Home   Forum   Wiki   Notes   Register   FAQ   Sitemap   About Us   Contact Us  

Musical Merits &Demerits of IR and ARR [Only for fans, not fanatics!]

Topic started by V (@ 147.129.99.180) on Thu Jul 17 16:26:37 EDT 2003.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

To bring our healthy/unhealthy discussion on music merits and demeits of IRR and ARR out of the Thangar Bacchaan thread I starting this thread so that it would be more appropriate.

I expect people who post here to be fans and not typical fanatics. Expecially the young ARR fans and the "Theevira" Raja fans

Thanks!

---

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: MusicIsLife (@ 170.146.91.6) on: Tue Jul 22 18:29:09 EDT 2003
  
  V,
  I dont agree to the fact that all other MD'S you have mentioned adopt ARR style, HJ for sure yes, YSR: do you really think that way
  Ramesh Vinayakam is this guy who did nala damayanthi, i like the songs, it was good. VS following ARR style? the songs i heard from RUN, OR PARTHIBAN KANAVU dont have any shade of ARR...
  I might be wrong, but can you explain?
  
  
• From: Jag (@ 35.9.26.160) on: Tue Jul 22 18:45:30 EDT 2003
  
  MusicIsLife,
  You are right there. VS doesn't follow ARR's style. I think he is pretty talented and quite underrated and should be up there with ARR in popularity. 
  
  
  
• From: V (@ 141.149.235.21) on: Tue Jul 22 19:30:29 EDT 2003
  
  xml
  
  can you be less cynical when you make a comment?
  
  Please! I am not interested in replying to toungue-in-the-cheek remarks anymore!
  
  Jag and MusicIsLife,
  
  VS sure has ARR's style. Very much in his use of chords and also his background music. YSR, obviously he has admitted that he is a fan of ARR and he gives music for youth!
  
  I am not saying these people copy! I am just saying that they give music close to what ARR usually gives. ARR is now forced to distinguish himself in all this competition and he has grandly faltered I agree!
  
  But we should just wait for his Hindi classica like Thezeeb, Samjhauta Express and hear his score there.
  
  
• From: rajasaranam (@ 210.214.132.8) on: Tue Jul 22 20:24:14 EDT 2003
  
  V,
  
  my thought over this is. there r two distinct styles being adopted by all the other MDs uve mentioned. one is IRs and other is ARRs [ ive got a difference of opinion here can we really say this as ARRs style cos he is inspired by western pop style of composition ]. the MDs including HJ [ listen to his latest hit saamy - sure IR shade - thiruchi malai kottaida reminds me of singari sarakku] adopts either style as required by the theme/plot/subject of the movie.
  
  
• From: xml (@ 128.148.68.110) on: Tue Jul 22 20:35:34 EDT 2003
  
  V
  you started with
  "Musical Merits &Demerits of IR and ARR [Only for fans, not fanatics!]".
  
  But the thread is getting more important more YSR,VS,HJ.
  
  It clearly shows that ARR overtaken by them.OK.
  
  
• From: xml (@ 128.148.68.110) on: Tue Jul 22 20:37:34 EDT 2003
  
  I mean nobody is bothered about ARR in this thread. The same situation in TN. OK.
  
  
• From: (@ 128.148.68.110) on: Tue Jul 22 20:43:07 EDT 2003
  
  http://www.cinesouth.com/sm/index.shtml
  
  
• From: V (@ 141.149.235.21) on: Tue Jul 22 22:04:04 EDT 2003
  
  rajasaranam
  
  Agreed with you.
  
  the only reason I like Saamy is becos it is not usual HJ style and IR style of music. Thats what I want to see from him
  
  
• From: V (@ 141.149.235.21) on: Tue Jul 22 22:07:57 EDT 2003
  
  xml
  
  I have already told you its not worth answering you!
  
  btw guys,
  
  do u guys think there will be a newer trend in TFM?
  
  Yuvan shankar raja says there wont be another trend at all! I kind of agree with this. I hope all MDs build on their existing strengths and make good music acc to their strengths!
  
  I am waiting to hear Sandiyar and VS's Thendral. The Mani Ratnam movie probably wont have any music.
  
  
• From: xml (@ 128.148.68.110) on: Tue Jul 22 22:09:58 EDT 2003
  
  V
  Look at the top
  
  "Musical Merits &Demerits of IR and ARR [Only for fans, not fanatics!]".
  
  My suggestion open another thread
  
  "Saamy is great becos it is not usual HJ style and IR style of music"
  
  
• From: V (@ 141.149.235.21) on: Tue Jul 22 23:31:31 EDT 2003
  
  to clarify that statement xml (which is wrong grammer and sentence formation on my part):
  
  Here I explain again,
  I like Saamy becos it is in IR style. I was thinking HJ was doing same kind of music imitating ARR then he came out with Saamy which was more IR-ish.
  
  I said that becos rajasaranam said so and I agreed to it.
  
  Now that you have expressed so much of a disciplines attitude to keep with the thread's topic, let us see how your future posts come out! Guys I need you all to watch out for that!
  
  
• From: Jag (@ 35.11.98.63) on: Wed Jul 23 00:18:14 EDT 2003
  
  V
  I have probably followed VS's style more than you. It has not changed over time. Having vocal harmonies in new age style or western type strings is not ARR's invention in FM, neither was he the first to use it in movies. There is a telugu MD called Sri who had this style (and talent to give original hits during IR's peak reign) and it's our biggest misfortune that he is waiting for chances like Mahesh did. Don't confuse the usage of recording technology with style, they are totally different aspects. I reassert VS has a unique style and the only person he had aped in the beginning was IR (much before ARR's entry), before he moved to malayalam.
  VS's tunes have a really good carnatic base and they don't really deviate much from the base raagam, like some ARR's experimental tunes do. (eg. strawberry kanne, snegidhane).
  
  
• From: V (@ 141.149.235.21) on: Wed Jul 23 01:53:36 EDT 2003
  
  Jag
  
  I aprreciate your email.
  
  Maybe it is just the timing. I seriosuly do not find VS any different from ARR's kind of music. Atleast the feel of it.
  
  I must say that being a VS fan, He should be more consistent! He gives one hit, 2 flops (sshit like anbu etc.). very inconsistent
  
  You guys shud hear the BGM of Kaarmegham... amazing BGM in the first part. like vintage ARR style.
  
  by the way, i forgot to point out ARR's biggest hindrance now. ALL the kathukuttis like Pravin Mani shud not be allowed to tamper with any of his songs!
  
  He shud be told that!
  
  
• From: Vatsa (@ 160.83.32.14) on: Wed Jul 23 06:52:54 EDT 2003
  
  V,
  
  You maybe right. I feel ARR is doing alot of music now (atleast not alot in tamil but in Hindi, not his strength). He is not concentrating on his strengths of improvising tunes nowadays and leave it to others. Maybe he does not personally supervise things.
  
  Of the current lot VS, HJ and YSR stand out. Though they dont give hit consistently they are good.
  
  Vatsa
  
  
• From: Kandasamy (@ 219.95.165.179) on: Wed Jul 23 08:02:17 EDT 2003
  
  Actually Samy by HJ is influenced by ARR.
  
  
• From: rajasaranam (@ 210.214.132.238) on: Wed Jul 23 17:10:05 EDT 2003
  
  V,
  i wanted to clarify this before itself but i forgot then, hence iam asking u a question on ur previous post.
  by ur statement that all MDS r adopting ARRs style hence ARRs music doesnt stand out. probably u r wishing to point out thats y ARRs music didnt appeal for past few yrs.
  during IRs peak time all MDs adopted his style and churning out music exactly same as IR. even now ill not be able to find out the difference of many movies. for many years i was thinking vedam puthidhu was IRs music. only a few days back i came to know the MD of Parthibans Pudhiya Paadhai was CB.[ iwas thinking that was IR movie only bcos of the song amma yaaru appa yaaru].
  having said this i want to point out that, even at those times IR was still delivering & giving appealing music and was the no.1 MD.
  why isnt that possible by ARR?????
  
  
• From: rajasaranam (@ 210.214.132.238) on: Wed Jul 23 17:28:13 EDT 2003
  
  V,
  i wanted to clarify this before itself but i forgot so iam asking u a question on ur previous post.
  by ur state ment that all MDS r adopting ARRs style hence ARRs music doesnt stand out. probably u r wishing to point out thats y ARRs music didnt appeal for past few yrs.
  during IRs peak time all MDs adopted his style and churning out music exactly same as IR. even now ill not be able to find out the difference of many movies. for many years i was thinking vedam puthidhu was IRs music. only a few days back i came to know the MD of Parthibans Pudhiya Paadhai was CB.[ iwas thinking that was IR movie only bcos of the song amma yaaru appa yaaru].
  having said this i want to point out that, even at those times IR was still delivering & giving appealing music and was the no.1 MD .
  why isnt that possible by ARR?????
  
  
• From: Jag (@ 35.9.26.160) on: Wed Jul 23 19:34:39 EDT 2003
  
  rajasaranam,
  You have come upon a very delicate point which highlights Raaja's music. VS used a lot Rajaish melodies and instruments like trumpet, horn etc to create an illusion of a Raaja song. But the single most important reason no one was able to ape Raaja's music successfully was the quality of the tunes itself. Raaja's music consists of layers of orchestrization (counterpoints, harmonies what not). This kind of orchestrization is quite out of the reach of an average MD or even a good MD who think linearly. If someone attempts layering without noticing its effects on the other layers or on the song itself, it results in a ineffective layering. Raaja seamlessly wove carnatic based tunes in and out of western orchestrization without even hinting to the listener of the transition. Whatever he does is way beyond anyone in film music and hence during his peak he could still hold sway completely.
  
  ARR on the other hand does not rely on layering as much as he does on new sounds and rythmic loops. As someone pointed out much earlier that he is a talented MD who can improvise much better than an average MD. When you base your music on improvisation, it is no big secret that others can work hard and get that kind of improvisation. And hence ARR's music got stale within 5-6 years of his entry. Once in a while he does come up with good music but he already has lost market. Sound technology lasts only as long. Stereo sounds was introduced by Raaja and new age sounds by ARR.
  But they become common since everyone starts using them.
  
  But even without these reasons it is really difficult to capture market for very long.
  Eg. MSV/TKR 15years and some of it was dominated by other greats during that time, but people did not go to movies for their music even though it was great
  
  IR- 17 years (1976-1993) I discounted 1994 even though he had megahits that year.
  
  ARR I think 7 years. 1993-2000, but realistically speaking, somewhere in 1997 he lost his ability to draw crowds to the theatre with his music.
  
  
• From: Jag (@ 35.9.26.160) on: Wed Jul 23 19:36:29 EDT 2003
  
  Just wanted to add that I did not mean to offend anyone with my previous posting.
  
  

---

List all pages of this thread

Post comments