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Is Vairamuthu better than Kannadaasan?

Topic started by Prabhar (@ ppp45-216.lvsb.vsnl.net.in) on Thu Jul 2 09:40:00 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Yes......The greatest joke of the year!
Courtesy: Sivaji Ganesan
Reference: Kungumam weekly.
My opeinon: KD malai yentral VM madu....

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Responses:

• From: Srikanth (@ 161.225.48.3) on: Thu Jul 2 13:01:40 EDT 1998
  
  AYPOPAVAM - Sivaji is turning very old!...
  
  VM Better in What?....
  Only thing he has more than Kanndadasan is Ego..
  
  and few so called poetic words by him
  Eg :Veneerril Ice Kati...
  Pagalil Fire Fly...
  
  VM pavam - muthala IR jalra Ipo ARR jalra...
  Aaduthadu Yaro...
  Srikanth
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ 161.225.48.3) on: Thu Jul 2 13:01:47 EDT 1998
  
  AYPOPAVAM - Sivaji is turning very old!...
  
  VM Better in What?....
  Only thing he has more than Kanndadasan is Ego..
  
  and few so called poetic words by him
  Eg :Veneerril Ice Kati...
  Pagalil Fire Fly...
  
  VM pavam - muthala IR jalra Ipo ARR jalra...
  Aaduthadu Yaro...
  Srikanth
  
  
• From: rjay (@ 204.220.169.94) on: Fri Jul 3 05:19:29 EDT 1998
  
  I am not sure the question discusses the
  poet or the lyricist...
  
  Non-filmi Vairamuthu has done great things-
  his 'Oru kavignanin Kadhai' (life of Bharathi)
  and many of his poems (even the ones he wrote
  in Kumudam last year (especially the one on AIDS)) are gems as also many of his books.
  Even his novels are quite creative.
  
  I have not read many of KD's non-filmi works.
  His novels are horrible however.
  
  In terms of establishing a new sound - Sollatchi-
  VM has done a lot of things (just like ARR introduces new sounds). KD brought the literary simple style of old tamil back into Tamil mainstream.
  
  I am personally very disappointed by recent
  Film VM - who is resorting 100% to shock value
  statements like 50Kg Taj Mahal and Bike-il vandha nandavanam to get the kicks out of the
  listener.
  
  And last but not the least, I like VM as a person,
  much better than the indulgent, intoxicated,
  irresponsible personal side of Kannadasan.
  
  Gee! I love such open topics without any adjectives or limiting focus - I dont have to excuse myself for straying out of topic!
  
  
  
  
• From: K.Ramalingam (@ 202.54.43.188) on: Fri Jul 3 08:18:23 EDT 1998
  
  We never compare VM with KD.
  
  VM is selling his words and killing tamil.
  
  But KD is a great poet but both of did't use their
  
  skills to serve the society.
  
  
  Pattukkottai and Udumalai narayakavi are the poets who wrote with lot of social thoughts.
  
  
  
  
• From: Sathiya Keerthi (@ synergy.nus.edu.sg) on: Fri Jul 3 21:28:21 EDT 1998
  
  If you see the last few weeks' issues of 'Kungumam' magazine you
  see a lot of debate over Sivaji Ganesan's statement that 'VM could
  have beaten Kannadhasan if VM had been born earlier'. It seems a final
  word on the debate will be given in the coming week's Kungumam issue.
  I have carefully read various points mentioned there and all that I
  find are emotional statements (with one or two examples sprinkled)!
  No one is interested in actually making a comparison in an objective
  fashion! So, all that discussion in those Kungumam issues are
  pretty much useless. In this forum, mannAru started the same topic
  for discussion in Jan 98. The link is:
  
  http://newtfmpage.com/forum/7869.22:33:09.html
  
  Unfortunately, we also did not not go into an objective comparison.
  (Though, I would say we did a better job than what is in Kungumam.)
  VM better than Kannadhasan? A big joke! endra thOraNaiyilEyE
  mukkaal vaasip pEr ezhudhinaargaL. So, my feeling is that we haven't
  actually taken any effort to delve seriously into the matter. I tend
  to agree with rjay. Without a serious study we cannot simply dismiss
  off VM. In doing this serious study, we should not bring the personal
  side of the two greats. (We should exclude any arrogant statements made
  by them, the way they lived etc.) What is needed is a detailed study
  of their contributions. iruvarukkum podhuvaana ondru: thiraippadangaLil
  paadalgaL. That is also the focal point of the forum too. So why not
  form a subdivision of topics, e.g., kaadhal, thaththuvam, ilakkiyam,
  thaalaattu, samudhaayam, dhEsa otrumai, religion, sandha viLaiyaattu,
  kadhaapaaththirangaLukku Etra paadalgaL ezhudhum thiRamai, mettukku
  paattu ezhudhum thiRamai, graameeyam, aRiviyal etc., and compare the
  contributions of the two, one topic at a time? appadi naam seydhaal
  oru vELai yaar yaarai vendraar enbadhu theLivaagum. adhuvarai, yaar
  enna mudivu sonnaalum adhu veRum uNarchchimayamaana mudivu mattumE!
  
  
• From: Kanchana (@ spider-td063.proxy.aol.com) on: Fri Jul 3 23:49:30 EDT 1998
  
  Keerthi:
  I've been delving into some of VM's works recently. My personal opinion, after reading VM's essays, fiction, and poetry, is that VM has more to offer than we get to see in TFM. Even in TFM, IF given a substantive situation, VM seems to write with depth & passion, as I discovered when I was researching his kavidhaigaL on women's social issues for a different thread in DF.
  
  There are some critical factors which need to be considered IF Kannadhasan and Vairamuthu are to be compared:
  1. differences in what is the focal point of the movie in their respective eras--strong storyline/strong characters/techhnical wizadry;
  2. differences due to being constrained by an MD's pre-set tune versus a free thought flow restrained only by the lyricist's own choice of chandham/meter with some input from the MD;
  3. differences in the approach to verse composition--ilakkiyam derivatives versus pudhukkavidhai derivatives;
  4. differences in values, attitudes, lifestyles, lingo of the society at large in TN, which the movies do have to reflect or exaggerate as they attempt to cater to the "mass" audience.
  
  So, it is definitely not an apples-to-apples comparison, IMHO. The above differences do need to be factored into any comparison for any such comparison to be 100% analytical and objective. However, I'll be game to do a comparison by subtopics as you've suggested, provided you and others have the time and interest. Thoughts?
  
  
• From: Sathiya Keerthi (@ panorama.nus.edu.sg) on: Sat Jul 4 01:23:38 EDT 1998
  
  Kanchana:
  
  I fully agree with you. Because of the factors
  that you mentioned (and perhaps for more other
  reasons) the comparison is going to be difficult.
  In fact, it is not difficult to see what the
  final statement after a serious study is going
  to be: moththaththil, yaarum yaaraiyum
  vellavillai! Even then, it is still worthwhile
  to concentrate on subtopics and do a comparitive
  analysis. Who knows, we could come up with a
  bunch of specific conclusions such as..
  In philosophical songs Kannadhasan is much
  superior and VM's contribution is minimal; or,
  aRiviyal patri nandraaga sonnavar VM-thaan etc. If we can do this, then we would have achieved
  what the discussion group in 'Kungumam'
  (consisting of personalities such as Valamburi
  John and Vaishali Kannadhasan) couldn't achieve;
  such a research will be publishable and could lead
  to great exposure for the forum!
  
  I agree that unless several forumers agree to take
  part in this discussion in a serious manner, there
  is no point if just you and I write one or two views
  and the thread goes into the archive with minimal
  material. I have already informed you that I am
  returning to India in a week and, since the Internet
  connection from IISc is extremely slow and unreliable,
  my participation in the forum is going to be
  drastically cut from now on. BUT, if this
  thread takes off seriously, I will certainly
  take special effort to follow the postings and
  contribute my views.
  
  So, let's first find out if there are some serious
  forumers interested in this thread. Pagalavan,
  aruLarasan, Udhaya, NOV, Bhaskar, mannAru, PG, Prakash,
  rjay and all others... what do you all say? Are
  you seriously interested in this thread?
  
  If there is seriousness from a number of forumers,
  Kanchana: I request you to be the moderator of
  the discussions.
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ host16.globalcenter.net) on: Sun Jul 5 14:05:21 EDT 1998
  
  SK, Kanchana, and others,
  I'm ready with loaded guns and I hope objective bullets. Let's roll!
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ host16.globalcenter.net) on: Sun Jul 5 14:13:49 EDT 1998
  
  rjay,
  I appreciate your knowledge and views. But I love Kannadhaasan especially for his very public personal life. His indulgences never hurt anyone but himself. He was never irresponsible to his art, something which can't be said about VM. In a hypocritical, repressed society such as ours, I hope there are more public heroes such as Kannadhaasan whose work stands tall beyond their personal imperfections. Besides, whose personal life is perfect? We are all humans and can't afford to cast a stone at most other humans on a personal level.
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ 81.minneapolis-06.mn.dial-access.att.net) on: Sun Jul 5 14:47:09 EDT 1998
  
  Hi,
  I am also joinging the gang.
  I support what udaya says: Kannadasan life was very public , also he also wrote lyrics about his way of living "Our kopaiyelle" ,
  Why care about his personal life!...No cine personality is perfect!..
  
  Secondly, I am surprised to see many talking about works of VM....
  I am sure many of us have read "arthamulla hindu Madam" by KD, (there are many more of his work, in Kanndasan Pathipakam in Kannadasan salai in T.Nagar)
  VM is a 100% santharpa vathi.. where us KD did not care about anyone or not afraid of anyone!. He cared for only writing lyrics, also he did not even have money in his last days.
  
  As Sivaji says, I am sure if VM had born before KD, He would have wagged his tail around MGR, and would have become popular.
  
  Nilavu oru pennagi - it is a real work with excellent similies - "vU-vamai"
  Ponal pogatum poda - Thathuva paadal..
  
  Krishan Ganam - Devotional
  Have we forgotton -- "pulankuzal kotha mungilgale..." and other songs.
  
  KD has almost covered all the aspects of tamil litrature.Is there anything VM has written at least close this standard. No Way..he will be blaming at the composers and hiding behind a composer who is currently doing well.
  
  Does anyone know about VM personal life!...
  
  VM cannot be better than KANNADASAN!
  
  Srikanth
  
  
• From: Balaji (@ inet35.us.oracle.com) on: Sun Jul 5 21:02:18 EDT 1998
  
  Vairamuthu is not a lyricst by nature, but by need
  so he needs music to write lyrics for tamil music
  that it willbe the worse lyrics what we hear in
  Jeans as useless movie with useless songs. I hope
  the movie might have failed due to the bad songs
  written by Vairamuthu.
  
  Kannadasan is a genius in writing lyrics and other
  literature works.
  
  Never compare a donkey to a horse.
  
  
  

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