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Politeness and this forum

Topic started by Ramki (@ cs101.cs.wmich.edu) on Fri Oct 30 21:41:00 EST 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

They look like antonyms to me.THe forum,which had once been a playground of fun filled people,happniess,joy is now reduced to hatred,personal and verbal attacks.The attitude of certain people has literally driven some of our regulars here.Where are we heading to?If this trend continues i dont think this forum will be ever used for the main purpose it was created. We are here to talk about music,varieties of music,its creators,irrespective of who it is ,listeners.This forum is accessed and read throughout the world. SHouldnt we,people who come from prestigious universities,who are woring in respectable positions,show minimal politeness in
what we speak and what we write.But whats happening here is worse than 'kuzhaiyadi sandai'.I really feel ashamed and hurt to see this. SOme of us are really brutal.I dont want to cite examples,wait what the heck,once a srikanth had posted that he wanted to cut the throat of SUresh peters.I was shocked and was very sad to read that.You need not have to give respect for his talent but atleast he deserves some respect as a human being.WHat if suresh peter also reads the forum??Wouldnt he be hurt?If you dont like
an artist,keep it to yourself or say it diplomatically. We are not barbarians,we are all educated,talented human beings.Let us not slay each other with words.
Stop comparing people.Stop comapiring their works.
If you cant ,sorry to say,but stop coming here.

Ravi sorry for creating a melodramatic thread,but by the look of things here i guess you might even consider putting this thread in permanent section:)

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Responses:

• From: suresh (@ bluebird.qut.edu.au) on: Sat Oct 31 00:24:06 EST 1998
  
  Ramki
  
  I second this unreservedly. My excitement and passion at discovering this forum soon disappeared amidst the crude mud-slinging and name-calling.
  
  I was shocked at Srikanth's comment on Suresh Peters. I've known SPeters and I don't think even he deludes himself that his voice is a connoisseurs' delight; yet such verbal venom is indecent to say the least. I've noticed this kind of attitude with several people who claim to be the all-knowing music masters. It saddens me that these people haven't understood that if you've really imbibed music as an artform, it would've defined your temperament more sublime and made you more open and broad-minded to diff music.
  
  Though I'd like to believe that I'm a true IR fan, I dont think that it gives me a licence to judge popular music, be it by ARR or Deva, as trash. It's way too fashionable for IR's fans to call ARRs work trash and vice-versa (well, Srikanth once said that 80% of IR songs are trash; I forced myself not to disagree with him). Similarly, the way poor Deva has been bandied about in this forum is an enormous injustice to the hard-working simple guy he is. I remember his interview on radio a few years back when he himself admitted that very often, producers give him a situation and also pick a particular hit song and ask him to compose a similar one. He further said that his dream was to compose some song like IR, and if I'm not wrong he cited "ethetho ennam" from Punnagai Mannan.
  
  We're all sure that ARR, IR or Deva are going to care two hoots to what we say in this forum. They're way too busy with their lives, moreover their work is judged in the public realm and a hit or flop is ultimately the crucial yardstick to the strength of their music.
  
  Instead of feeling happy that Chennai has been dominating the Indian film music scene for the last 3 decades since IR's advent, and looks set to continue its domination further with ARR etc., we're setting an ugly scene here.. This is akin to the classic Rajni vs. Kamal debate that rages endlessly among their fans, but paradoxically they still remain friends down the years.
  
  I think these crass comments will lead to the deteriorating quality of participation in the forum; unless we see reason in maintaining a dignified critique of things.
  
  
• From: Music -Virumbi (@ 207-228-163.ipt.aol.com) on: Sat Oct 31 03:17:35 EST 1998
  
  Well said... We all have to understand that there is a very thin line separating "fan" and "fanatic". Derogatory remarks on IR or ARR does not make a dent in their careers... as they have already established their presence... Healthy,brain tingling at time humorous discussions are what I expect to see.. Thanks guys
  
  
• From: raja m (@ spider-tp042.proxy.aol.com) on: Sat Oct 31 08:10:57 EST 1998
  
  Ramki:
  
  One thing I think in DF is that all interesting topics have been discussed, I missed the boat in terms of a late entry to DF . DFers are not interested in discussing or rediscussing interesting topics and there is a lack of new interesting topics.
  
  New entrants to DF maybe e from a younger generation with strong likes and dislikes/opinions is to be expected, especially about music which is personal hobby for recreation purposes. Degeneration of all threads to adithadis is not what everybody expects though - this will happen on and off. I wonder why DF has to be regulated (internet is supposed to be a domain for free exchange of unregulated views), but DF is regulated and I accept it because I like being here. I am not bothered about the fights, what I find is we need more interesting topics to discuss.
  
  Written with Good Intentions only :))
  
  A majority of the DFers ( if not all) have some roots in India - YES - the approach of the TFM Admin ( on and off) is old fashioned with a holier than thou attitude which needs a new direction. Regulating topics is a difficult job - but why is it regulated? Ravi can spend time discussing stuff instead of policing all the time.
  If you want nice things to be said about all, with no criticism, then the zing goes out of this place. DFers should however, maintain civil behaviour, as their comments speak a lot about their personality.
  
  
  
• From: Rajaraman (@ palo4.pacific.net.sg) on: Sat Oct 31 10:18:27 EST 1998
  
  Raja M,
  You have given us a fine way of justifying "why the forum is regulated"
  
  You are bringing in a different topic and so digressing. : ) Seriously: pl take a look at SCT or RMIM newsgroups and it could become without any moderation. Now let's get back to the topic.
  
  Thanks Ramki for starting this topic. Hopefully the politeness level of the forum will increase..
  
  
• From: raja m (@ spider-ta021.proxy.aol.com) on: Sat Oct 31 11:17:40 EST 1998
  
  Rajaraman:
  
  Heads you win tails I lose :))))))))))))
  
  
• From: Observer (@ spider-te011.proxy.aol.com) on: Sat Oct 31 11:36:11 EST 1998
  
  Some thoughts on how we could preserve some decorum of this forum
  
  1) NEVER EVER indulge in personal attack on a fellow DFer.
  
  2) ALWAYS put you thoughts across in a simple, diplomatic manner. You can be critical about an artist. But, if your favourite artist is under severe criticism , you have the right to defend AS LONG AS you don't take in personnaly as if you are being attacked and enter into inter-personal conflicts.
  
  3) If a fellow DFer criticises your tastes or you, just stay away from the thread for a few days. SILENCE is one of the best weapons for counter-attack.
  
  4) At the same time don't be feeble minded to forgo any criticism on you which you think is bad. Have your reply back in a diplomatic way. It depends on how smart you are. In general, every body has potential to give diplomatic answers.
  
  4a) Also keep it mind that there are thousands of readers of this forum who may or maynot participate. Everyone knows who is at fault and who is not, IN THEIR OPINION.
  
  5) Digression is allowed in some cases as long as it is being triggered off of the topic. But don't let it strech out of hands.
  
  6) NEVER EVER use four letter words to describe anything work, art, person, language etc.
  
  7) There is some thing called minimum courtesy which one should have, IMO, while criticising an artist. It is a better practice to follow that. Develop a habit of criticising the end-product like song etc rather than attacking the artist's skills or theartist. This is just my humble opinion, it is up to the individual to follow.
  
  I may have evoked displeasure to some in an attempt to create comical feeling(i think so!) in the thread 'dlkjhdsdfshlhk'. I apologize if i have broken any of the above said rules under this pretext or anywhere else, but i think, IMHO, majority of them are easy to follow.
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ spider-tf031.proxy.aol.com) on: Sat Oct 31 12:27:20 EST 1998
  
  I like the DF just fine, as it is. Stop saying 'STOP' ! The founders of the DF are perfectly justified in trying to maintain decorum in here. But apart from that the other paticipants should understand that their good intentions will invariably be interpreted as a 'holier than thou' attitude. And I wish those advocating peace would advocate it peacefully rather than saying, "Stop coming to the DF", "If you can't say something nice about Deva, stop posting in the DF", "If you can only bash ARR, then get out !". It is another matter when Ravi/Rajaraman do it (and I don't believe they've ever asked any DFer to stop visiting) to see that a dicussion does not take an ugly turn, but it is in bad taste when regular DFers start doing it to each other. I can understand if someone is using foul language - every one of us must immediately condemn it to show that that isn't how we talk to each other. But we don't have the right to say, "This should be discussed and that shouldn't". Your rules apply to you too. If you don't like the discussion, don't participate.
  
  And yes, Ramki, it is indeed a melodramatic thread, and no, I don't believe somthing like this should ever go into the permanent section.
  
  
• From: Murali Sankar (@ 129.252.23.231) on: Sat Oct 31 12:27:40 EST 1998
  
  Dear Ramki,
  
  I am in tune with your opinions. But basically I feel that some contributors are less effective in their choice of words and expression than the average junta,- please note that I am saying this only after countless observations and i do nto maena to offend anybody by this statement. Though nobody has anything personal against others it is the musical madness and a lower ability of expression that is generating all the waves in the DF. All the DFers must as I believe must be open to all kinds of opinions so that everybody indulges in a good verbal exchange. This is a place to relax and not the one establish a person's superiority over the rest. It is not a place for all those with rigid opinions and unshakable preconceived notions. The IR fans , as everybody, can understand are in scores but being an IR fan gives nobody a license to cast scathing attacks on the other MDs. It may displease their fans. Also not everybody has understood that it is the work of the MD which is under discussion and not the MD himself. When I started the thread "Original songs of Deva", I requested that everybody contribute positively without casting aspersions on Deva. Alas! It did not work out and everybody started digressing. I tried to put it straight, but in vain. After reading the previous posting, I am convinced that we must express ourselves in a more verbally friendly manner. I strongly suggest that if language is a barrier, we may use tamil itself to express since it is equally prevalent in the DF. This may help reduce some tension and misunderstanding.
  
  With this posting I am sending my sincere apologies too, to those who would have felt that I have hurt them.
  
  Regards
  
  Murali Sankar
  
  
• From: SR Kaushik (@ nova20.cs.wisc.edu) on: Sat Oct 31 14:31:57 EST 1998
  
  I think that achieving complete politeness is difficult because music is a highly emotional issue and so its very difficult to restrain oneself. I've myself been impulsive at times, and yet I can't guarantee to stop myself from being so in the future !! :)))
  
  

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