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ARR's Motivation, Strategy & Ingenuity different from IR's and outlasts KR's or YSR's

Topic started by Raja Fan (@ 172.173.66.66) on Tue Oct 16 02:05:01 EDT 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I have only just a few days back heard Puthiya Mugam and Thiruda, Thiruda songs with pure attention for the first time. Believe it or not! It has changed my perception of ARR totally. However, i also became eager to explore most of his other compositions. Did not get the consistency that TT/PM must have heralded. Most of the songs of other movies beside a few classic works were kind or random attempts at coming up with some trump card or ace up the sleeve, classic songs like Puthum Pudhu Vendum, Netru Illadha Maatram, Kannum Kannum, Raasathi spilleth over with originality, energy, innovation and universal appeal. And, there are many songs that appear to be amalgams of various romantic ballads (best example is: Arisal Tharisal in Taj Mahal), pop hits, waltzes, spanish tango, our own old Tamil classic songs, bits from a old Hindi song, the underlying theme was what motivates ARR to be what he is, either amazing originality and universal appeal or cut and paste tactics. And, how ARR's music sound so original overall and seems to have totally antiquated every other Indian film music? And, also why did not IR have the same strategies and ingenuity as ARR as explained above? What was IR's motivation and how is ARR's Ingenuity much more necessary for success in today's than IR's creativity (original of all original composers) and why do KR and YSR lag behind heavily in their ability to amaze the audience like ARR does. I will give outline of my analysis of ARR' approach: First of all, we must not forget that ARR had huge international exposure (and to very up and coming genres world-wide) at a very early age when IR at the age was performing in folk programs across south India. So, he knew to what sounds international audience do not squirm in their seats! Plus, his audience base was international then and there. IR, KR & YSR did not have that grounding at all in my understanding. There basically tells you about what ARR is composed of. His motivation? He wants the richness of Indian film music appreciated world wide. His ingenuity: the ability to accept for himself that he can kick the age-old belief of all Indian composers that being original is the best modus operandi for sustained creativity. ARR turned that upside down and said I love a lot of music, why not incorporate that or use those to develop different variations of those melodies (the TK Mahalingam classic in Jodi is an example)ARR has done that in an ongoing basis as I am checking out most of his songs, I find so much familiar material!!!!!! IR, MSV and others would have shuddered at the thought of doing what ARR. This is ARR's strategy along with the thought that music can be more simple with less notes in the main melody, very strong melody structure so that does aaway with the need for interludes etc.. IR himself has once said that if the melody is good then he would not waste too much time on interludes and preludes! (But, he practiced that very rarely even for excellent melodies, he had extraordinary interludes just the same he gave for insipid melodies) There is so much I am discovering about ARR and it is very inspiring because I too would do the same today. As Anuradha Sriram once said that with the right background anyone can become an ARR and IR. However, I disagree that anyone can become an IR (Lalgudi said, IR is culmination of countless births living in music!!) Even though IR's motivation did not have such a national or global scale as ARR's IR belief was in originality. His western classical influence did not show as Mozart or Bach in his songs, but ARR's do. His music has Beethoven, Vivaldi maybe some Opera works or other classical composers! So is another ARR possible? Yes, very possible. (Just follow this strategy of turning all accepted beliefs and standards upside down coupled with extraordinary exposure you can be an ARR.) In fact, I believe ARR is only the beginning of a cultural musical phenomena maybe could be called the Enlightened Mod Rhythm era or something we are going to witness in the decades to come. Just as IR was the end of the era of 50 or so years of a final stage of the Melodic Romance Period of Indian Film Music by combining all styles heralding a new age phenomenon called Ilayaraaja style!! Any opinions about ARR' Strategy, Ingenuity and Motivation versus IRs? And, do you think KR and YSR match up at all with ARR's ingenuity, because they do not apparently have the motivation and strategy as ARRs? If anyone knows their opinions on ARR's cut and paste songs, please input here. I have to hear some more lefft out movies.. so i will fill in. This is not ARR and IR debate, please please note. This is only what IR missed out in motivation and what ARR will be able to achieve in the future based on his past and other issues discussed above. In fact, I am an ARR Fan already!!!!!

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Responses:

• From: Karthik S (@ 164.164.82.29) on: Tue Oct 16 02:51:15 EDT 2001
  
  Great writing. Maybe you have been able to pin point on what is it that makes ARR's music succeed. But is IR's present day music redundant in this period of time? true, they dont seem to evoke the same reactions as they did earlier in the 80s (at least to me), but has IR's brand of music lost its novelty value now?
  
  KR and YSR, IMO are having the same pattern of music like ARR does. Even HJ. While they can be mere clones of ARR, they have to rise much much above the oridinary to re-invent the wheel in a different form. Like ARR was drastically different from IR in terms of technique and pattern, these 3 have to turn what ARR has done, upside down....all IMO, of course!
  
  
• From: Raja Fan (@ 172.173.66.66) on: Tue Oct 16 03:12:15 EDT 2001
  
  Karthik, ARR has got all the information to derive a formulae for success. One key thing is: Today's audience is not audience of IR, MSV, SG, TRM, TB or Subbiah Naidu or GR or who watch Sivaji or Chandrababu. Fortunately for Indian music lovers, we have ARR who travelled around the world with Zakir Hussain and Kunnakudi etc.. at a very early age. There he got used to the ideaa that real success is in satisfying to a diverse audience all over the world not just in Tamilnadu and not just in India all at the same time. But how? Our film music is region specific with a distinct regional flavor and that cannot sell abroad or even all over India. ARR saw IR fail in his attempts to please Hindi audiences. Plus, IR's music lacked the punch in the rhythm to appeal to the younger audience. ARR got all this experience plus working in advertising environment he knew how to deliver a quick punch in a tune. IR in the latter 80s began to ramble and his tunes were long winded with unnecessary notes. Look at examples of the youthful zest in these songs which I have not seen come from IR and if we take the song Raja, Rajadhi Rajan Indha Raja that is a product of very bad information on Raja's part on producing beatsy songs for the future generation. However, the real success of ARR is his ability to bring amazing and highly developed melodies with very few notes (and compared to what IR did)even to a rhythm song. ARR's success is the quality of his melody and the amazing ability to combine extraordinary melody with youthful rhythm. Songs like July Maadham, Kannum Kannum, Chootta Chotta, Poonthendrele, Enna Moham, Ooh Lala, Jeeva, Azhagan Ratchasiye etc... speak volumes for this young man's genius. At the same time, IR may seem dated for those who have not grown up with his music and maybe to some who have outgrown his music. There are times when i don't listen to MSV, IR, RDB, SC and so on that i don't care for their music. But, when i play them, that thought is weak. But, ARR is fantastic and is purely the result of information about his audiences gained from extraordinary exposure and experiences internationally and in the advertising world. That is why i say ARR's Ingenuity (we know his creativity is not intuition or natural) while IR is purely a creative genius, the last of his kind, I would imagine! Regards, KR, YSR and HJ they are getting the information from ARR for lack of exposures to different environments like that of IR and ARR. So, naturally they become clones. YSR is young, he can still pursue experiences before getting into serius composing.
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Tue Oct 16 04:18:40 EDT 2001
  
  My thoughts exactly Raja Fan...IMO Raja is a different generation as you've already said in a different way and ARR is like today's generation.
  Of course, music has no boundaries and should appeal to all...IR is a classicist at heart and nothing can change that - his compositions take root in Carnatic imbibed with Western Classical nuanes and Classic Rock (if required)...that itself provides a huge world to be explored...but to make it sound contemporary is the challenge and I don't think he is too impressed with today's music to try any serious innovations to get accepted...
  
  
• From: Karthik S (@ 164.164.82.29) on: Tue Oct 16 04:43:56 EDT 2001
  
  I always tend to use the word 'curiosity gnanam' while explaining my knowledge of carnatic classical music. Can we assume that ARR's success is an amalgamation of curiosity-gnanam (or even kelvi gnanam) and a very good knowledge of his target audience? The definition of target audience was very different in case of IR and now, ARR. Is that what differentiates their music so diametrically?
  
  Being an MBA I do tend to get into the MBA-mode of thinking! :-)
  
  
• From: Madhav (@ 213.1.66.101) on: Tue Oct 16 04:56:09 EDT 2001
  
  In response to the above posting I would like to show my disappointment at yet another person jumping on the ARR bandwagon.I don't deny that ARR does good music, but he merely incorporates music from cultures all around the world.I don't think that this puts him on any footing to be compared with IR or that he is doing much better than IR.I will give you a low down on all of the MD's mentioned in the above postings.
  THIS IS ALL IMHO
  ARR
  ARR is achieving such a mass market in India because many of the people there don't have such an exposure to western forms of music. ARR caters mainly for the layman in India.I feel that if I wanted to hear Bach or Beethoven, I will listen to the original.I don't need to hear bits and pieces of a great composition that ARR has cut and pasted into his songs.I feel that this doesn't do justice to the originals and also ARR may think that some of the audience are not noticing that he is lifting. I feel that ARR is classifeid as a MD.In order to be an MD your music should be original and composed solely by you. I find this lacking in ARR. ALthough his music is pleasant to hear, there are not enough intricacies in his compositions.ARR has a good publicist and therefore he has his face plastered across every paper and magazine around the time of his releases. As for motivation, It is money.Please don't be fooled into thinking that ARR is doing it for the betterment of music.IF this was the case, he would stop transferring songs from HIndi to Tamil and vice versa. To think that anyone can charge 1Cr for a movie is absurd, No music is worth that much..
  
  IR
  He truly is one of the greatest MD's ever.Even now, my 3 year old daughter gets up and dances to IR's old compositions. IR has composed his songs in a way that leave a long lasting impression on your mind and you can hear them for many years to come.I feel that many people just don't understand the complexity of this greats music.Maybe people are too young these days and therefore say that he is old and in his downfall. Even to look at Sethu, how many MD's could instil the feelings and mood changes shown through the music in this film. It sent shivers down my spine as the BGM and the track were all simply spectacular.Most people look at IR on a personal level commenting on his character and behaviour but of all the people posting these comments, how many actually know the great IR? Nobody will ever come close to the contribution of IR to TFM.I feel his motivation is solely for the betterment of music but also slightly to promote Bhava as otherwise she would not be given chance to sing anywhere.
  
  KR
  KR has some good stuff in his music but what he mainly lacks is, consistency. Some of his tracks are wonderful number and some are terrible.I don't feel that KR follows ARR's style in any way.I feel that KR tends to stick more to IR style by concentrating on complexity in his music. DDD was a great effort and the BGM was very good to and this is why he recieved the CE award for MD of the year.He also does not recieve much publicity and I feel he doesn't have much motivation in the music field.
  
  HJ
  HJ, what can I say?If people out there are stupid enough to pay to hear recycled rubbish that we have already paid good money to hear from ARR, then HJ will be a popular MD.Why do you think that people are flocking to HJ?It is just because ARR is slowly cutting down on his Tamil projects so they need the closest to ARR as possible. HJ has absolutely no substance to his music and he is merely a product of great marketing. HJ's motivation is money otherwise he wouldn't charge such high prices to churn out old music with no individuality or originality at all. I don't feel HJ will last in TFM for long because his music sucks big time.
  
  YSR
  YSR is the only upcoming MD who I feel has what it takes to be another ARR or IR. This doesn't mean that he will be better or I am comparing him to them, but he can become equally famous and contribute just as much to TFM.His music is solid with good orchestration and composition. His music is original and unique but also has a mixture of western and international music. His positive attribute is that although he tries international styles of music, we don't hear traces of any other compositions.We don't get a sense of Deju'vu when hearing his tracks. Thulluvadho Elamai is the perfect example of a quality album by YSR.We had a range of styles of music in this and I heard from friends that it is the biggest selling album abroad currently and mainly in UK.I think this is because the song Ithu Kathala used a popular style of british music called Garage. I believe that the motivation YSR has in music is to introduced more and more diversity to TFM.He has brought that youthfulness to TFM and he will be a long lasting impact on the industry. His negative strategy which has been mentioned by many people before is that he doesn't have nearly as much pulicity or marketing as he requires.In order for YSR to make the transition into becoming as popular as HJ or ARR, he needs to be all over the paper and magazines and needs to be giving solid interviews all over the media.This it he X Factor that is holding his career back right now.If he fixes this small error, he will surely outlast any MD in TFM because his music has the ingenuity required to succeed.
  
  Please note this is all IMHO and I mean no offence to anyone else
  
  
• From: kk (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Tue Oct 16 11:00:52 EDT 2001
  
  can you guys try smaller paras?
  
  

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