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Yesterday - Illayarajah Today - A.R. Rahman Tomorrow - Yuvan Shankar Raja

Topic started by Pras (@ 66.185.84.71) on Sat Jan 25 08:43:29 EST 2003.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Who Do You Think Is The Yesterday, Today, Tomorrow MD of TFM?

I think its:
Yesterday - Illayarajah
Today - A.R. Rahman
Tomorrow - Yuvan Shankar Raja

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Lord LabakuDas (@ 202.54.153.21) on: Thu Jul 31 06:22:41 EDT 2003
  
  Sreeni,
  Neenga Naaz'kku pakkathu veeda?:-)
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 06:34:57 EDT 2003
  
  "Height of your comment is "we can go by is the number of people.."
  
  Height or weight, you know very well what I meant to say. Apart from pure subjectivity, ie your opinion against mine, what else do we have to go upon? I challenge you to come up with objective criteria.
  
  Insofar as Dhool's success was not a side-effect of the movie, the album has merit. If you claim that it falls short of some as-yet-unclear criteria, you're being snobbish. Your so-called taste - which itself was formed by other influences, don't forget - will age badly. Posterity outwits taste. For example, I'm sure that the taste-police ridiculed RDB's cabaret songs in the seventies, yet today we're seeing a rejuvenated existence for these songs. Your taste censors, selects and excludes, but unconsciously your musical faculties have already registered Dhool. One day, if YSR were to "quote" a Dhool song, you'll be snared without knowing why.
  
  Someone spoke of replacing ARR with YSR. I surely will as soon as his music sheds its clone-syndrome, says something new and gains consistency. So far, his recording, his percussion, his choice of voices etc. all resemble ARR too closely for me to care. If you disagree, try listening to his recent very pathetic Telugu album.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 06:55:20 EDT 2003
  
  "Just substitute Manasellam with Parasuram.."
  
  Unfortunately, your eagerness for this substitution is not very seemly. No watchful observer will jump to conclusions based on the failure of one old score. Should we then also quickly substitute KK with Boys based on the latter's success?
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 07:12:53 EDT 2003
  
  ""brought tears to eyes" with cliches like "ARR rulez, rocks " and so on. "
  
  My dear friend, if "ARR rulez" were to be used as some sort of morally superior argument in favour of the music, then I would certainly regard it as a cliche. As it stands, I regard it as no more than a waving of the banner and I find it innocuous.
  
  The problem is with people who unctuously parade their tears-stained faces, as if to emphasize that others are somehow deficient in human emotions and therefore their opinions are of no moment - while all it proves is that some are more prone to be crybabies than others.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 07:55:28 EDT 2003
  
  "Instead of tears, i got Brrrrrrrrrrrrr because of BABA.Is it Ok Guruji?? Or was it due to "vaitherical" or "Ajeeram"? "
  
  As Voltaire said, "I disapprove of what
  you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
  
  You're free to dislike the album, but that does not amount to a final judgement on the music. The reason is simple: your reaction might be a purely idiosyncratic response, maybe you hate Rajni or ARR personally, maybe you have a problem with rap music, maybe you didn't like the movie and so on.
  
  Hence my trust in public decision. There is a word for it - it is called "democracy".
  
  
• From: Jag (@ 35.11.98.63) on: Thu Jul 31 08:54:08 EDT 2003
  
  Mr.Sreeni,
  "Have you listened to the Axel F theme? "
  
  You have mentioned about IR lifting this for some song. Can you please name the movie and the song?
  
  
  "If you disagree, try listening to his recent very pathetic Telugu album."
  
  Voices belong to a person, not to the MD.
  
  
• From: Speaker (@ 210.193.17.10) on: Thu Jul 31 09:11:19 EDT 2003
  
  Sreeni, Big..g lengthy msg for one liners is your trade mark. a) You said we need to go by "#of people, cassette sales" do decide the greatness of song. - This is fundamental flaw. If you enjoy some music go ahead do not bother about what other comments are. If you like it, it becomes obvious fact to support this. But that makes discussion interesting, but at the end of the day, you like what you like and I do mine. I now understand the ranking business in sat tv. that could be for people like you, who speak volumes about music, but go by "Mass" opinion. next time if some song is appealing, you also enquire any shop owners, how many casette sold, check his P&L to decide the profit, if everything ok then you like the song- ooph, big trouble man.
  by the same token, you said about pathetic telugu album Is it because Noone like it/Cassette sales shows poor??? If this improves, you will bite your word, that this album now is great.
  So manasellam acording to your "enlighted" knowledge, is bad just because others said but not what you felt.- You have got wierd echai taste!
  
  
• From: MADDY (@ 203.94.218.134) on: Thu Jul 31 09:15:43 EDT 2003
  
  has YSR won any filmfare award??i just want a info and not degrading this guy...... and can anyone provide me the link for his web-fanclub.......
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 09:36:06 EDT 2003
  
  "By this logic, DHOOL should have been better musical than Bharathi."
  
  By making an absurd comparison, you seek to evade the highly pluralistic issues of musical quality and success.
  
  A large number of different kinds of music are functioning in society at any given time. Each kind has its own audience and its measures of success. Success in the realm of folk music and classical music can't be directly compared to film music. Any comparison must take into account factors such as differing measures of success. For example, the number of concert/radio performances might be a more reliable indicator of success in classical circles than cassette sales.
  
  Bharathi's songs have their own audience and have maintained that audience over a long period of time. Their overall sales might match Dhool's sales or they might not. However, the two entities don't reside on the the same scale. Directly comparing the two is like saying that if sales of shoes in a locality exceed that of apples in the same locality, then that locality regards shoes as superior to apples. Both shoes and apples are necessary in their own ways. Shoes might last longer, but apples, I'm sure you'll agree, are tastier.
  
  Even within the world of classical music, who and what decides success and durability? As an external observer, I can only go by what I can see and measure: the appreciation of its audience as evidenced by sales, concerts etc. If I go by subjective opinion, I'm sure I'll find rabid devotees of one composer condemning the devotees of another, thus leaving me with no firm conclusions.
  
  My question is, why should this audience have a pan-social monopoly on taste and value? This is very close to India's backward, caste-ridden social structure, where one small group of Brahmins subjugates entire populations.
  
  Clearly you believe in such a hierarchy of taste, with classical music at the top, IR immediately below and everyone much further down. But this sort of hierarchy is seriously compromised when, for example, you read certain Western music critics and composers who consider that the failure of Indian classical music to develop a written notation has made oral transmission mandatory and therefore stunted its growth and complexity. Not that I agree with them, but this just goes to prove the difficulty inherent in assuming universal standards.
  
  
  My conclusion therefore is that each audience must be allowed its own set of values, its own standards and measures of success in a democratic society.
  
  You might argue then that you should therefore be allowed to apply your own values to enjoy IR's current music. Perfectly true. What I'm saying is that this doesn't privilege you to attack and criticise the characters of others for enjoying the music they prefer.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 09:58:53 EDT 2003
  
  "by the same token, you said about pathetic telugu album Is it because Noone like it/Cassette sales shows poor??? If this improves, you will bite your word, that this album now is great."
  
  Man, I'm having a hard time reading your English, some punctuation would be mighty helpful.
  
  I'm saying pure subjectivity does not suffice. My decision about YSR's album was subjective, yes, but I also looked at sales and other people's reactions to reality-check my decision. Although it was released many weeks ago, it has not even cracked the top ten so far.
  
  You seem to regard "bite your word" as something to be ashamed of. Sorry, I don't second that. Unlike geniuses like you, I don't regard myself as infallible and omniscient. I regard my subjective decisions as partial and provisional.
  
  On several occasions, I have heard music too new and startling to like instantaneously, but I grew to love it after the passage of some time. Sometimes the brain needs to acclimatise itself to a piece of music, especially if it's complex, before you can truly appreciate its qualities.
  
  If YSR's Telugu album goes on to be very successful, I will rehear it at that point and make a fresh decision. If I believe then that its success is entirely due to the film's success rather than its intrinsic musical merit, then I'll say so, but I'll not compel everyone else to fall in line with my thoughts nor will I attack people's characters for liking it.
  
  
• From: Venky (@ 217.44.94.246) on: Thu Jul 31 10:11:26 EDT 2003
  
  maddy, try
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/yuvanshankar/
  or
  www.busychennai.com/yuvan
  
  
• From: Speaker (@ 210.193.17.10) on: Thu Jul 31 10:20:27 EDT 2003
  
  Sreeni>> it is like broken record repeating same point. One hand you say that check stat to decide the quality of album. On the other note you say every type of album is having its own audience to nothing as good or bad. But I am saying you like what appeals to you instead of going to check stat/Other opinion.
  Lets stop this. I got your msg to enjoy music I need to get all sale stats & views.But i dont have time/energy for this. Bye.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 10:28:38 EDT 2003
  
  "So manasellam acording to your "enlighted" knowledge, is bad just because others said but not what you felt.- You have got wierd echai taste!"
  
  I presume you mean "enlightened". Why do you say that, I wonder? What exactly in my mail leads you to think that I regard my knowledge as "enlighted" or "enlightened" or whatever?
  
  These are my thoughts, make of them what you will. I don't claim special knowledge, all I want to do is present arguments that might not have occurred to some of the debaters here.
  
  Coming to "Manasellam", if you had bothered to read my post carefully, you'd have noticed that I offer my opinion of the album as simple subjective opposition to a person who claimed it made him weep. What I said in that post was that in the absence of any common ground between such opinions, the quest for objectivity must naturally refer to the reaction of the audience at large to which that album was addressed.
  
  We know what how the larger audience responded. Now, in rejecting the opinion of the larger audience, in treating that audience as corrupted fools, I believe fans like you are doing IR a disservice. It is because ARR is constantly checking on what his audience thinks and wants that his music continues to engage that audience, despite the occasional hiccup.
  
  For example, I believe that IR should jettison the silly rhythm loops, go for a rich acoustic sound, hire a new recording engineer, use different instruments and so on. But as long as fans like you greet every single note from the "maestro" as the voice of God, clearly IR has little motivation to modify his strategies. Anyway, that is your problem.
  
  
• From: Sreeni (@ 203.56.247.117) on: Thu Jul 31 10:36:41 EDT 2003
  
  "One hand you say that check stat to decide the quality of album. On the other note you say every type of album is having its own audience to nothing as good or bad."
  
  Not quite. I'll make this simple. Respect stats and other's opinions in public, listen to whatever you want to privately.
  
  "But i dont have time/energy for this."
  
  Unfortunately, reasoned arguments and readable prose take time and energy.
  
  

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