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The most scathing IR criticism ever, probably!

Topic started by cyk (@ 216.65.106.130) on Sun Sep 3 23:55:27 EDT 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I found this in the official message board of arrmp3 (geocities.com/arrmp3) run by Karthik, by someone called Pennathur. The write-up is probably the most scathing criticism I've ever come across of IR!!

cyk


Sites like aaraamthinai and indiainfo seem to be publishing motivated stuff about rahman.

let's face it folks there are still some people who can't accept the fact that Ilayaraja is no longer the Raja he was. It is not just that he has retired from the scene or something Rahman has ushered in a new order of things and has come out on top in a more comptetitve market. These controversies also have regional element to them. And please believe me I am not being parochial. Rahman's music is urban and specifically rooted in his favourite city (mine too) MAdras. Ilayaraja is a reluctant resident of Madras and for the talent that comes out of Cumbum, Madurai, Thenee he is the supremo. The composers and musicians in his - Raja's - camp (all incredibly talented) who work on TV serials and small clips for the movies will never accept that Ilayaraja's time is up. And they have been naysayers for a long time. For some time Ilayaraja tried propping up his sons Kartik and Yuvan Shankar, who unfortunately aren't even a glimmer in comparison to their illustrious father. And Kartik the upstart and braggart needlessly muddied himself badmouthing Rahman. Today neither of the boys are anywhere on the scene.

The comparisons that some people wouldn't like to make are as follows:

Ilayaraja was a swollen headed man - how many of you know that the title Isaignani was self-anointed?
While Rahman continues to remain a humble person and makes no great claims for himself except that he slogs his whatever off for each and every song

Ilayaraja was virtually hostile towards the press and never deigned to grant interviews or enven show himself in public. Rahman is approachable and fields soem fairly sensitive questions

Ilayaraja is but one in a long line of film composers in the many languages of India. But have you ever heard him acknowledging his own guru - GK Venkatesh - or MSV or anyone else? Rahman n the other hand is profuse in his praise for other composers and even acknowledges the genius of Ilayaraja

Rahman was the guy who taught Ilayaraja to use multi-track recording and remastering with Punnagai Mannan - and it is an open secret in Kodambakkam that at least two songs in the movie were composed by Rahman - and that's how KB caught hold of Rahman for Roja (remember KB produced the film) Raja has never acknolwedged tha man by now

Rahman continues to be a gracious man and participates in free events every now and then. While he may not be like the great MSV (who took care of SM Subbiah Naidu till his last days, performed free with his harmonium for some plantation workmen in Sri Lanka, who can even today be seen taking a walk down Santhome High Road in the evenings chatting up with the local potti kadai guys, or having a stroll by the beach) he is approachable. We do know that Raja came from very humble origins but how much does he mix around or remain rooted with people in everyday life?

In an interview on TV some years back someone asked MSV has Ilayaraja set you aside and has Rahman set aside Raja. To which the inimitable MSV replied, "No one sets aside anyone else. One: the listeners decide these matters as we just exist to satisfy their musical needs and two: only God can set people aside" Isn't it interesting that most Rahman fans are fans of MSV too? It is indeed a coup that Rahman got MSV to sing on "Sangamam"? With Rahman we are seeing the return of those balladish robust strains we would hear in every MSV solo.

And one more thing Rahman steers clear of something that Raja loved to do - interfere with the movie script and its direction etc. And that's what led to his downfall and parting of ways with his close friend Bharatiraja. The slide for Raja began with "Captain Magal" when Bharatiraja threw Raja off the sets for monkeying around. After which BR erased all the background score and the two songs already composed and called Hamsalekha to score the movie.

Fame is a very fickle thing. You don't know when it will part from you. MSV never let fame go to his head and has retired gracefully. While Ilayaraja just cannot, having lorded over the scene like a banyan tree (nothing grows underneath a banyan)

The story of Ilayaraja is a lesson to all of us.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: RAAJ (@ 213.59.204.2) on: Sat May 26 13:44:22 EDT 2001
  
  DEAR CYK,,,,LET ME REMIND YOU OF WHAT HAPPENED IN A ILAIYARAAJA"S BIRTHDAY PARTY MANY YEARS AGO,,THE EVENT IS,,,WHEN ALL THE GUESTS HAVE ARRIVED FOR THE BIRTHDAY PARTY,STILL IR DIDN'T WANT TO START THE FUNCTION,EVERYBODY WERE CURIOUS OF WHY IR IS POSTPONING,,AND IT WAS OBVIOUS THAT HE WAS WAITING FOR SOMEONE"S ARRIVAL,,AND FINALLY WHEN HE SAW MSV WAS COMING,,AND WHEN MSV WAS STEPPING INSIDE THE HALL,,IR,,THE GREAT MAESTRO ,,,FELL ON HIS FEETS TO GET HIS BLESSING,,AND THAT HAPPENED IN FRONT OF THE HUGE CROWD,,,YOU TELL ME IS THIS WHAT YOU CALL AS ARROGANCE OR DEVOTION,,,,REMMMEMBER THIIIIS ARR FOR ARROGANCE,,,,,,,DONT SIMPLY THROW WITHOUT PROOOFES,,,,,YOU CANNOT GET ANYWHERE WITH YOU NARROOWMINDEDNESS,,IMPROVE YOUR SELF BRO,,,BYE
  
  
• From: RAAJ (@ 213.59.204.2) on: Sat May 26 13:44:41 EDT 2001
  
  DEAR CYK,,,,LET ME REMIND YOU OF WHAT HAPPENED IN A ILAIYARAAJA"S BIRTHDAY PARTY MANY YEARS AGO,,THE EVENT IS,,,WHEN ALL THE GUESTS HAVE ARRIVED FOR THE BIRTHDAY PARTY,STILL IR DIDN'T WANT TO START THE FUNCTION,EVERYBODY WERE CURIOUS OF WHY IR IS POSTPONING,,AND IT WAS OBVIOUS THAT HE WAS WAITING FOR SOMEONE"S ARRIVAL,,AND FINALLY WHEN HE SAW MSV WAS COMING,,AND WHEN MSV WAS STEPPING INSIDE THE HALL,,IR,,THE GREAT MAESTRO ,,,FELL ON HIS FEETS TO GET HIS BLESSING,,AND THAT HAPPENED IN FRONT OF THE HUGE CROWD,,,YOU TELL ME IS THIS WHAT YOU CALL AS ARROGANCE OR DEVOTION,,,,REMMMEMBER THIIIIS ARR means FOR ARROGANCE,,,,,,,DONT SIMPLY THROW WITHOUT PROOOFES,,,,,YOU CANNOT GET ANYWHERE WITH YOU NARROOWMINDEDNESS,,IMPROVE YOUR SELF BRO,,,BYE
  
  
• From: Folk vs. pretenders (@ 166.90.85.43) on: Sat May 26 14:35:17 EDT 2001
  
  cyk, pure crap. arr does not acknowledge anyone' talent and has plenty of time to schmooze other people. Raja was helping so many people make films and succeed in life. We were all folk people once
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Fri Jun 1 18:06:39 EDT 2001
  
  I Agree with this point.. I think its true
  
  //"Ilayaraja was virtually hostile towards the press and never deigned to grant interviews or enven show himself in public. Rahman is approachable and fields soem fairly sensitive questions "//
  
  I know this one is a fart. its untrue. If it was so true then why didnt KB choose ARR for "vaname ellai" or atleast "annamalai". PCSriram was instrumental in bringin out ARR to Mani and KB.so the following is a fart..
  
  //"Rahman was the guy who taught Ilayaraja to use multi-track recording and remastering with Punnagai Mannan - and it is an open secret in Kodambakkam that at least two songs in the movie were composed by Rahman - and that's how KB caught hold of Rahman for Roja (remember KB produced the film) Raja has never acknolwedged tha man by now "//
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Saravanan (@ 64.220.209.210) on: Fri Jun 1 21:31:31 EDT 2001
  
  I hate these kinds of personal comments. Then there's a lot to comment about ARR!! It's all rubbish! To me, pennathur is the most stupidest of stupid in this world and he's an IDIOT, i have never come across...
  I spontaneously remember PODA PODA PUNNAAKKU song, i dont know why?!
  
  
• From: ^ (@ 64.104.128.15) on: Sat Jun 2 07:03:33 EDT 2001
  
  that pennathur is a MFSOB!!
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Mon Jun 4 12:37:50 EDT 2001
  
  All Non-Pannathurs,
  
  u know what! u all may have a point. But all of you , to put it simply FAILED. You turned out to be less of a MAN than "pennathur".
  
  I may not agree with what pennathur says. But atleast I was attacking his logic and not him.
  
  Please argue on the "comment" and not on the commentator. Yor psucho-analysis of the person "pennathur" is unwanted and unwarranted.
  
  you can only disagree with his logic and comments. If you attack him personally. You have just signed and confessed your defeat. Because when u have no logic to argue, only then, do u involve yourself in a slanging match.
  
  Till, Now "pennathur" has beaten everyone else by a miles. purely because he stuck only to his logic and did not slander any individual.
  
  
  
• From: Common Friend (@ 203.197.141.183) on: Tue Jun 5 04:59:26 EDT 2001
  
  excellent bharath
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.134) on: Tue Jun 5 06:41:09 EDT 2001
  
  Bharath,
  
  Please argue on the "comment".
  
  Won't it then become a personal attack or argue on a person??
  
  ;-)
  
  
• From: Vijay (@ 194.200.27.253) on: Tue Jun 5 07:16:27 EDT 2001
  
  Hmm... a thread on Ilayaraja vs A R Rahman... no, an Ilayaraja fans vs A R Rahman fans turns into a debate on how to argue... interesting twist... Bharath, what "logic" has Pennathur used in his posting? It's almost totally untrue except for the line on Ilayaraja's reluctance to talk to the press.
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue Jun 5 11:52:15 EDT 2001
  
  vijay,
  
  yes u r right.... i simply dont see the reason why people dont point out that pennathurs critisim abt IR is untrue baseless and unsubstantiated.... rather they comment that he is a stupid... and that his mother is'nt virtuous and that he is hitlers right-hand etc... these are totally irrelevant to the topic under discussion.
  
  He has only made his views and opinion public and open to debate not himself as a person...
  
  
  "quite Illogical " - Spock. StarTrek
  
  
• From: xyz (@ ) on: Wed Jun 13 01:10:30 EDT 2001
  
  guys, it is wrong to go on anyones personal life like this,please
  
  
• From: VJ (@ 194.196.110.11) on: Mon Jun 18 08:34:53 EDT 2001
  
  Rahman is afraid of making comments on IR cause he is not sure of himself.It takes long time to reach that stage.
  
  
• From: LV (@ 203.197.82.156) on: Mon Jun 18 11:07:04 EDT 2001
  
  dear VJ:
  
  I do NOT support the dirty remarks made on IRs personal life made by the person who started this thread. Moreover they are factually wrong. HOWEVER:
  ARR is a humble person. He is too deeply involved in the fantastic music he is creating today, too make cheap comments on anybody. Moreover, he has always acknowledged IRs genius.
  
  
• From: Athi (@ 24.182.219.105) on: Mon Jun 18 23:19:55 EDT 2001
  
  Admin,
  
  This thread deserves to be closed. People are
  already criticizing IR in all the other threads
  in all possible ways.
  
  I observed many threads criticizing ARR have been closed. Please do the same for this thread
  also.
  
  Athi
  
  

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