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Why ARR's BGM is still bad even after 10 years??!!

Topic started by Saran (@ 164.164.46.20) on Thu Apr 25 06:53:28 EDT 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Surprising! Even after 10years, ARR still a kid in BGM. Even in his latest KM, BGM lacks a lot. Especially in the scenes where the BGM need to lift the scene. Does his musical talent is LIMITED only to the songs or his CREATIVITY misses something whenever it comes to BGM or does he need MUCH MORE TIME to compose it? Yeah, i agree perceptions differ. Lets see how it goes.....

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Responses:

• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.126) on: Thu Apr 25 07:44:02 EDT 2002
  
  BAD? I don't think so...
  
  If you are comparing his BGM with that of IR then that is not needed coz IR has proved that he is a genius in that forte. But when compared to other MDs of thamizh, including the much hyped BGM capabilities of HJ, i guess ARR's BGMs are far better. However Karthik Raja's Dum^3 BGM was better than ARRs but cannot vouch for KR or YSR coz not seen much movies from them.
  
  ARR has evolved a lot from his first film to now. Remember that awkward BGM he scored when people abduct rishi(arvind swamy) in front of his wife roja (madhubala). He replayed chinna chinna aasai. From that point when we see the BGM of KM the quality and creativity is very high. He is still a top MD with respect to BGM. Heard that his BGM was great in Earth, Lagaan and all (i haven't seen those movies). But yes, we expect more from him, but IMO his BGMs are not Bad.
  
  
• From: ROTFL (@ 203.106.140.21) on: Thu Apr 25 07:45:45 EDT 2002
  
  ARR's BGM is very apt for the movie situations. Kannathil Muthamittaal had the best BGM in recent times.
  
  Generally people's perceptions are based on what they are used to. For instance a person living in a remote village may look down on people's living style in the city.
  
  But that does not mean that the urban living style is inadequate. It is just that people living in the city have outgrown their village living. Some villagers continue living and enjoying village style. And when they pass statements like "only village living is good" we can only pity them. :)
  
  
• From: nvd (@ 210.195.30.36) on: Thu Apr 25 08:23:40 EDT 2002
  
  Rahman's BGM at the climax scene in KM where the child is separated from her mother on her own will...that part of the BGM is good. I wonder it would be better off if it's by our IR? anyway, salute to ARR for his efforts. COMPARISON KILLS INNOVATION...
  
  
• From: yaaro (@ 195.93.50.184) on: Thu Apr 25 09:16:01 EDT 2002
  
  ROTFL,
  all this sounds impressive-but has no bearing to the topic.nowhere has saran mentioned anyone else's name and here you go rambling about city dwellers and villagers.and this thing about villagers looking down on city people-you must indeed come from a posh village.I always thought it was the city dwellers who look down on the country chaps.I assume villagers equates we poor IR fans and city savvy folk are you ARR fans(yes,yes-I know you have not mentioned names).have you heard about nennappu pozhappa kedutha kadhai.man,you do live in your dream world.even ARR fans have complained how he used sundari song in a very inappropriate situation in KM.oru paanai sotrukku oru soru padham.
  ARR is capable of good BGM,(I KK,rhythm and Minsarakanavu)-but he does not have the time i suppose.
  
  
• From: ROTFL (@ 203.106.140.156) on: Thu Apr 25 10:06:46 EDT 2002
  
  yaaro
  
  You are the guy who bought the Greatest Contribution of Ilayaraaja line, hook and bait?
  Gnyaabagam irukkaa? :)
  Enough said.
  
  IR being the only one who can do good BGM is a myth. It is about time some one came and broke the bubble.
  
  
• From: S (@ 128.107.253.44) on: Thu Apr 25 10:55:08 EDT 2002
  
  ROTFL,
  >>It is about time some one came and broke the bubble.<<
  
  The problem is no one has done it yet...and till date arr seems to be far from it.
  
  As kupps said, his bg score has improved quite a bit...From using a flute for a fight sequence, he has come quite a long way...His BG score for 1947 earth was quite good. Deva too is reasonably good in the BG Score dept.
  
  I'm yet to see a kalapani/idhayam/idhayathai thirudAdhEy from arr.
  
  The thing i hate the most with his BG score is the scream he fills in whenever he doesn't know how to handle the scene.Indian had N such instances...
  
  On the +ve side, the thiruda thiruda theme was quite good...the variation of which was used in the opening scene of muthu (oruvan oruvan)
  
  
• From: ROTFL (@ 203.106.140.156) on: Thu Apr 25 11:03:56 EDT 2002
  
  S
  
  I respect your opinion and won't argue with it although my opinion differs.
  
  However here is another angle on IR's BGM. (I am talking purely IR here without any comparison).
  
  Wasn't Kalapani dubbed into Tamil? It was the worse case of BGMing. If Sivaji was accused of overacting, in many instances, IR has been guilty of over-BGMing. His best pieces were in his earlier movies like Alaigal Oivathillei and Kavari Maan.
  
  As for the present days, our tastes have evolved and what was accepted in the past is sometimes no longer relevant. We need to stop living in the past.
  
  
• From: Common Friend (@ 203.197.141.186) on: Thu Apr 25 12:41:54 EDT 2002
  
  >>>If Sivaji was accused of overacting, in many instances, IR has been guilty of over-BGMing
  
  Might be true to a large extend. I too have similar feelings, but all said and done, no body in India till now has ever done BGMs so innovatively and consistently.
  
  Comparing ARR with IR is like comparing Garry Sobers with Sachin. Gary is a genuine alrounder and probably faced dangerous delivaries than ever. To compare him with Sachin is as wrong as comparing ARR with IR.
  
  In present days MD, ARR's BGM is just for the sceen and and is very apt and meaning full. I KM when Madhavan break out the matter to keerthana...ARR plays a BGM with sounds of sea waves...I probably feel that only that sort of adhirchi feeling comes in a childs mind not like what we see in so many Indian films with huge violine and trumpet - drums BGM.
  
  See 1947 Earth, Iruvar and ofcourse andhimandharai for a sample.
  
  
• From: Common Friend (@ 203.197.141.186) on: Thu Apr 25 12:42:58 EDT 2002
  
  Soory for the gramatical error and typo.
  
  I am always in a hurry.
  
  
• From: Saketh@Atlanta (@ 130.207.32.174) on: Thu Apr 25 13:21:27 EDT 2002
  
  To say ARR does not have the talent to produce good BGM is wrong. However, the honor of bringing path-breaking BGM shall always stay with IR just as the honor of bringing fresh sounds, technology and some bold popular fusion work will belong to ARR. I will not write ARR off so soon, his best is yet to come. IMHO, there is a point in the life of every artist (especially the good ones) that they start doing their art for art's sake.
  All IMHO!
  
  
• From: MPR (@ 134.129.110.48) on: Thu Apr 25 15:14:32 EDT 2002
  
  ROFTL:
  
  IR being the only one who can do good BGM is a myth.
  
  May be you are right about good BGMs but I would say he is the only one can come up with best BGM score. 'Hey rAm' is an example, just awesome, subtle, unbelievable score.
  
  IR has been guilty of over-BGMing
  
  If you don't mind, could you give me some examples of over_BGMing by IR? Just curious.
  
  
• From: Just_So (@ 206.175.176.2) on: Thu Apr 25 18:44:28 EDT 2002
  
  ROTFL :
  
  I read a statement by Jim Carey recently - "If I am guilty of overacting, Van Gogh was guilty of over-painting". :-)
  
  
• From: yaaro (@ 195.93.50.176) on: Thu Apr 25 18:45:31 EDT 2002
  
  You are the guy who bought the Greatest Contribution of Ilayaraaja line, hook and bait?
  Gnyaabagam irukkaa? :)
  ROTFL,I am now really rotfling:-)
  If you beleive I bought that thread HL and sinker,you will believe anything.like for instance ARR is good in bgm's for a starter-humble apologes from a 'villager'.
  
  
• From: Vj (@ 61.11.79.52) on: Fri Apr 26 00:46:27 EDT 2002
  
  IMHO, ARR needs to tune-up his BGM (with no pun intended).... at times he's good, mostly he's happy replaying the theme or a song in the movie with different instruments rather than scoring a different piece specifically for BG. Of course, doing this is not a sin as every MD does that, but ARR does it often and often which makes me think "cant this guy give a real BG when he's capable of doing it?"..
  just a digression... the BG i hate most is SAR's "lala" chorus.
  
  
• From: NagaS (@ 203.195.223.210) on: Fri Apr 26 01:42:24 EDT 2002
  
  Vj,
  
  I think Vikraman is the guy who spoilt SAR with 'lala' kind of music ... later SAR started doing it in every movie ...
  if you want proof listen to Vikraman's latest movie 'Unnai Ninaithu' Songs, There is no SAR, But Lots of lalalalala are there for you to enjoy .... :-)
  
  NagaS
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 64.173.10.173) on: Fri Apr 26 01:50:21 EDT 2002
  
  I have written my opinions about BGM earlier. But I have some time for repetition tonight :) BGM will be continue to be a WCM department. John Williams had mentioned that only a big orchestral score can add grandeur to the big screen perspective. In the US, movies have had BGM scores by rock/alternative groups. But the best BGM in the oscars have always been orchestral scores. IR's forte is WCM scores. He uses big orchestras (like in hEy rAm, lajjA, etc) So naturally, people feel impressed with his BGM scores. ARR once clearly stated that he has no intentions of making a symphony. He is not interested in WCM. He specifically mentioned his interests are in POP/World Music. But the basic requirement for BGM or songs is an aptitude for music and ARR has loads of it. Hope this helps people appreciate ARR/IR better.
  
  
• From: NagaS (@ 203.195.223.210) on: Fri Apr 26 04:34:29 EDT 2002
  
  kiru,
  
  Do you mean to say only those few movies where IR used a big orchestras had good BGM ?
  
  MaunaRagam PaarththirukkeengaLaa ? Aboorva SagothararkaL ? Devar Magan ? Idhayam atleast ?
  
  NagaS
  
  
• From: Saran (@ 164.164.46.20) on: Fri Apr 26 05:05:54 EDT 2002
  
  ROTFL,
  "ARR's BGM is very apt for the movie situations. Kannathil Muthamittaal had the best BGM in recent times." --- is this comparison based on the movies done by ARR or when compared with others?? If u generalize this with others, i dont think so... Kaasi and azhagki had better BGM than KM, IMHO.
  "IR being the only one who can do good BGM is a myth. It is about time some one came and broke the bubble." --- athu yaar enRu sonnaal nanRaaka irukkum. ThEdi thEdi paarkirom yaar enRu theriyavillai :))
  
  Kiru,
  "He uses big orchestras (like in hEy rAm, lajjA, etc) " --- As pointed out by NagaS, do u mean only by having big orchestras, BGM can be better and nice?? Many IR movies those had a nice BGM, didn't have a big orchestra. A typical example is KM(kaadhalukku Mariyaadhai) Climax scene... No big orchestration, nothing! But the BGM was simply amazing!!!!!
  
  
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.126) on: Fri Apr 26 05:13:44 EDT 2002
  
  "grand type of scenes in big screen"-kku Orchestral BGM rich-a irukku. Scene rustic-ka, amaidhiya aana amsama irundha (e-g) mudhal mariyaadhai scenes? adhukku aeppadi orchestral music porundhum?
  
  but as you said aptitude is needed for BGM, and as you pointed out ARR has loads of it.
  
  But interest place a vital role. Why I am telling this is, I have heard many hearsays, interviews, articles about IR's grasp, attitude, aptitude, perception about scenes of movies and how fast he is in converting them to a very good output(BGM) for the scenes that are so apt for the situation. These information i could get in addition to IR's method of working for songs making. However I have not heard much about how ARR works for BGM not even 50% amount of information about his way/style of work for songs making. This may be due to the reason as you(kiru) quote about WCM to IR and ARR. IMHO, a person interested in WCM would be interested in doing BGM more than a person who doesn't wish his forte to be WCM. Thats why i feel ARR spends much attention and interest to songs making than the scenes making(BGM). But KM a few other movies do show that ARR has the aptitude to do good BGMs. All IMHO.
  
  

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