Home   Forum   Wiki   Notes   Register   FAQ   Sitemap   About Us   Contact Us  

IR or ARR

Topic started by M.Anand (@ ihproxy1.proxy.lucent.com) on Tue Jan 18 01:03:04 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

hi all, I am Anand from bangalore and a new visitor to the tfm page. I am a great fan of both ARR and IR. I browsed through all the earlier threads on ARR and IR. It seems to me that there are quite a few anti ARRs out here.

Let me tell you something about IRs music. IRs music became popular and sounded different because he tried to bring in a westernization of Carnatic ragas in his songs. Even a dappanguthu was in Lathaangi or sivaranjani. That actually made the difference. Otherwise he is no great MD. One might argue that such a westernization or incorporation of a carnatic raga in a dappanguthu or jazz is something that demands great applause. But IR doesn't deserve that because, if u say u are tuning a song in a particular raagam, you have to bring out the nuances, the laya and bhaava of the raagam in to the song. Just traversing the swaras in the raagam here and there does not mean that u have tuned a song in that raagam. Ilayaraaja has done just that, a mere traversal through the swaras. In many places, there were apaswaras also. ARR has tuned very few songs based on Carnatic ragas but they were classics. For example Mettu podu in Anjali is a beautiful song in Ananda Bhairavi. He has brought out every nuance of the raagam in that song. Minsaara Kanna in padaiyappa is an excellent piece in vasantha. En mel vizhunda mazhai tuliye is again a beautiful piece in kaapi. A real mix of the east and west. That is what u call fusion. Ilayaraaja boasts of having composed songs in rare raagas like chala nattai, kanakangi etc. For example pani vizhum malar vanam in chala nattai is again a pure note traversal. There was no attempt to bring out the nuances in the raaga. So IR knew how to make songs sound good but ARR gives a fine polish to each and every one of his songs. IR composed music for 700 odd films. Hey Ram is his 785th film. Considering 7 songs per movie, he has tuned almost 5500 songs. Huge number indeed but hardly 5% of those songs are listenable others are 100% pure junk. But 99.9% of ARRs songs are listenable and they are also good numbers. What do you say about this?

Regards,
Anand

---

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 13:10:51 EDT 2000
  
  Trend, you are perfectly right.
  
  
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 13:17:07 EDT 2000
  
  Trend - that's not needed..... iam sure that another BR + IR or KB + IR or SuperStar + IR combo is not going to work..... iam sure the ego will be hiding somewhere in them, which will not allow them to give the magic touch we had few years back.... so why waste money and time on that....
  
  its better if IR works on movies like Sethu, HeyRam, Kannukul nilavu, Barathy and stop working for movies like Karisakattu povee....
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 13:17:40 EDT 2000
  
  sabesan,
  frankly I did not say it is bad or good. i am judging anyone here. there was cold war what is reason -- this is the story i heard. Also if you see kbraj did not do well after he started to use the harmonium instead of pen.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 13:19:07 EDT 2000
  
  :-)..... 100% true about kbraj.... i would certainly prefer kbraj do some story and screenplay, like he did for BR in the initial stages.....
  
  and i hope u meant "iam not judging anyone"....
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 13:25:26 EDT 2000
  
  sabesan,
  I would take it this way:
  superstar appreciated ir using vanja pugachi ..
  he told ir is able to give a hit so easily, but others are so ordinary, they try hard but still giving a hit is not easy for them. this man is genius,
  
  human words can be taken as camphour or sugar.
  It all what how we take it.
  
  I will tell you one good deed,
  many have told this to me, it seems ir has refunded his share of money to few producers just for the reason movie did not do well.
  
  Bad things are highlighted more for people in lime light.
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 13:32:31 EDT 2000
  
  Sriks, now i remember what happened in that meeting.... i think Rajini told "IR should give the same kind of music for everyone.... he should not give good music for some and not so good music for some".... not sure what the exact words were, but that's what he had meant.... for which IR said "ok, let rajini come and be a music director"...... pure ego clash.....
  
  yes, i too know about the one u said.... see the problem with IR is he speaks too frankly - just what he thinks.... that's not taken correctly by many - especially the press.... that's the reason he said "iam not talking to press".... oh well, whatever - lets enjoy if he gives good music..... i hope he changes his path from TFM into some other form and gets success....
  
  sometime back i remember reading in TFM (by some IR fan only) "i don't want to see IR fade away the same way as TMS".... i also pray God that he does'nt fade away like TMS - like cursing all around for the downfall.... cause in some form or the other sometime back he was trashing either ARR or VM in any meetings he would be..... man i hope i does'nt do such things in the future....
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 13:38:44 EDT 2000
  
  sabesan ,there is one more story on tms i know, thats more funny. I will tell you soon :)
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Thu Oct 19 13:49:36 EDT 2000
  
  Sabesan,
  
  I was thinking about Rajni-IR combo.Though IR gives good music for Rajni the music is not Rajni like music.When SPB sings for Rajni I can feel his intensity to ensure the song is apt for Rajni.
  
  Deva did a very good job there though the music may not have good quality. When you are composing for Rajni it is a whole differnet ball game.
  
  Annamalai and Batcha's music vibed very well with Rajni in both movies.
  
  Though "malai koil"(veera) is a better song "style style thaan" is a better Rajni song.Deva deserves more praise from Rajni for this in my opinion.
  
  During Veera,the tune selected for "madathile" was the 40th tune he composed.Rajni was unhappy with the previous 39 and IR got irritated saying behind the curtains something like "nobody has done that to me".
  
  Trend
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 13:51:29 EDT 2000
  
  Sabesan,
  Frankly all this trash talks are started by people around them,
  
  I know for sure, arr does not trash any of the MD's. Same goes with ir or msv,
  
  "Karumame kannaenar", they concentrate on work 200 time more than us. They dont bother much about whos is on the top etc...unless and until some one tells them. Here only the "dubam" comes to play. They are often misinformed "just to keep them happy" Ok i am ending this here ...:)
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 13:54:42 EDT 2000
  
  Sabesan,
  I just finished reading your postings. I don't think IR got into problems with the Directors and Actors like Rajini just because he was frank but was rather Rude . You have accepted that IR had a ego clash with Rajini. Even his best friends from his childhood could not stand him.
  
  Certainly he was rude and headstrong when there was no one around as an alternative to him. The moment ARR came into the scene he probably realised his problems and kind of cooled off. Thats the reason he is able to work with New Directors.
  
  However great a person may be the moment he "starts thinking that he knows everything, thats the starting point of his decline".
  It applies to every one.
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 13:57:10 EDT 2000
  
  Ejaaman to an extent, did have Rajini kind of music - "ejamaan kaladi manedhuth".... but s, u r correct for Rajini - DEVA is the best bet.... none of Rajini's movies - Veera or Ejaaman or Padayappa or Muthu - none of them came near Baatcha or Annamalai (wait, iam not talking about the quality of the songs, but just how they went with the RAJINI movie)...
  
  Sriks.... aaaa well, let me also stop here :-)...
  
  
• From: nakkeeran (@ 208.142.210.30) on: Thu Oct 19 14:02:01 EDT 2000
  
  It seems that IR gave around a 100 tunes for veeraa and finally 6-7 were chosen (either by Suresh K or Panju A). During the veLLi vizha, Rajini said, "I was told that IR gave around 100 tunes. I am thrilled that he takes so much interest in my movies. I request him to take similar interest in other movies also and give some good numbers for others". IR was offended by this because Rajini meant that IR is giving junk for others. So he refused to do baadshaa.
  
  Even earlier, Rajini once mentioned that his movies run or HIMSELF and NOBODY else. He did kodi parakkuthu with BR (who was anti-IR then) and recommended Hamsalekha (Kannada connection??), couple of movies with Chandra Bose-AVM (Dorai - their tiff with IR was also at this time, probably), oorkaavalan with S-G....
  
  Rajini and IR never had a very healthy relationship.
  
  Also, it is interesting to see that all guys who wanted to get rid of IR, joined with Rajini to promote some other MD. BR-Hamsalekha, AVM-Chandrabose, KB-Deva,ARR (KB REALLY wanted to bring IR's popularity down)
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 14:14:25 EDT 2000
  
  So can we conclude that ir's decline
  was due to people who did not like him. ?
  what made them hate ir,
  his quick growth, his domination or
  poramai, what is it????
  
  These so called haters tried chandra bose and other misc Md's, all of them could not come near or capture a spot in tfm, ir was going great guns, But when they tried arr , he capitalized , he was able to do well how????
  
  why did this happen ?
  Why did people reject chandrabose and other misc mds but accepted arr?
  can some one give a right taught on this?.,
  
  
  btw: ir decline - many still argue ir is still around! i am also under this opinion, he can do good job even today,
  
  I am not fighting for anyone , this is the status of the industry today, i am just pondering into it.,
  
  
• From: Ramesh Ganesan (@ 206.175.176.2) on: Thu Oct 19 14:29:28 EDT 2000
  
  Dorai
  
  I dont undeedstand how you could even say that IR is rude. While Others only give instances of what happened and what they have heard. You speak asif you know IR persoanlly. Have you seen IR or moved around with him to know id he bahves rudely?.
  
  Like Sabesan pointed out why has IR been doing well with all the new directors if he had so much ego.
  
  Also even when somebody went out to another MD (for instance even my your own words AVM), he never refused to do Music for AVM again.
  
  My Guess is he got pissed off when superstar like rajini, who know how the industry works, commenting on him the way they did. As far as i know I find only instances where people try to interfere in his work or comment about it that he gets agitated and speaks out.
  
  Why does Rajini comment about him in public when he doesn't comment about Rajini's acting in public?. Does being a superstar entitle him to speak about all people working under the production. Show me one instance of IR (a true instance that has happened in public and not rumours please) where he comments about something bad of people outside of his field - music. (I accept there is one that of VM, anything other than that).
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 14:34:34 EDT 2000
  
  Fan,
  Your points are well taken. Its a combination of his "Ego", head strong attitude and over confidence which brought to his down fall. MSV used to give tunes after tunes until MGR was satisfied with it. He worked on the tune for a song for days together until MGR was satisfied. MSV was also in the peak at that time and did not have a Ego clash with MGR. In fact, he produced his best songs for MGR. Thats the kind proper attitude IR lacked (when he was in peak form)which brought his downfall.
  
  

---

List all pages of this thread

Post comments