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S.P Bala the greatest??????

Topic started by Jay (@ bat-50-212.tm.net.my) on Thu Mar 30 11:45:56 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

hi guys,

For me spb is the best bcos he is an all rounder/versatile and conquered tfm 4 a long time...But some are saying that upcoming singers like HH and UK already reached spb's stature and maybe better than him...What are your comments??? I am a fanatic fan of this great spb..so my fellow fanatics,plz e-mail me if you want to discuss more abt spb.....

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Shruti (@ 212.153.190.3) on: Tue Jun 5 01:51:08 EDT 2001
  
  Swami, plz look at my posting again. U wont see a comparsion being drawn.It was a request to leave Rafi alone.
  The only way u can ensure people staying within TFM ambit is by not starting of open threads like "XXX the best".
  U cant expect people who have seen A to Z not to respond to things like this.Probably u can request people here to add " in TFM" to
  limit the scope. It will help too, as u will only get people who always share ur opinion.Till u go to grave , u can then be happy
  that all shared ur opinion
  
  --Shruti
  
  
• From: Indian Music Fan (@ 204.50.249.133) on: Tue Jun 5 08:13:51 EDT 2001
  
  Hello Hello Hello, the topic was not started by me it was by another person. Shruti you are right in what you said. Swamiji, don't act like a dumb A** ok. I am only comparing because people here are comparing. I am proving my point with facts. You on the other hand don't even know how to prove facts based on what i have seen you write in the past threads. Don't act like you know a lot by writing BS. Write what you feel is right and your opinion based in SOLID facts. I'm sure If someone started comparing people you would get involved as well and start comparing people to your opinion with solid facts so that they may learn a thing or two. But whenever someone is trying to prove points with given evidence, you shy away and judge them on what they say. Please stop doing this and engage in a healthy discussion. We don't want to start hatred in this forum. Let's all get along. Shruti, tell me if i'm right in your opinion !!!
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ 207.43.195.201) on: Tue Jun 5 09:47:01 EDT 2001
  
  Swamiji:
  
  Let go. We are either dealing with a couple of juveniles OR couple of idiots trying to act like juveniles. peela kallu vittu erinjaa namma mEla thaan sidharum. I'm outa here!
  
  
• From: s (@ 212.153.190.3) on: Tue Jun 5 09:51:43 EDT 2001
  
  Some people can describe themselves perfectly.
  Thanx for realizing what u r
  
  
• From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Tue Jun 5 14:51:51 EDT 2001
  
  Shruti:
  Opinons based on comparisons kills an artist. Let it be within you and do not the world know. That is what I wanted to say.
  Moreover - this discussion on TFM is to let people know about the worth of our own music. Don't think we don't listen to Rafi's songs at all. But if you want to talk about him, start a separate thread.
  
  IMF here is your SOLID FACT:
  Everything was ok until IMF the grandest idiot of all said this: "SPB does have versatility, but Rafi sang all type of songs and he went inside the character himself. That i have seen nobody do"
  
  This was in reply to someone that merely said "SPB is a legend like Mohd. Rafi". Thats all. It was just a praise, but IMF-Idiot took that as a comparison.
  Now do you in your clear senses see WHO started the comparison?
  RajaG you are right. IMF has no brain, absolutely zero in his musical knowledge, and I am just wasting my time replying to him.
  BTW, RajaG - Did you compile the list of songs yet? I have like 2 shows coming up, so I shall start your work as soon as that is over.
  
  
• From: IMF (@ 204.50.249.133) on: Tue Jun 5 16:44:37 EDT 2001
  
  Swamiji, you do not have musical knowledge yourself. I didn't take it as a comparison. This is a thread to base your OWN opinions. Remember that !!. I said SPB has versatality but Rafi sang all types of songs as well and that he went inside the character which i have seen no character do. That is a true fact, that he sounded just like the character. I never said he is not a legend, i just said that in my opinion rafi is better. Can't i state my opinion here in this thread. If you think i shouldn't be stating my opinion here then you should have told me to start a new thread. Though this thread is based on SPB, someone can still say who they like, can't they ???. Shruti even said he liked rafi more than anyone as well as lv. What's wrong with that ??. we can't express ourselves ??. The person who started this topic asked for comments regarding HH and UK compared to SPB. I just said SPb is a legend but i don't think he is better than rafi which is my opinion. What is wrong with that !!. Then people started accusing my commenst and saying KK is better based on useless and stupid facts. Then this started as a comparison when people blindly blunted out things without giving facts. Your opinion is fine but the facts to prove them should be good and solid. That's all this is about. everyone loves music and let's discuss it in a calm matter !!
  
  
• From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Tue Jun 5 19:06:44 EDT 2001
  
  "If you are a serious listener of all good music then u will realize that no male singer is in Rafi's league" - assumes that others that don't like rafi are not serious listeners of music. How good is that opinion?
  
  Ok hear some of my opinions:
  
  I am the most smartest person in this world. Perhaps smarter than Albert Einstein.
  
  My underwear is the most beautiful looking underwear in this whole world. Not can Mike Tyson's underwear can stay up with mine.
  
  Email me if you want more opinions.
  
  
• From: IMF (@ 204.50.249.133) on: Tue Jun 5 22:41:00 EDT 2001
  
  By the way, i didn't write that opinion you quoted, Shruti did. read it for yourself !
  
  
• From: LV (@ 203.197.80.75) on: Thu Jun 7 00:33:53 EDT 2001
  
  RAJAG:
  
  >>>If you must present your case for Rafi, please mention appropriate examples. In the illustrious list of his renditions, you chose kyaa huaa thEraa vaadhaa? C'mon! In ajahu na aayE baalmaa, his brigaa has no control whereas Suman does a much better job.
  
  Sorry RajaG- i think YOU dont know what exmaples to quote. Rafi does a MUCH better job than Suman in this song anyday!!!
  
  
  >>> And live show versions of Duniya kE rakhwale are the worst examples of rafi's singing. In the name of improv he murders 'Mehal udhaas aur galiyaan sooni' with a total out of the raag neraval. No! This does not mean Rafi is a lesser artist. But it simply shows that YOU do not know what examples to quote.
  
  The last statement is applicable to YOU!!!
  And the raag is NOT murdered at all!!!!!!!!
  
  >>>True Rafi had more tricks in his arsenal than KK. However, KK had truly a remarkable gift - His Voice. Irrespective of the sthaayi, he carried a solid base in his voice.
  
  Oh no - Kishore's voice had that awful drawl. He was more hype than substance. Rafi,KJY,SPB,and many more beat him raw in all respects. Listen to how awfully KK sang 'Hamein tumse pyaar kitna' - he kills the song really.
  
  BTW - since u are all after the versatility factor as criterion #1 to judje an artist - tell me ONE bhajan,ghazal,classical song,thumri,good folk song like 'nain lad gayee hain...' ( and not the uncouth 'paan banaraswaala'),philosophical song, or a subtel song with nearly no instrument backup (like 'sau baar janam lenge'). Frankly speaking all of Kishores songs for Rajesh Khanna, Amitabh,Shatrughan,Vinod Khanna and all those artists majorly suck. They are drab and monotonous to say the least.
  
  Rafi and SPB beat Kishore like hell in range,versatility,conveying of emotion. And Rafi beats him again in diction - whether Sanskrit,Hindi,Urdu,Gujrathi or Marathi.
  Comparing KK to RAFI/SPB is worse than comparing LP to IR (:-).
  
  
  >>>>>Which is why even a very ordinary "phir bHi mEraa man pyaasaa" sounds resonant in his voice. Rafi, by contrast, did suffer in the base notes - please pay attention to his live show version of Oh Duniya kE rakhwaalE. He sounds like he is touching ni3 when he says "Oh" instead of the appropriate ni (ni1).
  
  As far as Rafi's bass goes, listen to his Ghalib ghazals with Naushad. And to his songs in the 40s. and those with 'Ravi' - 'Sau baar janam lenge'. And to 'megha re bole ghanan ghanan' in Dil Dekhe Dekho - that shows his breath control and massive span again.
  
  His bass is excellent. And again - u are quoting wrong examples I think.
  
  >>>>>And after KK came into the scene with Aradhana, it is true that Rafi became a 2nd Hero singer (or worse for beggars, death scenes, dads etc). You may think it was unfair, but it was not UNTRUE.
  
  yeah yeah yeah - I see TREMENDOUS dignity in this statement. Yeah right - hats off to you really. When Kishore came to prominence he got all those crap songs absolutely. Are u off ur brains to compare the Aradhana songs by Kishore to Rafi's best ones?????????
  And now see this - Rafi was the favourite of SDB,Naushad,Roshan,LP,SJ,Salil,KA,CR,Vasant Desai,Ghulam Mohammed,Husnlal Bhagatram, Khayyam,Jaidev and so many more!!!! When HFM started deteriorating in the male section - thnaks to Kishore - Rafi sang ghazals with C Arjun and Naushad. And he did sing several semiclassical then.And he did Marathi and Kannada albums and bhajans- all qualtitatively much superior to all the crap Kishore snag in the 70s and worse in the 80s.
  
  Now another thing - whenever Jaidev or RDB or Ravindra Jain wanted a classical song or a ghazal they took Rafi/KJY/Suresh Wadkar/Hariharan(!!!!!!)
  and NOT Kishore (thank God!!!!!!)
  
  
  Regards - LV
  
  
  
  
  
• From: LV (@ 203.197.82.13) on: Thu Jun 7 00:47:10 EDT 2001
  
  Respected RajaG:
  
  ( I am copying a response of IMF out here - that'll show u how it is wrong to assume that RDB preferred KK over Rafi)
  
  "And though RDB did use kishore extensively, he always had atleast one song in many of his movies sung by rafi, and that would be the song which would become a hit and outshine all the KK songs in the movie. IMAGINE THAT !!. I can give u examples :
  
  Yaadon ki baraat - Churaliya hai
  
  Abdullah - Maine poocha chand se
  
  Hum kisi se kum nahin (rafi basically outshone KK the whole movie - could KK have done the Kalavati based qawwali???)
  
  Caravan (rafi again outshone KK)
  
  Burning Train - could KK have done the Kedar based qawwali???
  
  Pyar ka mausam - Ni sultana re (with lata) and YES
  tum bin jaoun ka ha ( rafi did outshine kk here and not the other way around. Just listen to KK's version it sounds as if his voice is being run over by a car. He CAN'T even sing the high notes properly. If rafi had sung the sad version, he would have effectively rendered the high notes and brought it to a whole new level. But anyways, rafi's version which was the happy one was still better)
  
  There are so many other examples which if you want i can list them for you. I don't know what RDB liked in KK's voice. I think he should have used rafi more than he did. How can you compare the songs that kishore has sang in his career to rafi's. Rafi sang all types of songs whereas MD's only gave Kishore songs which he could sing which were simple. Rafi was a favourite with all MD's and kishore wasn't. Why do you think all big names like SJ, LP, SDB, MM, Naushad, Jaidev, KA all used rafi more than kishore. RDB even used rafi alot in his career. And Rafi did not decline after aradhna, he was always there throughout the seventies and often outshone KK."
  
  
  Lastly RajaG - I need to show u 2 articles
  #1: the version of the 'Rafi KK' war - an article that shows how poorly most KK fans argue.
  
  #2: an article showing that Rafi very often outshone KK in the 70s too!!! That'll prove the factual incorrectness of the 'beggar' part of your didgnified arguments. So much so that some MDs were so tired of KK after Rafi died that they switched to Suresh Wadkar,KJY,Hariharan and Talat Aziz.
  
  And have u faced the misfortune of hearing KKs awful version of 'Man re tu kaahe na dheer dhare'??? I did and so did my dad!!!
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: LV (@ 203.197.82.13) on: Thu Jun 7 00:53:01 EDT 2001
  
  IMF:
  
  Like u am a fan of Rafi - but ALSO of SPB. I dont think u know Tamil or Telugu?????
  
  Well - to start getting aqainted with SPB listen to Shnkarabharanam. I heard SPB was not classically trained at that time. (please correct me if I am wrong) But listen to these songs - they show SPBs impeccable control over swar and shruti!!!!
  here's the link: http://www.megacinema.com
  
  Choose 'telugu songs' and then in the edit box 'movie title' write Sankarbharanam. And u'll feel like listening to it 100 times.
  
  I heard those songs when I was 6-7 years old. And I listen to those very often even now . I cant get tired of these songs - especially those by SPB. And do visit 'www.swara.com' to listen to SPBs Tamil collection.
  
  And dont blame me if ur phone bill soars high!!! :-).
  
  LV
  
  

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