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Music directors !!

Topic started by Indian Music Fan (@ 204.50.249.133) on Sun May 13 19:02:00 EDT 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Hey guys

I want to know what you think about Laxmikant Pyarelal and R.D. Burman. How do you like their music and their style and how would you compare them to Illyaraja and A.R. Rahman.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: IMF (@ 204.50.249.133) on: Thu May 17 22:32:22 EDT 2001
  
  And why do you want my phone number ???. Please answer !!
  
  
• From: IMF (@ 204.50.249.133) on: Thu May 17 22:32:35 EDT 2001
  
  And why do you want my phone number haris ???. Please answer !!
  
  
• From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Thu May 17 23:11:13 EDT 2001
  
  IMF - BULL S*********** TO THE CORE.
  "Yes it is a fact that Hindustani music is based more on instruments and carnatic more on vocal. A person who knows classical music will tell you this"
  
  Let me explain the variety of instruments (melodic - not percussion)used and adapted in Carnatic Music.
  
  Violin - in hindustani??
  Naadaswaram
  Chitra Veenai
  Gottu Vaadhyam
  Flute
  Mandolin
  Guitar (thanks to Prasanna)
  Saxaphone (thanks to Kadri.G)
  Jalatharangam (like a xylophone)
  
  How can u say, a music form based on vocal alone was adapted into so many instruments?
  
  Mr. Nikhil Banerjee's comments sound more like yours, having predisposition to North being the best. IMF for the last time, please stop talking before enrage me futher.
  
  
  
  
• From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Thu May 17 23:20:03 EDT 2001
  
  Don't ever come here to a TFM forum and say Hindustani music is better or compare IR with others. Go and say that maybe to your friends. Carnatic music is still traditional and has resisted changes no doubt. That is why it has the flavor unchaged. But it has never gone dry as that idiot N.B said. People still learn and give recitals all over the world, and those artists also perform in Music Academy in India. It doesnt mean they are not accepted back home.
  
  
  
• From: e.hari (@ 138.89.108.247) on: Thu May 17 23:51:53 EDT 2001
  
  IMF,
  On the contrary, I feel Hindustani music is very resistive to changes. e.g. a pure western instrument like violin was adopted and approved in carnatic, where hindustani music, it was not. BTW, when was the last time, the hindustani music was flowing constantly, mugal time? i.e 500 yrs back. I mean, it would have become stagnant by this time.
  You talked about HFM being superior, because it had more influnces, but does not mean, it is superior. If so, 90's pop music Should be better than 60's or 70's.
  I am just curious, how much you have listened to south indian music in general. I agree that Hindi has more audience,but some of the best things in the movie business are happening in regional movies. Satyajith ray or adoor gopalakrishan did not earn their reputation by doing hindi movies, and they are the best directors, IFM has seen, same thing can be said about Music directors.
  
  Regards
  e.hari
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: comment (@ 65.9.136.158) on: Thu May 17 23:54:25 EDT 2001
  
  Swamiji --- you are de-grading yourself,
  if you are upset thani adipiya...poi thani adi...polambathe......:(
  
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.1.67) on: Fri May 18 06:48:42 EDT 2001
  
  Time to sum up :
  
  1) Is LP, SD, RDB etc. etc. > IR ?
  
  Still waiting for Raj to dissect and analyse 2 songs (1 HFM and 1 TFM of IR from the same category) and prove his point.
  
  2) Northies take FM lightly || Southies take it seriously
  
  IMF...for God's sake...when that colleague of mine said that in Mumbai people didn't take films and music so seriously...my reply was IF that is the case then their taste is crappy ! Sorry for not being clear...
  
  3) HFM vs TFM
  
  >>>Though tamil music is good you cannot compare it with Hindi Film music because of the different influences. That is why HFM is more varied.<<<
  
  What influences ? I have been seeing the influence of TFM on HFM (80s and 90s) more actually and with the advent of ARR..even Anu Malik has changed his style of composing and it has given birth to a clone - Sandeep Chowta !
  
  HFM varied - Yes, Quality - No
  
  TFM varied - Yes, Quality - Yes
  
  
  4) Hindustani vs. Carnatic
  
  That is for you experts to argue out...but from what I've heard from serious practitioners...Carnatic is more deeper...that's why they say that once you master Carnatic, composing or singing in any other genre is extremely easy...maybe reason why IR and ARR could make serious international acclaim (IR with RPO and ARR with Andrew Lloyd Weber)
  
  I personally don't want to argue over all these topics...but I really feel hurt when the North still doesn't give geniuses like Shivaji and IR their due...
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.1.67) on: Fri May 18 06:51:02 EDT 2001
  
  Or maybe the geniuses and talent of IR, Shivaji and Kamal Hassan and the evergreen appeal of Rajnikanth and his style has so overwhelmed and given them a complex that they just ignore..
  
  
• From: Indian Music Fan (@ 204.50.249.133) on: Fri May 18 08:08:48 EDT 2001
  
  Can you give me opinions on why these people in the south were influenced by people from the North !. I understood that you weren't clear cosmician !!!
  
  Thanks
  
  
• From: raj (@ 212.153.190.3) on: Fri May 18 08:13:00 EDT 2001
  
  
  Well, hot heads try as you may you cannot change the fact that past HFM MDs were any day better than IR.
  And for those who say southindians dont like simple music, please do tell me why ARR is no.1 from the
  time Roja came. He almost ate IR. Dont tell me his compositions are "caratic".
  
  Just bcos "Chiku biku" from Gentleman and "April Mayeley" became a rage at some points in TFM shall i relate that to the taste of TFM.
  Just bcos u listen to HFM in tea stalls, dont think others write here with the same experience.
  
  Actually i have heard enough BS here. Just plain talking. Can someone really list out songs of IR which were unmatched.
  Dont presume anytime that i dont like IR.As i have stated earlier to call him a genius is an understatement.
  
  Come to think of one more thing. Most of the carnatic based songs created in the south can be almost directly patched on to the Raga. I dont know how creative that is.
  Listen to Sagar Sangamam: U can directly relate most songs to the Rag they are based on.Does this require creativity?
  
  Listen to "Merey Naina Sawan Bhadon".
  In a tribute to RD, SPB sang this song. When he completed he said "Its impossible to imagine how this beautiful creation could have been thought about from the original raga". He said that with folded hands. Doesnt imply that RD is great bcos SPB
  said. Listen to the song and u will know that.
  If u want to Listen to Persian numbers, its ur will.
  
  
  And for the jokers who say things like "music is only in Tamil blood" better check where Carnatic originated.
  Also something like "Pattuku Patu" starts with inspiration from "Antakshari". Though Zee started it as a program and southern
  channels followed, it is a common play/competetion in most of north dating back to as far as i can remember.
  I dont have to remind the popularity of HFM down south before IR came.
  
  And there are people here who write some numbers in TFM and say nothing like those exists in HFM.
  U are right. The once existing in HFM (old) are better so they cant be like TFM
  Listen to Rafi, Lata numbers of yesteryears and check if the songs mentioned by u stand any chance.
  (SPB and Yesudas regard Rafi as the most gifted and versatile male singer ever. )
  "Tum aa gaye ho", "Is Mod sey jaatey hain", "Chaltey chaltey mujhey koi","Naam gum gaayega", "Piya tosey naina laagi","Kuch to log kahengey",to mention a few are some numbers the like of which are not there in TFM Repertoire.
  
  The kind of hold , old HFM had and still has on people is unmatched in past TFM.
  There were Rafi clubs and others when probably most people discussing here were not born
  or were babies.
  
  
  And dont think some northy is telling all this. I am very much a tamilian and i am in TN so ur BS like "another northy trying to be IN with northies" wont work.
  
  ARR has only reflected the current HFM state and u people are using it just like the politians jump at oppurtunities.He certainly is better than most HFM MDs today.
  But i cant think of any great creative/complex number he has created to talk of simple music. We know how he CREATES music.
  
  Finally, the people whose work u crave about (be it IR, SPB, Yesudas etc) themselves are in no way in sync with anything u "narrow minded-biased" people have to say.
  
  
  
• From: COSMICIAN :( (@ 194.170.1.132) on: Fri May 18 08:22:23 EDT 2001
  
  Raj..you have some nerve....when no here prior to your instigation has ever put down the North..
  
  >>>ARR has only reflected the current HFM state and u people are using it just like the politians jump at oppurtunities<<<
  
  ...no one is using ARR's statement to undermine the musical taste of the entire north...get that into your frazzled brain first !!! you are not going to win hearts here...unless you display your brain power and show your technical analyis''like I've asked an umpteen times an analysis of any old HFM song or new...and an IR song from the same category and see who scores more in Style, Melody, Orchestrations, Unique Patterns, Bass rhythms, Percussion etc...
  
  YOU PROVE THIS FIRST AND THEN YOU CAN RANT AND RAVE ALL THAT YOU WANT !!!
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.1.132) on: Fri May 18 08:23:49 EDT 2001
  
  Read :
  
  when no here prior to your instigation has ever put down the North..
  
  as
  
  when no ONE here prior to your instigation has ever put down the North..
  
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.1.132) on: Fri May 18 08:37:10 EDT 2001
  
  >>>Listen to "Merey Naina Sawan Bhadon".
  In a tribute to RD, SPB sang this song. When he completed he said "Its impossible to imagine how this beautiful creation could have been thought about from the original raga". He said that with folded hands. Doesnt imply that RD is great bcos SPB said. Listen to the song and u will know that.<<<
  
  The genius of a MD does not lie alone in the Melody he derives..instrumentation, style, arrangements, chord patterns in the instrumentation, rhythms etc. all come into play...IR has done equal if not better in deriving original melodies from Tamil Folk and carnatic...volumes have been written about it...and HE BEATS RDB HOLLOW IN ALL THE OTHER ABOVE MENTIONED DEPARTMENTS !!!!
  
  
  >>>>And for the jokers who say things like "music is only in Tamil blood" better check where Carnatic originated. <<<<
  
  Excuse me...I didn't say ONLY IN TAMIL BLOOD...I see no point in arguing with you after this...I'm not going to respond to such inane and stupid replies...CHECK WHERE CARNATIC ORIGINATED..whaddyou mean !!! Tell us if u know !!
  
  >>>Also something like "Pattuku Patu" starts with inspiration from "Antakshari". Though Zee started it as a program and southern
  channels followed, it is a common play/competetion in most of north dating back to as far as i can remember.<<<<
  
  This shows how old you are...I remember playing Pattuku Pattu in our annual family get-togethers since the early 70s...HOW DUMB YOU CAN BE TO MAKE SUCH STATEMENTS !!
  
  >>I dont have to remind the popularity of HFM down south before IR came.<<<
  
  Yes...this only shows how broad-minded we were...my dad used to see Hindi films, hum hindi songs..but also introduced me to old Tamil songs with beautiful lyrics and excellent meanings...the genius of Kannadasan
  
  RAFI fan clubs ? We have KANNADASAN Fan Clubs..amazing lyrical content...don't tell me now that the northies only appreciated the voice and not the meanings in the lyrics ?
  
  
  
  
• From: raj (@ 212.153.190.3) on: Fri May 18 10:34:10 EDT 2001
  
  
  >>when no ONE here prior to your instigation has ever put down the North..
  
  Probably u arent reading everything. People in this forum sometimes say anything to prove a point.
  Its difficult to hold nerve always.My previos posting had something to do with those postings.
  
  >>"..instrumentation, style, arrangements, chord patterns in the instrumentation, rhythms etc. all come into play...
  IR BEATS RDB HOLLOW IN ALL THE OTHER ABOVE MENTIONED DEPARTMENTS !!!! ""
  
  Hollow statements man. For every guy who says this there are at least 10 who WILL say the opposite.
  When referring to "Merey Naina Sawan bhadon" i was talking about creativity not melody.
  U missed that in the lsit above. But that makes the difference.Everything above can be learnt but not creativity.
  That is how u have all the TDH who have become MDs today.
  So u see words dont matter.Any TDH can blabber anything but that doesnt prove anything.
  [[By the way crampping a song with 1000 violins and other such instruments doesnt make a great MD. What finally matters is the
  whole song and how long that is remembered. ]]
  
  
  I dont want to dissect songs, but i have given u some songs in my previos posting (At least that is
  MORE than the HOLLOW STATEMENT u guys always make).Try finding such songs in TFM.
  
  >>...no one is using ARR's statement to undermine the musical taste of the entire north...
  get that into your frazzled brain first !!! you are not going to win hearts here...unless you
  display your brain power and show your technical analyis''like I've asked an umpteen times an
  analysis of any old HFM song or new...and an IR song from the same category
  
  My dear genius-, my posting was a result of some guys trying to play down the north.
  I dont need to win all the corrupted hearts here.For the remaining part my answer is same as the one for
  above. In addition i will repeat something of my previous posting
  ""Tum aa gaye ho", "Is Mod sey jaatey hain", "Chaltey chaltey mujhey koi","Naam gum gaayega",
  "Piya tosey naina laagi","Kuch to log kahengey",to mention a few are some numbers the like of which
  are not there in TFM Repertoire.
  
  >>RAFI fan clubs ? We have KANNADASAN Fan Clubs..amazing lyrical content...don't tell me now that
  the northies only appreciated the voice and not the meanings in the lyrics ?
  
  Rafi fan clubs was only an instance. I thought u were mature enough to understand.
  
  >>This shows how old you are... I remember playing Pattuku Pattu in our annual family get-togethers since the early 70s...
  HOW DUMB YOU CAN BE TO MAKE SUCH STATEMENTS !!
  
  Thanks for the broadminded compliments.Problem is that antakshari being a popular play in north is widely known
  but i dont have knowledge of ur family get togethers and havent seen any in TN where this was played.Probably u have
  a north indian connection(just kidding)
  
  >>I see no point in arguing with you after this...I'm not going to respond to such inane and stupid replies
  That exactly how i feel when i read all the the hollow statements some people make here. But at some point cant control
  and have to react to all these stupid postings.
  
  

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