Topic started by naga (@ 209.47.143.226) on Mon Mar 18 15:22:53 EST 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.
Even since ARR entered into the cine field in 1992 (Was Roja released in 1991 or 92?), 2 worse things have happenned:
1.He was the one who introduced the use of drum machine (samplers) just to be different from IR and other MDs at that time. He wanted to be different to stay in the field and so created songs with a heave influence of western instruments. Being a 'sound engineer' he managed to be successful and now everybody is following him and calling it the 'trend'. He replaced the 'beauty of orchestration' with this new tread.. No catchy tunes, not so great melodies but just rythm... that's the secret of success...and he knew that. Our youngsters fell for it bcos it was different for them. All of us know that majority of young boys and girls listen to western music just for the rythm and for the quality of sound. They can't even understand the meaning of song and of course they don't need to... infact most of the engilsh songs have no lyrical value... That's exactly what ARR wanted to do... why listen to english beats when I can reproduce the same in tamil movies ???! Right...and that's what he did.. very clever and for this he didn't need to have carnatic music knowledge.. He started violating all the ragas, mixing and matching.. did everything.. (ennavae adi ennavale - a good example of killing 'kedharam' -- funny thing is that unni krishnan got national award for that song)...
It's 10 years now and ARR is still in the industry..charging crores of rupees for each movie, made 100 times the money that IR, MSV have made in their career with genuine music...
Where are we going with this 'tread'...... all songs sound the same...Any song can fit into any movie and for any situation...
2. And the second worst thing that has happened is 'tamizh kolai'. After ARR, now anybody can sing.. no need to know the language. Just sing and ARR will adjust it while recording.. what a shame to 'tamizh mozhi'. ARR is the one who started it. Can anyone deny that? Before that singers had some respect. Just listen to SPB, N.Vasudevan, TMS for their 'tamizh ucharippu'. No wonder why MSV and IR kept on giving using them..
Well I do appreaciate that ARR introduced a lot of new singers but how many can speak 'tamizh'. Can ARR justify what he has done to TFM ?
MSV, KVM and IR composed music for the song. ARR composes song for the music and that's the difference. And that's why we can't listen to any new songs after few months... one bad song will replace another bad song..
If this trend goes for another few more years... 'tamizh mozhi' will find a place in the history...
These are some of the 'tamil kolai seidha padalgal'...
chikku bukky raile.. (ARR)
andha arabi kadaloram (ARR)
poovukku porandha nalu (praveen mani) -- only God can help
all songs in parthale paravasam (ARR)
and a lot more... I don't remember them all..
Can anyone add such songs here??
please note that I do like ARR for many good reasons but I cannot forgive him for the above two bad things he did, knowingly or unknowingly to the TFM...
Responses:
- Old responses
- From: magix (@ 203.199.248.169)
on: Mon Mar 18 20:30:32 EST 2002
typo: "newtfmpage've got" and not "newtfmpage fot". :)
- From: magix (@ 203.199.248.169)
on: Mon Mar 18 20:32:24 EST 2002
>> Hey, this music is good! <<
and when i mean music, i MEAN music.
typed this before comments start pouring, naaa, bombarding along!!
- From: Dirtyharry (@ 150.131.120.86)
on: Mon Mar 18 20:47:35 EST 2002
"where his (and all other ARR-like MDs) music taking our youngsters to... "
I belv "young music admirers" were a rarity before ARR, me included, my real luv for music started with ARR and thru this i have been able to appreciate music in its totality and by this i eman that i began to look at music from a different perspective as to look at its nuances...i dont mean to generalise my musical inclinations as representative of all "our youngsters" but the impact has been pretty significant in youngsters and the impact has defintely been an "eye-opener" to TFM rather than a detrimental one ..
:) all IMHO
- From: Karthik S (@ 164.164.82.29)
on: Mon Mar 18 22:37:01 EST 2002
naga (strictly not to be confused with the other sane and more respected Naga S):
How many more years would you stick to your pallavi-anupallavi-charanam pattern. IR has done enough numbers without that pattern much before Rahman came into the picture. So would you blame IR for it...no, you'd say he innovated a new form! That you forgot this point and comfortably started blaming PP is reason enough for people to understand that your biased.
And if you expect IR's music taking our youngsters (sic) to some place interesting forget it. We're talking fo film music here, not a Hizbul Mujahideen anthem.
- From: ARR FAN (@ 202.156.2.131)
on: Tue Mar 19 01:10:42 EST 2002
now i know why tamilians never progress..they are too set in their ways to accept new things
- From: Gowri (@ 61.6.38.132)
on: Tue Mar 19 01:44:13 EST 2002
naga
DO you mean ONE MAN brought about a total change in our culture? :)
- From: Mr. O (@ 64.105.35.164)
on: Tue Mar 19 02:16:26 EST 2002
Naga, before you start such threads, collect all the requisite info. There is a third "thing" that happened after ARR's advent, proliferation of pests in this forum that go around starting threads that deserve to be responded to, only by "beings" of their own kind.
- From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161)
on: Tue Mar 19 03:00:12 EST 2002
Naga
Just change ARR to IR in your posting description above and you will find that someone like you had a similar complaint 20 years back when IR came onto the scene...you have to accept the positive aspects of change otherwise like someone had mentioned in this thread..just one word "dinosaur".
Let me paraphrase what WhyNot had quoted before :
"In times of drastic change, it is only the LEARNERS who inherit the future.
The LEARNED find that they live in a world that no longer exists."
- ERIC HOFFE
- From: G.Ragavan (@ 202.144.44.226)
on: Tue Mar 19 03:48:19 EST 2002
Change is the only changeless thing in this world. If the quality is not good, the nature will throw it automatically. We need not struggle for that. Let the time decide everything.
BTW hope everyone understood my posting :-)
- From: Sambavam (@ 172.181.180.5)
on: Tue Mar 19 04:06:13 EST 2002
ARR may have improved the TFM industry but he has also reduced the need for talent and musical knowledge in this industry.Im not saying that ARR is a bad MD, in fact quite the opposite but if ARR hadn't introduced the technological aspects that he has,we would not have been subjected to the atrocities produced by HJ and other ARR wannabes.
- From: KUMAR (@ 203.121.0.15)
on: Tue Mar 19 05:03:51 EST 2002
dear naga,
wat happened to u, R U MAD OR WAT,
A WONDERFUL MUSICIAN LIKE HIM U TELLL........
HMMM, REMEBER ALL UR RAJA`S SON FOLLOWING THE SAME STUYLE OF ARR N WOULD U BLAME THEM , DEFINETLY NOT , AM I RIGHT...
- From: Cheenu (@ 203.199.205.25)
on: Tue Mar 19 05:43:54 EST 2002
I have atlat come across n TFM pages a person who talkes sense.
Naga, What you have written is 100% true; it correctly analyzes TFM witout sounding biased.
Amidst the chaotic postings of Gowri, NoJalras and WhyNots, here is sombody who talkes sense.
- From: WhyNot (@ 203.24.100.132)
on: Tue Mar 19 05:56:55 EST 2002
"There is a third "thing" that happened after ARR's advent, proliferation of pests in this forum"
Mr O, was this forum in existence prior to the advent of ARR? NOM.
:-)
Cheenu, coming from u, I take that as a compliment. Cos I happened to notice tat the thread "Is IR an ET" made alot of sense to you. btw, why dont u go back to posting as "Paithiyam" like u once did?
- From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161)
on: Tue Mar 19 06:03:38 EST 2002
>>>>ARR may have improved the TFM industry but he has also reduced the need for talent and musical knowledge in this industry<<<
Sambavam...if ARR had not done that..someone else would have..maybe Karthik Raja or even Adityan...God forbid ! It was only a natural step...but ARR had the right combination of brains, talent, knowledge, luck etc. to pull it off.
- From: arun_uk (@ 213.121.212.122)
on: Tue Mar 19 07:44:51 EST 2002
Cosmician
The last line of your previous post is very true. It's not that easy to achieve what he has without the right combination of brains, talent, knowledge, luck etc. This logic holds good for anyone for that matter.
- From: ROTFL (@ 210.186.60.88)
on: Tue Mar 19 07:48:06 EST 2002
Two GOOD things that have happened from ARR's introduction is VARIETY and escape from jing-chak of tabla beats. :)
- From: twilight_zone (@ 202.88.152.159)
on: Tue Mar 19 08:38:13 EST 2002
:-))ROTFL, never knew tabla sounded "jing chak"...[ah, this has to really be someday ROTFL, when i got to "correct" your posting :-)]
- From: mahabs (@ 203.197.138.163)
on: Tue Mar 19 08:50:34 EST 2002
naga
i am really amused:) like many fans of hcarf.
anbudan
mahabs
- From: ROTFL (@ 210.186.61.113)
on: Tue Mar 19 08:56:50 EST 2002
twilight_zone
NEVER! :)
I got that sound correct. :)
The jing-chak is the sound of HCIRFs. :)
(tried to strike two-in-one. :))
- From: arun_uk (@ 213.121.212.121)
on: Tue Mar 19 09:09:57 EST 2002
ROTFL
Are you aware of Individual Perceptions? Music like anything is highly "Subjective".
Looks like you have prompted a new debate- "Tabla or Modern Drums"? Having raised this point can you provide any expert comments to try and validate your arguement against Tabla?
Simply, all I am asking is what is your rationale behind your belief that modern sounds are superior??? Well, if you say it's your personal preference that might sound entirely sensible. But there can be no feasible arguement to proclaim that the 'newer sounds' are better than their predecessors. I will be interested in positive comments from you or anyone(esp. any experts).
In addition what do you make of all the people who can adapt and acclimatize themselves to any 'brand' of music as long as it's enjoyable to them?
- From: WhyNot (@ 203.24.100.132)
on: Tue Mar 19 09:12:57 EST 2002
"if ARR had not done that..someone else would have"
Very well said cosmician.
U cudnt have made a more perfect statement.
And tat was a great quote.
And btw, it's good to know tat I'm not the only one amused by this thread mahabs. :-)
- From: ROTFL (@ 210.186.61.113)
on: Tue Mar 19 09:26:18 EST 2002
arun_uk, don't get to serious man. This is not a serious thread. :)
I was simply giving a dosage of the same medicine to naga, especially since the taste for music is too subjective.
I didn't say that drums are prefered over tabla (heaven's forbid). But it is indeed true that IR and tabla beats became inseparable in most of his songs of the late 80s. :)
Why do you think there is a need to "acclimatise" to music? Isn't enjoyment the primary reason for music?
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