Illayaraja or Rahman ?

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Topic started by Pras (@ 193.56.241.19) on Thu Dec 7 09:06:29 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

waiting for ur answers :)

Responses:

Old responses
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Tue Feb 27 18:35:31 EST 2001

Naveen,
I listened to sridhar's composition. It was very good.Yes it was composed in chappu thallam.....

Listen to poovae sempoovae song ........
it has got an excelent combo of tabla and drums in the second BGM and a very typical hindustani style of playing tabla in first BGM.
Second BGM has a very good bass guitar and on top of that a lot of other instruments and violin takes over finally to finish the BGM.......
the whole song is decorated with the Piano chords and notes.........
Great fusion!
Percusion instruments like triple drums, Manual Drums and Tabla are used
Hear that I am sure u'll enjoy this song.......
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Tue Feb 27 18:37:03 EST 2001

That song is composed in rupaga thaalam!!!
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Tue Feb 27 18:39:19 EST 2001

I am sorry that was thrisra nadai in aadhi thaalam!!!
From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Tue Feb 27 18:41:45 EST 2001

Ohoo...are there any more thaalams left in this world?
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Tue Feb 27 18:45:31 EST 2001

I dont know and U should be knowing it better coz u r a genius!!! :)
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Tue Feb 27 18:58:39 EST 2001

Swamiji if u want to really know how many thaalams are there I can definitely give u an elaborate picture of thaalam in carnatic........
From: aruLaracan (@ 134.124.160.10) on: Wed Feb 28 12:08:07 EST 2001

arun: it is simple 7/8 (thripuda thALam, 123 1234 pattern) composition. i am not sure if this is what you mean by thisra nadai Adhi thALam.
From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Wed Feb 28 12:54:02 EST 2001

Thisra nadai is grouping into triplets BTW...
From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Wed Feb 28 13:00:54 EST 2001

Arun, I would rather learn thaalams from someone who knows it, and not from someone that says like a 100 thalams for a simple beat...
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 14:37:55 EST 2001

Swamiji,
This is ur limitation.....

arulArackan,
Thirupadai thaalam is a general classification of one kind of thaalam.

On a High level there are 7 thaalams!
Dhruvam
Matyam
Roopakam
Jhampa
Triputa
Ata
Eka
These are called as "Suladi Sapta Thaalas"
Each thaalam can be played in 5 different Jaatis (types).
That makes total number of thaalas that can be played as 7 * 5 = 35.
Each jaati(types) can be played as five different nadais.
That makes the total number of thalams as 35 * 5 = 175
They are
Thrisram (3 sol per mathrai) Tha Ki Ta
1 2 3
Sadhursam (4 sols per mathrai)Tha ka thi me
1 2 3 4
Kandam (5 Sols per Mathrai)Tha ka tha thimi
Mistram (7 sols per mathrai)Tha ki ta tha ka thimi
Sangeernam (11 sols per mathrai) Tha ka thi mi Tha ki ta tha ka thi mi

Note : Each beat is called as a mathra!!!

Now comming to Poovae sem poovae,
One beat of this song consists of 3 aksharams which means it is played in trisra nadai!
On the high level it is thirupatai thaalam.
Coz it consists of One Lagu and 2 dhrithums!

As I ve mentioned earlier to be precise.....
the thaalam that is used in Poovae sempoovae can be completely diagonised as

" Chatursara Jaati Thirupata Thaalam " - Thisra nadai
FYI
" Chatursara Jaati Thirupata Thaalam " is commonly called as AADHI THAALAM

I think if u understand the jargons U'll know what i said about Poovae semppovae is right???
Thanx
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 14:57:21 EST 2001

Aadhithalam or "Chatursara Jaathi Thirupadai Thaalam " is almost the same as "Teen Taal"
in hindustani!!!
From: aruLaracan (@ 134.124.160.10) on: Wed Feb 28 15:54:37 EST 2001

aruN: i understand what you are trying to say. i don't have time right now for a detailed discussion. so later.

btw, my name is not aruLarackan (aruLdemon). it is aruLaracan (aruLlord). when transliterated, 'c' is 'k' have different sounds. ex., kaTTai (wooden block), caTTai (shirt).
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 16:08:44 EST 2001

me 2 busy..... :-)
are u arularasan? arasan for king???
and one more thing 123 1234 represents one more thaalam called saapu thaalam which doesnt belong to this group of seven thaalams........
From: rjay (@ 206.150.228.62) on: Wed Feb 28 16:13:30 EST 2001

arul

Arul, to avoid this problem and also phonetically in Tamil
you should be using arasan, because the Cha
letter in between gets aspirated to Sa. Kakam -
is spoken out as kaham!

You should not be transcribing the letter in isolation, but its phonetic value!

;)
rjay
From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Wed Feb 28 16:24:49 EST 2001

Arun, you thesis on thaalams is very impressive. But only that you have very little knowledge on where it applies. Knowing something is worse than knowing where it applies.
I think all this confuses you, so better do your job without any confusion.
If IR himself reads your discussion, he will disown having any fan by the name of ARUN.
hehehe
Jai Ram...
Dont talk about my limitations sir, you have yourself accepted that Iam a genius (which I humbly accept)...
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 16:43:52 EST 2001

Swamiji
U'll never grow!!!
"Thirundhadha jenmangal irudhenna laabam"
From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Wed Feb 28 16:48:02 EST 2001

Arun,
Now you will say thillana mohanambal is Hip Hop..., so forget about me growing up. Learn and then talk...
Buh Bye...
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 16:50:02 EST 2001

forget abt me learning.......... u learn to talk first........
"U'll Never Grow"

See Ya
From: aruLaracan (@ 134.124.160.10) on: Wed Feb 28 16:52:12 EST 2001

digression
yes. rjay. that aspiration to the harder sound is the speciality of tamizh. the 'c' in caTTai and aracan are the same "letters" (vari vaTivangkaL) but change the way they sound depending upon where the letter appears in the word. it's a pity that tamils don't know how to pronounce tamizh words. i have no regard for them. i am not going to change :-))
end digression
From: Mudhalvan (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 17:04:04 EST 2001

swamiji- u r a disgrace to the page please dont post anything here anymore!

Arun dont try to reply him.....
From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Wed Feb 28 17:24:33 EST 2001

Ok mudhalvan, I wont post.
From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Wed Feb 28 17:34:31 EST 2001

Swamiji,

Bhaktahrgal Kadavulai thittinaalum Kadavul Bhakthargalukku arul purindhu konde irukkanum!
From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.254) on: Wed Feb 28 17:37:22 EST 2001

"it's a pity that tamils don't know how to pronounce tamizh words."

Hey Arul:

There is no problem with tamils and tamil words. "Kattai" and "Aracan" are totally distinguishable, if they were written in Tamil. Since you are trying to directly "dub" these words in English, you ought to face this kind of problems. Some more examples..

Thanjavoor... Tanjore
Trivananthapuram ...Trivandrum
Kozhikodu....Calicut

A duppa is meant as "Can" in English whereas, Mugam is pronounced as "Face". Sound of "C" varies depending on where it appears. So I conclude that this problem is with English letters and words.
From: rajaG (@ 207.43.195.201) on: Wed Feb 28 17:43:16 EST 2001

Arun: Please don't get discouraged by the posts in this thread. If one cannot share his/her knowledge and ignorance in an internet based free-for-all discussion forum then where else can he/she? If I had a dollar for everytime I made a mistake, I would be a multi-millionaire by now. Your explanation of thaalams was valuable. Continue your participation.
From: rajaG (@ 207.43.195.201) on: Wed Feb 28 17:48:27 EST 2001

Fliflo/Rjay: I am sure aruLaracan has a 'well thought out' reason for why he chooses a particular way of writing his thamizh name. Please take this off line or open a separate thread in forumhub. aruL- you may want to explain there.
From: Kishore (@ 172.175.70.58) on: Wed Feb 28 17:49:35 EST 2001

Arun ignore such swamis(btw he doesnt deserve that 'ji')and pls post more info on thaalams.

We stupid students will prefer to learn from nirai kudams like you
rather than from egoistic,trashy,bombastic
morons.
From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.254) on: Wed Feb 28 17:53:31 EST 2001

Arun;

Don't get succumbbed easily for some silly stuffs. That might be your weakness and everytime you post something people hit at this point.
Many times best way overcome this problem is just to ignore.
From: Arun (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 17:57:22 EST 2001

I'll definitely continue to post more on what I know about thaalams.......
Thanks for all the encouragements u guys give me............
I just wrote whatever Ive learnt and I play in mirudhangam from my childhood.....
U'll definitely enjoy carnatic music and its complicated thaalam structures if understand them.......
once again thanx for all ur encouragements
From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.254) on: Wed Feb 28 17:57:41 EST 2001

rajaG;

I am less concerned about how he writes his name. May be there is a big thought behind that. Saying tamils can not pronounce tamil is a unacceptable, general statement, however. Arul could have avoided that. He could have given a big thought before passing such comments. My response was just to explain the problem! Nothing serious!
From: Mudhalvan (@ 167.24.104.150) on: Wed Feb 28 18:57:40 EST 2001

swamiji,
enna aachu sathamae kaanum.......
idha than edhaiyo kuduthu edhaiyo punnakikaradhum
baha
HeheHe
Jai Ram
(Engaiyoe Keta madhiri irukka) Ungaludhu dahn
Arasiallla idhellam sagajamappa.......
From: aruLaracan (@ 134.124.160.10) on: Wed Feb 28 18:57:49 EST 2001

rAjAji: thanks.

fliflo: :-)) i am a thamizh too and i am still learning. i found out my mistakes and am trying hard (not hardly :-) ) to correct them. anyways, i could have avoided such a generalization but there was no other way to show off my arrogance ;) (btw, if you notice, i used to write my name as aruLarasan a year or two ago; after i started learning thamizh from the bigshots - most of whom lurk in the forumhub, agathiyar, projectmadurai valaitaLams, i have started writing my name as aruLaracan.)
From: Fliflo (@ 130.203.169.10) on: Wed Feb 28 20:12:54 EST 2001

Arul;

Thanks for your time in explaining. Is there a reason to use "L" in-between small caps..Just curious!

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