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In spite of being such a big MD down south, why did IR not make it to the top in HFM

Topic started by Rajesh (@ 203.92.84.189) on Wed May 8 04:27:56 EDT 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

As legend has it, IR was signed for a couple of Hindi movies soon after Sadma. Sippy, the maker of Sholay, took IR as the MD. He wanted IR to get 'inspired' from some English number, which IR refused to do. Promptly Sippy had replaced someone else as the MD. IR filed a case against Sippy. And Sippy made sure that IR never got a chance in HFM. Do not know what happened to the case, but IR lost his market (!!!!) in HFM. I read this in a Telugu magazine quite some years back. This topic is to discuss this and also whether IR would have made it big in HFM. What are his plusses and minuses in HFM and how would Hindi music lovers reacted to IR kind of music. No personal attacks please.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: aruvi (@ 134.117.253.22) on: Fri May 17 11:07:32 EDT 2002
  
  There's a time for everything. There's a time for everyone.
  
  
• From: arunprakash (@ 210.49.115.122) on: Fri May 17 19:56:57 EDT 2002
  
  ilaiyaraaja is the only music composer in india who has been less influenced by hindi music style.many music directors of the past like msv,kvm,veda,were more influenced by the music of naushad, madan mohan, shankar jaikishen,etc etc. when raaja went to hindi he did not compromise on his style and he did what he wanted to do.during that time the hindi audiences were accustomed to the recycled tunes of bappi lahiri and laxmikanth pyarelal.so the original music of raaja did'nt go in to the ears of most of the hindi film music fans.moreover raaja was very much busy in the south doing movies in tamil and telugu a lot.
  
  
• From: Rajesh (@ 203.92.84.189) on: Sun May 19 21:17:30 EDT 2002
  
  Talking about MDs knowing languages to compose music - I dont think IR knew Telugu when he composed for Bhadrakali nor he understood the lyrics. But just look at the output.... simply mindblowing. Similar is the case with Seethakoka Chiluka, Alaigal Oivathillai in Tamil. Even though he sung a song, it was still that he did not know the language then. Hence I do not think knowing or not knowing language would make a difference for a composer.
  
  
• From: Rajesh (@ 203.92.84.189) on: Wed May 22 02:34:33 EDT 2002
  
  Or take Sadhana Sargam/Udit Narayan for instance. Haven't they settled well in TFM in spite of not knowing the language.
  
  
• From: Peter Pan (@ 207.203.164.10) on: Wed May 22 09:12:19 EDT 2002
  
  Hey Rajesh, you just can't compare Udit Narayan's Tamil singing with IR's Telugu singing... The former is pathetic and makes no attempt to get the pronunciation right, whether he is singing in Tamil or Telugu.
  Compared to that Sadhana is beginning to show a lt of promise. It is apparent that she has improved her diction a lot in Tamil.
  Most of the TFM singers have made an earnest attempt when it came to singing in Hindi.. there was slight accent, but it was never so bad as Udit's numbers. The only exception IMO is MGSreekumar who in Hindi almost sings in Malayalam! Check out his songs in ARR's Doli Sajake Rakhna and some of Priyadrsan's recent Hindi flicks.
  
  I wonder if the HFM audience will ever appreciate IR's vintage music. Look at the reviews by most sites... even some of the intelligent, classic compositions of ARR get no recognition. According to them, if it has some catchy beat like Chayya Chayya or Muquabla Muquabla, the album is great. How many people bought an album like Zubeidaa?
  
  The reviewers write trash. According to them ARR is repetitive, every 2nd song of his is like Roja's song!! A 10 year school kid can probably write better music reviews. They are never qualified to write reviews.. still they influence album sales quite a bit. They talk mostly about the star cast, the producer, ecven the budget.. and sum up by saying if it is 'Hit Music' or not.
  
  I wish some good banner-director team ropes in IR to compose for a commercial Hindi film.. and markets it well. Only then it will reach the people and they will enetually realize how much of his music they have missed over the decades.. or will they?
  
  
• From: Deepak (@ 146.235.2.37) on: Wed May 22 15:06:33 EDT 2002
  
  Peter Pan,
  
  I couldn't agree with you better. Even if I would like to say I don't care whether HFM audience like IR or not, some of the reviews really pissed me off. For instance there was one review that said Lajja's BGM was "not bad". I wonder if they ever made a sincere attempt to even listen to it properly.
  
  I think yaaro posted a list of reviews for Lajja's BGM. Some foreigners who never knew about IR commented about how well the music director had grasped the essence of the situation and composed aptly for it.
  
  There was however one exception amongst these clan of reviewers. I think you can really classify him as an HCIRF. (Forgot his name). He had given glowing reviews for both Heyram and Lajja.
  
  
• From: arunprakash (@ 139.134.57.153) on: Wed May 22 20:59:26 EDT 2002
  
  well said peter pan
  
  
• From: avr (@ 143.127.3.10) on: Thu May 23 01:44:38 EDT 2002
  
  Most of the TFM singers have made an earnest attempt when it came to singing in Hindi
  
  NO WAY!!!
  
  
• From: Vj (@ 203.197.20.230) on: Thu May 23 02:31:11 EDT 2002
  
  IR is distancing himself from commercial movies in the likes of 5 songs, 4 fight... and concentrating on story-based movies. the present IR is a lot better than the commercial IR, IMO. i am not talking in terms of hit songs but good songs and BGM. Almost anyone can give a hit song.. but good songs and good BGMs are a rarity.
  
  IR doesnt need marketing.. his music will speak for himself. idhukkumela HFM poidhaan pera nilainaattanumnu IR-ku avasiyam illai.
  
  When we're raving about "December 16"'s songs, Filmfare posted KR's music as the film's negative points. Oru tamizhan HFM-la periya aal aavardhu avangalaala jeeranikka mudialai. Right from the silent era to the present day. IR, KR are no exceptions. ARR was extremely lucky but still he faces brickbats from HFM guys.
  
  
• From: jagan (@ 61.11.73.84) on: Thu May 23 03:43:27 EDT 2002
  
  Dear guys,
  
  It is an obsolute waste of time to discuss about the BG scores in reference to HFM.How can you ever imagine that BG scores like lajja & hey ram be appreciated. My point is they will never attempt to understand the role of BG score in their life time. I hope that is the reason that songs are composed by some one else and BG is done by the secondary grade MD/arrangers.
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 193.188.97.152) on: Thu May 23 03:44:11 EDT 2002
  
  Vj
  
  <>
  
  Since when?
  
  Take the last 10 years.IR would have done atleast 100 movies.But save for the following how many had a decent storyline,acting etc.,
  1.Azhagi
  2.Kasi
  3.Sethu
  4.Kadhalukku Mariyadhai
  5.Bharathi
  6.Avadharam
  
  I might have missed one or two;still it works out to a awful 8-9% of his movies.Most of them were stupid movies like Poovarasan,Rajastan,Kumbagonam gobalu,Adhiradipadai etc.
  
  He muffed with his choice of movies knowing fully well that better directors/Producers have deserted him.
  He has become desparate and signs movies like Devan ..when the name of Arun Pandyan has never been associated with good storylines,good movies.
  
  What was the necessity to score just the BGM for a movie which had a name like Anu Malik.Friendship with Santoshi..?If Santoshi had been an admirer out and out he would have given IR the full movie.Santoshi s movies never had been talked about for their good music.
  
  Though i would agree with you on HFM critics generally -"December 16"- certainly the BGM was not the hight point.
  
  ARR lucky? How many times?This is a case for antacid.The HFM audience /critics have to be silenced and not convinced ,that is what ARR has acheived.
  
  
• From: avr (@ 143.127.3.10) on: Thu May 23 04:23:33 EDT 2002
  
  It is an obsolute waste of time to discuss about the BG scores in reference to HFM.How can you ever imagine that BG scores like lajja & hey ram be appreciated. My point is they will never attempt to understand the role of BG score in their life time.
  
  Vj,
  
  You wouldnt have said this had you listened to the superlative background scores by Salil Chaudhary, Naushad, Roshan and many others in almost all their movies.
  
  
• From: Vj (@ 203.197.20.233) on: Thu May 23 04:28:26 EDT 2002
  
  OISG... my post was regarding HFM not accepting ppl from South india. IR-ku vakkaalathu vaangardhu en velai illai,period.
  
  i was speaking about the 'current IR' of Kaasi, Azhagi etc. just 'coz i am a fan of someone, i need not kooja-thookkify for whatever he/she does. If IR (or ARR or a Manirathnam) does some crap, I wd bleed. if talent,whereever it maybe, whoever has it, is wasted, its concernable.
  
  Devan's BG has to be seen, so no comments on that.
  
  i am not averse to ARR if he becomes a top MD in HFM,Hollywood whatsover, rather wd be very much happy that someone from Tamil nadu is at the top, wherever it maybe and whatever the field maybe. yaara irundha enna... namma ooru aalu.. adhu podhum. hope i am clear.
  
  "ARR lucky? How many times?" - gud question.. the way HFM ppl hate tamilians, it remains to be seen. this reminds me of a quote/reply from IRA on an abortive attempt on the life of Margaret Thatcher which goes like "your PM has to be lucky everytime.. but we need to be lucky just once".
  again, if ARR is done in by them, its again HFM's loss, not ARR's,period. nalla talent irundha TFM will appreciate anyone. but HFM is not like that.
  
  This is a case for antacid."... for who? me? sorry. no comments.
  
  
• From: Vj (@ 203.197.20.233) on: Thu May 23 04:30:52 EDT 2002
  
  eh avr... that aint my post.
  
  
• From: Rajesh (@ 203.92.84.189) on: Thu May 23 04:48:37 EDT 2002
  
  Slowly we are digressing into something that is not connected with the essence of this thread. Request you all to assess IR's strength's and weaknesses in marketing himself in HFM
  
  
• From: :-) (@ 128.107.253.40) on: Thu May 23 04:48:46 EDT 2002
  
  >> the superlative background scores by Salil Chaudhary, Naushad, Roshan <<
  
  Salilda i may agree...others, sorry.
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 193.188.97.152) on: Thu May 23 05:06:27 EDT 2002
  
  sORRY Vj
  
  "Antacid" was not to hurt you.But the comments "lucky" "macham" have been made on ARR s conquest of HFM which is derogatory.
  
  The HFM crtics tore him down when Daud happened but ARR made them eat humble pie with superb "Period"scores of "Lagan" "1947-earth""Zubeida" and now "TLOBS".
  
  He has put them in their place and made them think about Tamil BGM and music.
  
  When Roja happened it was Jamu Sughand who marketed Mani and ARR.I find them smart and enterprising..rather shrewd enought to identify the winning stuff.So IR has to come up with something similar.
  
  I am sure i will get rejoinders like IR need not have to rpove his worth to a business tycoon to get marketed..he is above those crap ..etc.But even for "Amrutham" you need good packaging and promo slot these days.
  
  
• From: curses (@ 203.199.231.99) on: Thu May 23 05:09:14 EDT 2002
  
  jus truin to get a pic off the link i wanna visit..
  sorry for the disturbance.. i'll be off!
  
  

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