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Compare and Contrast IR's musical style(s), especially with the BGM tracks, with those of composers of Hollywood

Topic started by Music_lover (@ 202.141.98.226) on Wed Apr 28 08:58:08 EDT 2004.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Compare and Contrast IR's musical style(s), especially with the BGM tracks, with those of composers of Hollywood, viz., Maurice Jarre, Henri Mancini, John Williams, Jerry Goldsmith, Bernstein, John Barry, Alan Sylvistri, Danny Elfman, Ennio Morricone, Howard Shore, Hans Zimmer, James Horner and so on

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: skumar (@ 219.65.112.27) on: Wed Apr 28 18:46:13 EDT 2004
  
  Was the soundtrack to Lajja released?
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 136.182.2.222) on: Thu Apr 29 00:00:54 EDT 2004
  
  WHOA!!!! What a thread! Muisc_Lover: Your posts were fantastic. Please continue. It was great reading your posts. Are you from chennai?
  
  
• From: Music_lover (@ 202.141.98.226) on: Thu Apr 29 07:52:16 EDT 2004
  
  Srivatsan - I am from many places - but basically have my roots in Panthalkudi, which is near Paramakudi, which is in the vicinity of Madurai (yennappu, nacchunu irukka?) - was in Chennai for quite some time did all my schooling there
  
  
• From: Kiran (@ 203.106.8.142) on: Thu Apr 29 08:18:57 EDT 2004
  
  Ladies and gentlmen,
  
  Presenting….
  
  ILAYARAJA- educating music
  John williams – powerful music
  Christopher young – professional music
  Hanz zimmer - royal music
  James horner – class music
  Jerry goldsmith –solid music
  
  
  
• From: Kiran (@ 203.106.8.142) on: Thu Apr 29 08:20:09 EDT 2004
  
  AR RAHMAN - Edited music
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Thu Apr 29 08:24:50 EDT 2004
  
  Guys, the great scores by hollywood composers like hans zimmer and the likes are evenly matched by the visuals. Thats what according to me makes the whole difference. Lets take Pirates of carribean by Klaus bedalt as a recent example. The way the picturisation was done is absolutely phenomenal. You can listen to the tracks seperately and at once the visuals start to roll on u'r minds. Compare this with the indian scenario. All the wonderfull scores of IR being wasted for worthless visuals(Apart from a few!!).
  IR's score in kaalapaani can also be included to top class orchestration scores. It's the scale of the movie which determines how grand the score needs to be and in india, we simply dont have that kind of movie being made. Those that were made had great scores that can be compared to holly wood composers.(films like HeyRam and kaalapaani).
  Apart from these, dont you guys think that Dmitry Shostakovich also inspires IR. His 5th symphony probably inspired IR to come up with a grand score in "Sundari Kannal" song of the film dalapathi.
  
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Thu Apr 29 08:26:58 EDT 2004
  
  Gyan and music_lover, Have u guys heard the tracks for the annimated film "ice age" by David Newmann. It was indeed refreshing!!
  
  
• From: rajasaranam (@ 210.214.229.27) on: Thu Apr 29 13:46:43 EDT 2004
  
  wow wat a thread music_lover
  
  i was watching brother bear a few days back and i found astounding similarity betn IR's music and the BGM of the movie. especially the scenes when all three brothers take on the Bear> the chasing music >the music when the fight takes place and everything reminded me of IR. the biggest similarity was when 'Sitka' sacrifies himself to save the two brothers > the flute bit in the following scene[ this bit comes all along the movie after that].... we can listen to the same bit in IR's 'nothing but wind' title track.
  
  keep it up music_lover this has been the most interesting thread after so many days.
  
  Kiran,
  Pls never bring ARR into this thread. we all understand ur feelings.
  
  
• From: Gyan (@ 4.158.114.199) on: Thu Apr 29 14:28:30 EDT 2004
  
  OSHO, NO! seems like of late, there are a lot of composers abroad studying IR!
  
  
  No matter what comparisons with any composer, like Guitar Prassana said, it is difficult to anyone who has contributed to the music VOCABULARY as much as IR.
  
  The point is: there are immense variety of musical pieces, phrases, passages in so many instrumental derivations or sounds produced by innovative combinations of instruments from IR that no matter what grand scale of orchestration is achieved by Hollywood composers, i have seen only a few that "totally thrilled" me instantly as have IR' sounds, pick an interlude or prelude, you'll hear beautiful beautiful sounds that no one has even imagined. except that thrill was found in one great genius' music, called John Barry. I've picked that level of exotic sound in the very very first few notes of the James Bond theme as the movie starts with the rolling circle view.
  
  This has been attempted by no Indian composer before or since then, since their focus has hardly been on Western instrumentalism.
  
  This is why even comparing Hollywood composers with IR on the real creative level does not make sense, yes, there are great Western themes and it is good to see that Indian composer' literally litter similar stuff in even so-so songs.
  
  And, they are MEMORABLE more than you realize. You hear Pink Panther theme played all over the world throught the decades, then it becomes memorable. Likewise Radio Ceylon has made most songs of Tamil composers memorable for me, giving me more THRILLS than say any Western theme. Not just catchy, intelligently, beautiful, but THRILLING, that element alone makes the difference for me.
  
  SO, YOU GIVE IR AN HOLLYWOOD ORCHESTRA, RECORDING INGENUITY, A CONDUCTOR AND A STORY LINE WITH EMOTIONAL AND RURAL SCOPE, PREFERABLY, THEN I TELL YOU SOMETHING. HUMANITY WILL REALIZE THE DEVASTATING POWER OF MUSIC ON THE CONSCIOUSNESS AND SOUL - AS NEVER EVER BEFORE EXPERIENCED!!!!
  
  Unfortunately, IR' music is what it is because of where he is. So, if he had started out in Hollywood, a culture with 2000 years of musical history cannot hold out much, as from composers who breathed a 10,000 year old culture that perhaps signified onset cultural consciousness. IR goes way back several millenia, Hollywood maybe over a millenia. Now, there is a difference, yet Hollywood has done genuinely great in musical sensibility, more than in creativity, the basis of which is depth and oldness of culture.
  
  
• From: MADDY (@ 203.94.236.50) on: Thu Apr 29 14:30:31 EDT 2004
  
  Kiran, ARR-MUSIC and rest SHUT UP..........
  
  THERE"S NO LIFE BEYOND MUSIC,
  THERE"S NO MUSIC BEYOND AR.RAHMAN.......
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Fri Apr 30 02:14:11 EDT 2004
  
  Gyan, how come u guys confidently tell that lot of hollywood composers are influenced by IR. Just curious to know that!. As a great IR admirer, i would be glad to know the profoundity of the above statement.
  I happened to hear the "Hey Ram" tracks after a few years and when i was hearing the tracks, the visuals start to flow. This proves this mans ingenuity. The title track, perhaps signifies that IR is on par the best of the hollywood composers as far as WCM is concerned.
  One more thing i would like to know is to compare the bgm for a particular scene in "Ramana" , copied from gladiator when Vijaykanth thinks about his daughter and wife with that of the same scene of the original score by Hans Zimmer. That would be interesting. Wouldnt it be?
  
  And to finish it up, MADDY, if you think so then probably you would be missing lot of good music my dear friend. -:)
  
  
• From: Raja (@ 128.107.253.41) on: Fri Apr 30 02:59:08 EDT 2004
  
  IR copied from Gladiator...? BIG SHOCK !!!
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 129.188.33.221) on: Fri Apr 30 02:59:49 EDT 2004
  
  MADDY, this is no thread for ur pro-ARR anti-IR bashings. Find some ohter thread to infest. Sorry for the choice of words, but this is a good thread after a long tinme. You are most welcome to post your views, but please stop such crappy postings. For GOd's sake!
  
  Music_Lover and Osho, what can you say about the album 'Anjali' by IR? I personally feel that it is one of his best albums all time. The images and the moods the songs induce are awesome. Just for example, see9or rather hear!) the fantastic instumentation in the 'Vegam vegam' song. The violin usage is mid boggling. Are there any 'matching' films/tracks in Hollywood? And I think ManiRatnam gave us fantastic visuals to remember the songs by. Enna solreenga?
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Fri Apr 30 03:42:36 EDT 2004
  
  Raja, i didnt say that the BGM was copied. I was saying about the visuals. Apologies if that wasnt clear.
  Srivatsan, thats a terrific pointer. Nostalgia comes flooding when i think about the "Vegam Vegam" song. Just listen to the humming by the chorus to induce a feeling of awe when the childrens see the universe with its myriad colours. A 'la E.T picturization but this time with haunting score. Is he a genius?. Perhaps the most underrated Musical phenomenon in india. Too bad for holly wood they missed him.
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 129.188.33.221) on: Fri Apr 30 04:38:47 EDT 2004
  
  Humming is a technique that is put to great use by the Mestro. I can recollect many songs with haunting humming. Both 'Anjali Anjali' and 'vaanam namakku veedhi' songs from film Anjali have sublte, yet fantastic humming chorus. Same is the case with the ' baababba babbaree' hummin in the 'Pudhu maappillaikku' song from aboorva sagodharargal. Another haunting piece is the 3 counterpoint humming in the song 'Poonthalir aada' from panneer pushpangal.
  
  
• From: MADDY (@ 203.94.233.48) on: Fri Apr 30 11:01:48 EDT 2004
  
  see guys, i love IR's songs, so that's y silently read all the comments on IR's songs and BGMs by u guys.....but when someone is trying to tell that IR is gr8er than ARR then i cant stand it......leave ARR and discuss abt ur idol....actually the "shut up" was meant for RS.......actually i'm learning a lot of things from ur posts guys....so pls. let this ARR fan read ur thread atleast
  
  
• From: Music_lover (@ 202.141.98.226) on: Fri Apr 30 11:09:43 EDT 2004
  
  If you get a chance, please listen to "Canon in D" by Pachebel - IR can easily come up with such complicated and yet easily accessible themes - there is one such theme in the title score of a junk movie by the name "Enga Thambi" - can anyone listen to it and give an analysis ?
  
  

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