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ALAVANDHAAN - fails miserably?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Topic started by abhinetri (@ 202.56.193.250) on Tue Nov 13 21:04:29 EST 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

This 'so-called' film critic from REDIFF.COM says 'ABHAY' (Hindi Version of ALAVANDHAAN' is a crap movie. The link is given below...
http://www.rediff.com/entertai/2001/nov/13abhay.htm

How crucial was 'music' a crucial factor for a film like ALAVANDHAAN?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: KS (@ 165.122.128.250) on: Wed Dec 5 18:10:19 EST 2001
  
  Bharath,
  
  /*Dont we have our own views on sex which cud be expressed.*/
  
  Kupps had answered you already when he said "but refrain from discussing in public which actually proved good hitherto."
  
  /*We may agree on the same beliefs but we seem to differ in its interpretation.*/
  
  By saying interpretation is different, you mean your understanding is different which in turn implies your belief is different. I think you should understand that in this context, with interpretations being different, beliefs/values cannot be the same.
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Wed Dec 5 18:31:16 EST 2001
  
  KS,
  
  If I say I dont share Kupps belief that sex is holy then I would be incorrect! But at the same time I can differ with his view that such sacred things need not be secret but can be discussed in public.
  
  now take another analogy... as per what you are saying i should'nt be allowed to contest this topic in a public forum since this is sacred..
  
  similarly u HAVE to go public even if u have to defend. so in turn you should also refrain from publicly expressing ur dissaproval with such detailed arguments...
  
  is it correct?
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.126) on: Thu Dec 6 00:29:07 EST 2001
  
  
  now take another analogy... as per what you are saying i should'nt be allowed to contest this topic in a public forum since this is sacred..
  
  similarly u HAVE to go public even if u have to defend. so in turn you should also refrain from publicly expressing ur dissaproval with such detailed arguments...
  
  
  Bharath by discussing whether sex can be discussed in public is not discussing sex in public. Actually we, in this thread, by discussing this, have gone 1000s of years back where our forefathers and mothers discussed over years and years about "can we discuss(speak, express, have) sex in public? will it be good?". The outcome is, what is guess is, "Sex is part of our life, but there might be some disadvantage to "almost all" sects of our society. So let us decide that let us not discuss(speak, express, have) sex in public.
  
  We, since are away from such kind of deciding discussions for 1000s of years are again doing same discussion that is all. Who knows the outcome of such kind of discussion could be "yes! we can do free-sex" and our next generation may or may not endorse it based on their experience.
  
  Since you say that you share atleast a part of similar opinion of mine, i think you won't think me as fundamentalist or weired when i say that still i honour, hold in esteem the decision of our forefathers and mothers of "not discussing sex in public".
  
  You asked "are all holy things to be kept secret?". First of all let me say whether my translation "holy" was correct. I'm not good at vocabulary. But assuming that it conveys my intended meaning. Then let me once again reiterate that "not discussing in public" does not necessarily mean "secret". Secret, in my view, is something like :
  
  I am a scientist and i have a splendid formula for something. If i don't wish to share that formula with anybody then it is secret. Whereas if the same formula is known to all "eligibles" and they refrain from discussing in public is not keeping it secret.
  
  Now comes the question what do i mean by all eligibles? Here those who are inclined in scientific mentality and pursue in scientific advancements are deemed as eligibles. Whereas, in public, commoners like Kuppu, an idiot, some X a terrorist and ordinaries and intelligents like Y and Bharath will be present. So discussing this may go harmful. Why to take risk for the sake of taking it. So let us not discuss it in public. This is what precisly happened to "discussion of sex in public" in india(i guess).
  
  Hope i confused you all more.
  
  Enjoy being confused.
  
  
• From: mahabs (@ 203.197.138.163) on: Thu Dec 6 08:43:57 EST 2001
  
  what is so holy about sex? it is a feeling like hunger. in this era romanticism has lost its values. kamal is not the person to blame. you can blame bagyaraj and many others.
  
  imho, sex discussion among public is going on. it is just that we pretend not to be aware of it.
  
  rather, the discussion should be the proper of ways of discussing it. not because it is holy, but it has the potential to change a culture, even the human race.
  
  anbudan
  
  mahabs
  
  
• From: KS (@ 165.122.128.250) on: Thu Dec 6 11:43:24 EST 2001
  
  Kupps,
  
  that was quite convincing:)
  
  Bharath,
  
  /*similarly u HAVE to go public even if u have to defend. */
  
  the need for us to go public to defend arises "only when we are questioned against our belief" - only when some people (should i say 'like you'?:)) go public and say that it is better to discuss (speak, express, have) sex in public.
  
  I feel 2 things can happen here:
  1) people like us CAN GO public, and be successful in defending (which is less likely to happen), or, fail.
  2) if majority of the people think that it is better to discuss sex in public or if their voice is more than ours (implies, they may not be in majority) things will change (which is what is more likely to happen if the current trend prevails:()
  
  Unfortunately, if you look at it closely, the people who raise this question are our own people and almost all (majority) of them belong to this generation of ours...most likely contradicting their parents' views.
  
  Anyway, i don't think it is good to discuss all this here for long:) But finally, all that i'll say is people can, given the fact that they "live in India and have their own faith and culture", give it a thought and try to feel how comfortable they and their dear ones would feel discussing it amongst themselves or with their friends/relatives/aquaintances. That should give a fair opinion as to what is right or wrong for them.
  
  (PS: Bharath, you can give ur opinion on this if you feel like. I promise to read but not respond:) b'cos we should not be discussing this here. sure u'll understand)
  
  
• From: Vimal (@ 143.182.246.27) on: Thu Dec 6 12:53:02 EST 2001
  
  Dudes,
  As the person who started this argument, let me say that my point was not about Sex is holy or not.... lets not try to go Dr.Mathrubootham's way!! My point is this: Kamal should realize that he is too old to do stuffs like what he does, and it pathetically reflects his perverted mind. To cite another example, his scenes with Revathi in Devarmagan..she is married to this poor guy Suresh Menon.. would the thought have even occured to Kamal?? Why does he want to be so explicit??
  
  Kamal has created this artificial image about himself, thanks to our(the public) gullibility. When asked about his favorite director, he would say "Akiro Kurasawa"..etc, knowing very well that most of the public would not even have heard of that name. Once in some TV interview about "Kurudhipunal", he was saying, "Eppadi BILL GATES endra oru adhibar INTEL endra oru niruvanatthai arambitharo adhe pola....yada yada..". Such a pseudo-intellectual, an idiot!!
  
  He should realize that movies don't have to be very strong and complicated to get recognitions. "Life is beautiful" is a simple movie, with no special effects..no big sets...a simple movie with wonderful acting. A serious movie, taken in a very light-hearted way. Kamal should change his methodology. Forget Oscars, he won't win an award even in an Asian festival.
  
  
  
• From: kuruvi (@ 134.113.201.4) on: Thu Dec 6 13:48:10 EST 2001
  
  Adeyangappa
  Alavandhakull ippadi oru interesting discussions
  I agree with vimal point.
  Malai vizhungki mahadevan madri producer panathai sappittum padam kodumaiya irruku.
  Btw how will poor director krishna feel ,becoz eveywhere kamal is getting the rap and even reviews they dont even mention Suresh Krishna is the director of the movie its kamal all the way
  Sabash
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Thu Dec 6 13:49:04 EST 2001
  
  1) I am not advocating that free sex be encouraged in India. And people should be discussing it with their parents children etc.
  
  2) such happen no where in the world not even in the stereo typed version of sex land america.
  
  3) I think kamal in his movies shows something that happen in daily life. (yes kissing, pregnancy b4 marriage included) . some of what he shows may be rare in daily life but neverthless it happens.
  
  4) his aim is not as complex as it make it all to be.. he may after all be just doing sensationalism.. but to give balance to the argument and some credit to the guy, he is blatantly violating our long held views that we can do it in private and still pretend to the outside world that nothing of that sort is existent.
  
  5) In rural India the concept that sex is purely for child birth only still exists.
  
  6) my point doesnt advocate TALKING and DISCUSSING sex all the time but a democracy of simply acknowledging that it exists and what kamal shows is prevalant.
  
  7) the noise created about some intangible RULES that kamal had violated by showing sex scenes is not valid. Vijay's character ahd sex with his girlfriend in an unsafe time of a womens periodic cylce and hence she got pregnant. Its as simple as that.
  
  8) The argument that kamals kissing and other scenes are DELIBERATE is also not valid. EVERYTHING in a movie is deliberate. Its an artificial world to potray reality mixed with imagination . He neednt follow any set of rules to confirm to "Indian" beliefs.
  
  //"he would say "Akiro Kurasawa"..etc, knowing very well that most of the public"//
  
  I agree u dont like kamal but if u had seen akiro kurosawa's movies u wud see Kamal and MR heavily lifting from some concepts..
  
  //"his scenes with Revathi in Devarmagan..she is married to this poor guy Suresh Menon.."//
  
  she knew what the movie contained! she should have denied acting as another persons wife if she felt it was violating her married life with suresh menon.
  
  Hemam malini didnt let her daughter act. Its the movie profession Revathi knows abt it. She is a professional doing it for the money and also for her love for the art. Dont talk as if kamal forced her into this in Gun Point!
  
  
  //"Unfortunately, the people who raise this question are our own people and almost all (majority) of them belong to this generation of ours"//
  
  we question our beliefs thats the natural concept of evolution! A lot of parent's theories are being questioned now. Yes! Maybe this "sex is better left private talk" theory may not have any benefits if its questiond and challenged. But that doesnt give it immunity from being questioned.
  
  //"give it a thought and try to feel how comfortable they and their dear ones would feel discussing it amongst themselves or with their friends/relatives/aquaintances"//
  
  a lot of people do and there is nothing wrong in 2 mature people talking! come on! we talked for so long and did u see anyone being immature or something bad happening.
  
  see this is what I object to .. no one is goin to walk upto their dad and ask him abt the complex interworkings of sexual intercourse. discussions are always in the same age groups . why confuse one with the other. cinema isnt neccesarily seen with parents.
  
  
  //". I promise to read but not respond:) b'cos we should not be discussing this here"//
  
  //", i don't think it is good to discuss all this here for long:) "//
  
  if its because its tfm page and its supposed be abt music then I understand.. but if its because discussion of sex is taboo.. i frankly am insulted...because nothing profane or adult oriented has been mentioned so far all that has happened was a discussion of sex as an issue and not its details...
  
  
• From: vimal (@ 143.182.246.27) on: Thu Dec 6 16:12:00 EST 2001
  
  Bharath,
  Sex should be a taboo, atleast too much sex. I don't mean that in a "Talibanic" way, but if you think about it, most of the problems in the (social)world owe their origins to sex. Free sex in society leads to a devasted family system. A society without morality will not be nice to live in. If you think about it, each and every (authentic) religion in the world taboos sex before marriage, infact abstinence is encouraged the most!! I am not preaching philosophy, but I am talking practicality.
  
  Children should be children, but thanks to the present media, they mature into adults (atleast mentally) at a quite early age!! They end up knowing things which they shouldn't, atleast at their age. I am not being specific to Kamal, like I had written earlier, the entire film industry is filled with perverts. Kamal tops the list without a challenge, thats all. He should learn from Rajini about gracefully accepting old age, Rajini is still forced to dance around trees, but his (physical) interaction with a heroine is minimal.
  
  
  

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