. Just sit and listen to it. You may find the following wonderfull sensations.
  
  1. The music that comes before the lyrics start will be great. It will be a one which takes u to the mood of the song.
  
  2. When the lyrics start, the orchestration will be in such a way that it does not disturb the words. You can hear the uniform thaalam that runs along with the pallavi.
  
  3. The Pallavi will be tuned in such a way that you'll feel that there can be no other best composition that this ever.
  
  4. The music in between the first charanam and the pallavi will be totally a best composition with a great orchestration.
  
  5. The first Charanam will take you to a totally new world. The tune imagination will be incredible. It will keep the flow.
  
  6. The music in between the first charanam and the second charanam will be another symphony.
  
  7. Finally the pallavi will repeat. You'll feel such a great sensation of happiness when it flows.
  
  8. The raagas are all known only for music savvys.
  
  9. He will satisfy a samaritan, a music savvy, a middle level fan and everyone.
  
  10. The handling of instruments in the song will be so matured. No one other than him can create such a matured way of composing and conducting it. Great!
  
  
• From: app_engine (@ 136.1.1.33) on: Wed Aug 25 15:05:32 EDT 2004
  
  kamalanath, who is a samaritan?:-)
  
  
• From: Prashanth (@ 203.200.208.67) on: Thu Aug 26 04:23:08 EDT 2004
  
  app_engine,
  
  I am interested to know about other MDs giving complex music in TFM or TelFM. As far as I know, there has been no complexity in Telugu Film Music over the past 15 years AFAI know. May be Keeravani.
  
  TelFM lovers, any comments??
  
  
• From: Jagan (@ 61.11.73.84) on: Thu Aug 26 05:19:24 EDT 2004
  
  As far as TELFM is concerned there was no concept of complexity becuse of lack of experimentation.
  
  As per my knowledge the after the entry of IR in TELFM people started enjoying a new harmony which was never been there ( due credits to MD's Like JVR & Chakravarthy etc).
  
  Even now i can say that people still respect IR equal to the legendarys of TelFm Viz., SR.Rao, Pendyala,KVM etc.
  
  Keervani is a knowledgeable composer and IMHO there was no complexity in his music. He always says that he is a great admirer of KVM but in reality follows IR's style.
  
  
  
• From: zz (@ 203.145.174.4) on: Thu Aug 26 07:43:16 EDT 2004
  
  kamalanath:
  
  Neenga solra ellame...most of the topclass music directors musiclaiyum irukkum...
  Only thing is most of IR fans this that it is only IR who could come out like this...if confronted then they expect the same thing in the same patter from other music directors....now even if some other MD tries to give IR like song...say..sometimes then it will be branded as copied...
  
  En solrennna...I have seen many discussions going on here and in IR group and they multisect every song....now is it not possible to multisect songs from other MDs too and find out what's unique in it..has anyone tried?...Anakku sangeetha knowledge (indha notes laam ezhudura knowledge) illa unfortunately.
  
  
• From: Guess Me (@ 202.83.33.16) on: Thu Aug 26 12:30:18 EDT 2004
  
  Mr. Kamalnath, your post shows your blind faith in IR. Your references like 'No one else' or 'none other than' proves that.
  
  And there are many many songs of IR which don't follow even 1 of your so called 'wonderful sensations'. No one is perfect.
  
  IR might be a legend, but there are many others in TFM who have performed well or sometimes better than IR. Don't ignore them.
  
  
• From: Note Man (@ 24.11.160.43) on: Thu Aug 26 14:07:05 EDT 2004
  
  " IR might be a legend, but there are many others in TFM who have performed well or sometimes better than IR "
  
  We would like to know your criteria of "better". And, no one is ignoring others. But it seems you are the one who has chosen to ignore/belittle IR.
  
  I can understand Kamalnath's experiences based on some IRs songs, and it is true that it may not happen for all songs. But that does not immediately mean that we should start hating IR.
  
  zz,
  
  " Anakku sangeetha knowledge (indha notes laam ezhudura knowledge) illa unfortunately."
  
  And, how surprising that those who have it are not attempting to do that? And, even if they do start this, they will not go beyond a few songs. Unlike the case of MSV/KVM/IR, where hundreds of their songs lend themselves to such fruitful analysis.
  
  And, a more fact based reason is that IR experimented mostly on a fusion of WCM and Carnatic music. Usually MDs have some knowledge of WCM but, IR was a virtuoso in this area (guitar and piano) and this allowed him to do things which were virtually unheard of. Salil Chowdhary and did stuff similar to IR, but his output was only 250 movie unlike IRs 800+ movies.
  
  Similarly, MSV, KVM were excellent in Carnatic and their experimentation was mostly in that area. MSV did some western fusion himself but not at the level of IR. ARR started western pop fusion with Reggae, Rap and R&B, music and since these are popular art forms with well known precedents, much of the analysis of ARRs songs only focused on his usage of instruments and the different genres he was trying to mix.
  
  As in the words of a western composer, who listened to IRs symphony, "your ears will hear music as never before".
  
  
  
• From: Madrasguy (@ 205.242.228.4) on: Thu Aug 26 17:37:31 EDT 2004
  
  Not comparing IR, Keeravani (Maragathamani) does indeed do some very good songs and complex to certain level in TelFilms. If you look at it - Azhagan, Vaaname Ellai are pretty complex (again ignoring IR).
  
  I espcially liked his compositions in BombaiPriyudu, PelliSandadi
  
  
• From: BT (@ 207.46.238.133) on: Thu Aug 26 19:36:51 EDT 2004
  
  Not to belittle IR or IR fans, but ungalukkey idhu konjam (romba konjam) over'a theriyala??
  
  (let the flame war begin!)
  
  
• From: hehehewalrus (@ 130.127.105.186) on: Thu Aug 26 21:04:19 EDT 2004
  
  Noteman: "But it seems you are the one who has chosen to ignore/belittle IR"
  
  -- Rather,the above should read "...you are the chosen one to belittle IR" :)
  
  
• From: Guess Me (@ 202.83.33.16) on: Thu Aug 26 23:51:12 EDT 2004
  
  Just like BT said, you all are very much over guys. Even IR will be ashamed if he happens to see your posts.
  
  
• From: MADDY (@ 203.94.218.128) on: Fri Aug 27 05:23:28 EDT 2004
  
  JERKS.....
  
  
• From: pANdiyan (@ 136.1.1.101) on: Fri Aug 27 13:19:48 EDT 2004
  
  Guess Me, BT & MADDY,
  why don't you listen to the interview of Jegath for a change? (of `world tamil centre', a catholic priest with knowledge of both ICM & WCM )
  
  http://www.tis-usa.com/gasper%20jegath%20speech--001.mp3
  http://www.tis-usa.com/gasper%20jegath%20speech--002.mp3
  
  What do you think of this man? Does he sound like another DFer?:-)
  
  
• From: Guess Me (@ 202.83.33.16) on: Fri Aug 27 14:07:33 EDT 2004
  
  Mr.pANdiyan,
  I didnt listen to the mp3s you posted here as I can guess what it will have as it has been posted by the Non-IR Bashers (NIBs).
  
  But remember, if you search, you will find comments by some more famous people praising other composers.
  
  
• From: pANdiyan (@ 136.1.1.101) on: Fri Aug 27 14:35:07 EDT 2004
  
  Guess Me,
  There is a lot of difference in listening to something & reading about it...that's why I asked you to listen to the interview on TV...
  
  
• From: arrfan (@ 66.235.184.105) on: Sun Aug 29 08:52:35 EDT 2004
  
  # From: MADDY (@ 203.94.218.128) on: Fri Aug 27 05:23:28 EDT 2004
  
  JERKS.....#
  
  PROSTITUTE
  
  

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