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How come people dont like IR's music?

Topic started by x (@ 209.47.143.226) on Thu Sep 19 13:48:54 EDT 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

It has been bothering me for a long long long time...How come people dont like IR's songs?

I can understand and accept to some extend that a lot of people don't appreciate IR's music in the last few years...for obvious reasons. But it's so hard for me to believe that in many other TFM threads, people say that IR has been a disgrace to TFM, IR's pre 92 songs sucked etc.. etc... How in the world is it possible for them not to like IR's songs of 70's 80's and early 90's??? Do they bash IR just to piss off IR fans and me the ARR fans happy? I just want to know.

So I started this thread for those who think IR is not a great MD in their openion.. Pl note that this thread is NOT for bashing IR. If you honestly think that IR's earlier songs do not appeal to you then explain why. Forget about his latest songs. I am talking about his 70's and 80's. Seriously, guys give your true comment, technically, non-technically on each of the following songs that make it not so great in your openion. Or comment on any other song that became a big hit but did not deserve to be a hit in your openion.

1. andhi mazhai pozhigirathu - raaja parvai
2. aanandha raagam -- all songs
3. nizhalgal
4. ninaivellam nithya
5. azhage unnai aaradhikkiren
6. vaa ponn mayile - poondhalir
7. ilamai kaalangal
8. sindhu bhairavi
9. rasathi onna - vaidehi kathirundal
10.aval appadhithan songs
11.kavikkuyil
12.partha vizhi - guna
13.sangeetham megam - udhaya geetham
14.songs from idhaya koil
15.agni natchathiram songs
16.yamunai atrile - thalabathi
17.engengo sellum - pattakkathi bhairavan
18.kanmani nee vara - thendarale ennai thodu
19.thalayai kunium thamaraye - oru odai nadhiyagirathu
20.meen kodi theril - karumbu vill
21.poo pole un - kavariman
22.nenjathai killathey
23.mayile mayile - kadavul amaitha medai
24.manjal nilavukku - mudhal iravu
25.mouna ragam songs.


Man, I can't list them all. It's too tiring.... so I stop here.

2 humble requests:

1. Please no fights.
2. Please dont criticise IR or anyone personally. Just talk about music alone.

I am aware that people below 20 yrs old may not have heard the above songs. Those people (or anybody who haven't heard a lot of IR songs), pl dont pass any comments bcos you are expected to have anything to say.

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Responses:

• From: x (@ 209.47.143.226) on: Thu Sep 19 13:51:38 EDT 2002
  
  correction
  
  "Do they bash IR just to piss off IR fans and me the ARR fans happy? "
  
  to read as
  "Do they bash IR just to piss off IR fans and to make the ARR fans happy? "
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Venki (@ 192.127.94.7) on: Thu Sep 19 14:05:35 EDT 2002
  
  Well X! There are two reasons for why there are IR bashers.
  
  1. They have not listned to IR Songs.
  2. They are upset because IR still gets a lot of praise than ARR.
  
  It never bothers me when I see IR bashers, because they simply don't know the greatness of Raaja.
  
  
• From: Muse - ic (@ 161.181.53.10) on: Thu Sep 19 14:07:42 EDT 2002
  
  'IR still gets a lot of praise than ARR' ???????
  Kidding ?????
  
  
  
• From: IR Fan (@ 63.201.144.200) on: Thu Sep 19 14:14:29 EDT 2002
  
  Most of the people who like ARR music are immature teens. They are never exposed to IR's music. All they do is post some nonsense against IR. Most of them do not have music sense. There is simply no other reason of their silly posts. Best thing to do - ignore them. Let those kids shout as much as they can. They are not going to change the way people admire IR's music.
  
  
• From: x (@ 209.47.143.226) on: Thu Sep 19 14:22:38 EDT 2002
  
  IR Fan
  I don't want to assume that ARR fans are either immature teens or dont have music sense.. Sorry, that's a bit harsh on your part.. The whole purpose of this thread is to find out why ARR fans/music listeners generally cannot appreciate IR's music.. This thread is mainly for IR bashers to put their views..
  
  
• From: Awe (@ 65.69.45.141) on: Thu Sep 19 14:41:05 EDT 2002
  
  Mr.x recently there was a poll conducted by Kumudam.. who is better IR or ARR?
  
  There must have been 100s of of responses.. 95% of people said.. It is an insult to IR to compare him with a novice composer.. That is the reality.
  But here in TFM.. one person takes multiple names and tries to create an illusion that ARR has more fans.. Effectively there are only 4 or 5 of them here. Some are fans of both IR and ARR. If you take IR bashers alone they will be very very less.
  How do you explain to people who say Salangai Oli songs are crap? There won't be possibly a better way than this to expose one's ignorance of music.
  So it is just to annoy IR fans.
  
  
• From: Enakku Idli Vendum (@ 64.156.203.91) on: Thu Sep 19 14:54:20 EDT 2002
  
  To Appreciate IR songs..
  
  "Adhukellam gnanam vendu gnanam vendum doi.. dei gnana prakasam unna koopudrangada"
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Thu Sep 19 15:37:46 EDT 2002
  
  Awe..you decided not to heed my request. You seem to know a lot about IR songs and I would like to hear your take on them than you wasting your time in provoking other people.
  Anyways, here is my take on this -
  * every new generation wants to listen to a different kind of music than what their parents listened to ..just youthful rebelliousness
  * IR has been around and his style/arrangements have become familiar (inspite of him reinventing himself so many times)
  * he still believes in giving importance to melody more than the rhythm. TFM started by lightening up classical music and IR continues to do that. Even now his melodies or rAgam based songs have a traditional tabla arrangement. This I think he does to appeal to the classically oriented. But probably not going down well with the younger generation. For eg. all songs in mouna rAgam are drums/guitar based than the nilAvE vaa.
  * his songs are also done with a WCM orientation..kinda like various movements..the interludes especially..but this is not something will appeal to casual listeners (I have seen people here in TFM, specifically mention that IR should continue the rhythm throughout the interludes. But this is something boring to IR, I think, and he does this only for dance/fast songs).
  * quite a few people have some snobbish attitude of not listening to pure Indian sounds..they dont understand the totally english songs as well..so they support some 'stylised' tamil songs :(
  * the lyrics in IR songs are not as 'trendy' too.
  * and ARR is not bad :)
  
  
• From: Awe (@ 65.69.44.15) on: Thu Sep 19 16:27:27 EDT 2002
  
  " the lyrics in IR songs are not as 'trendy' too"
  
  - What is the current trend ?
  
  1) Pronouncing Illamai as elemai by some female singer? Is that what you are saying?
  
  2) Adding words like Sanfrancisco, Texas, 50 KG Taj Mahal, Rhyming Niagara with Viagara(poor taste). Grossly Comparing manisha's As* with the famous Tabla of Zakkir Hussain, Insipidly comparing laugh with telephone ring.. so lyrics are nothing but disgusting these days. If this is the trend for heaven's sake let Illayaraj not score music for those lyrics.
  
  " * quite a few people have some snobbish attitude of not listening to pure Indian sounds..they dont understand the totally english songs as well..so they support some 'stylised' tamil songs :( "
  "
  
  - This is one point i agree with. I have listened to 1000s of english songs. So when i listen to those so called 'stylised' tamil songs, i am forced to look down upon them. Because there is no energy and verve in vocals. KJY and SPB sang their songs with such clarity and grace. Look at today's singers. I was in India when the movie Mask was released. I think that is the first movie which was dubbed in Tamil. The same feeling i have listening to these 'stylized(?)' songs. In my view IR is a man for all seasons. Being a man who dedicated his life to music, do you think IR won't be updating his knowledge? With Karthik Raja and Yuvan Shankar around do you think IR will close his ears to modern trend? Probably he would have listened to more Jazz music and other genre music than any of us can ever imagine. It is just that he doesn't want to mislead TFM into a wrong direction. I don't want IR to score 'teeny pop' songs like what we are getting now. I hate to see him coming down from his level to give these craps. I like him for raising the standard of average listener in TN. In 'Pani Vizhum MalarVanam' songs there is an interlude he plays exactly 13 times. We counted that number way back in 80s.. I write that count number from my memory. We were also teenagers once. But the way we appreciated the songs are very different from the way current teenagers appreciate songs.
  
  
  
  
• From: UV (@ 134.113.4.168) on: Thu Sep 19 17:26:16 EDT 2002
  
  awe we are all growing up,getting old
  :)
  I cant stand to listen modern britny kind of pop or rock but get 'awed' musically when listening to the great 80s songs both pop and rock
  
  grow up :)
  cheers
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Thu Sep 19 19:27:56 EDT 2002
  
  UV..the current POP music is a cheap alternative to the fantastic rhythms of classical rock. If you want the old style rhythm listen to 'kochu kochu santhoshangal'.
  Awe..you probably dont know my inclinations towards music :)
  
  
• From: Nazir (@ 172.139.235.241) on: Thu Sep 19 20:51:51 EDT 2002
  
  I dont think any one can hate IR music. A true music lover will always love his good songs.
  But what me and other fans do not like is the unnecessary criticizing of the so called IR fans about other MDs. They need not have to appreciate others music but the least they can do is not show their hatred in different 'avatars'. If this stops then i assure you there would be much more peace and harmony in the forum
  
  
• From: God (@ 161.142.100.86) on: Thu Sep 19 21:09:36 EDT 2002
  
  Frankly speaking, only about 5% of IR songs are reasonably good. It is just by sheer numbers that he has given some good hits. If you make 1000 songs, chances are 5% of them will click and that is what IR has done. Because he was doing the music almost exclusively for over ten years, the number is large and by proportion, there are also some good numbers, which have overshadowed the majority of lousy songs.
  
  You can't really blame him as only if it is in the pot will it come out in the ladle.
  Just like instant food, which is dished out at super speed, which can only fill the tummy without the joy of a good meal, IR's songs filled the movies in the 80s, but were hardly what you would call good songs.
  
  Ratio wise, a good comparison for IR would be today's Sirpy.
  
  
• From: Awe (@ 65.69.59.180) on: Thu Sep 19 21:11:10 EDT 2002
  
  Ok here is some suggestions.. Listen to the songs
  .. The Corrs - Breathless, Vanessa Carlton - Thousand Miles(not great but ok) , Jewels' standing still, Enya - Only time, May it be(Lord of the rings soundtrack) composed by her.. oscar nominated this year. Just listen to the vocal.. practically there is no music, Beat songs like Shakiras suerte, Kylie Minogue's Outta My head, Pink's get the party started, Nelly's Turn off the lights (it was very good on the first listen) ... you can listen for a month or so.. then it will be boring.. But 80s are classier than 90s and 00s. Queen 'rocked' in 80s. So was Michael Jackson, George Michael. Eurtymics.. Flashdance, Dirty Dancing, Against All odds, Purple Rain all those soundtracks came in 80s. One thing keep in mind man.. You may get old.. but your sense of music never gets older.. Just like Very old men still follow cricket and talk about Yuvaraj singh, you can still follow modern music and appreciate it. In the year 2000 No.1 song was Cher's 'Do you believe'. It also won MTV's best dance song award. She has been singing for four decades. Still she is remembered for her song 'I got you babe' which she sang way back in 1965. That song was used in the movie 'Groundhog Day' where the hero wakes up everyday and finds that everyday is Febraury 2. Every he is woken up by that song from Alarm radio. Here they treasure 60s,70s,80s song. In digital cable they have seperate channels for 70s songs 80s songs 60s songs. They don't just die. They will be always in our memory.. just like chandrababu's songs.
  
  
• From: Awe (@ 65.69.59.180) on: Thu Sep 19 21:14:41 EDT 2002
  
  Here is one 'genius' named "God" has come.. You cannot withstand intellectual discussions. So better go take a hike to ARR's fan club.. If IR is sirpy your guru ARR would be electric train beggar.
  
  

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