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Raga of song please

Topic started by Gopal Prasad (@ greed.cs.umass.edu) on Sat May 17 07:42:45 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

The popular notation used on this page. The twelve notes of an octave are the following.

1   2   3   4   5   6   7  8   9  10  11  12
S  R1  R2  R3  G3  M1  M2  P  D1  D2  D3  N3
       G1  G2                     N1  N2

"Raga based film songs" Database | Old Database | Indian Classical Music Forum | Hindi Raaga of Songs Thread

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: hihi:-) (@ 128.111.113.76) on: Tue Jan 22 17:56:30 EST 2002
  
  srikanth: good posting; needs to be a little bit more clear; will write if i get time. please continue.
  
  ir: do chAppu-s really exist?
  
  
• From: Sindhuja (@ 203.197.181.220) on: Tue Jan 22 21:29:53 EST 2002
  
  IR,I know the song is vague!,but it does clearly show M2 and N2.
  
  
• From: ashok (@ 203.197.138.34) on: Tue Jan 22 23:37:33 EST 2002
  
  vijay/IR,
  i would like to join the thread. i am also interested in finding out ragas for cine songs. i have good database with me ( not in soft form). especially, i am severe charukesi raga fan; this song (nalladhor veenai from marupadiyum) was told by many of friends as ahirbhairav; but i don't know it gives me the feeling of charukesi, though the swaras ri & dha are different. please explain
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 164.164.142.12) on: Wed Jan 23 03:38:40 EST 2002
  
  Thanks IR. i really dont know why does it sound similar. Bole re papihara is miyan ki malhar and chaliye kunjanumo tum is vrindavana saranga. there is a line suniye koyal ki kuhu..in tht song where it sounds similar. my friend only noticed it first.
  
  i am really sorry, i dont have the links.i have botht the songs in a tape with me.
  
  any other opinions ?
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.126) on: Wed Jan 23 06:10:04 EST 2002
  
  what opinions can we give if u have them only on tape? ;-)
  
  
• From: IR (@ 4.62.117.121) on: Wed Jan 23 08:19:22 EST 2002
  
  Raghu, you may be right... My posting was based on a miyan ki malhar piece by Chaurasia, which I heard a longgggggggggg time back... I do not have a clear picture of this raga in my mind... let me listen to some pieces in this raga today and see what the similarities are between miyan ki malhar and Brindavana saranga....
  
  
• From: IR (@ 38.220.167.236) on: Wed Jan 23 14:12:25 EST 2002
  
  ashok - welcome to the ROS thread... :-)
  
  vijay, ashok - I tend to think it is Charukesi based too - (depends on where you place the Sa again!) Nal la dhor - Pa Ga3 ri2ga3 is what I assumed!
  
  hihi:-) is that a trick question? ungaLukku theriyaadhadha - Chaapus do exist and are very much in vogue - enna appadi kettupputteenga :)
  
  
• From: IR (@ 38.220.167.236) on: Wed Jan 23 14:17:31 EST 2002
  
  Sindhuja :-) I agree...
  
  here are some KeeravaNi notes I could decode :-)
  
  Sun Dha Ri - Dha1 Pa Ma1
  Si ri ya Re ttai vAl - Pa Dha1 Ni3 Sa Ri2 Ni3
  
  
• From: hihi:-) (@ 128.111.113.76) on: Wed Jan 23 14:40:46 EST 2002
  
  IR: no; it is not a trick question. can you please give a detailed description of chAppu-s. i have heard from very knowledgeable people that ist's "just" another nomenclature and nothing more. i will try to dig out from my old files what they had to say. in the meanwhile can you please elaborate? thanks.
  
  
• From: IR (@ 38.220.167.236) on: Wed Jan 23 14:44:37 EST 2002
  
  sriks - would 3/4 be something similar to "thisram" in carnatic music? in other words would a 3/4 beat be called "thisra ekam" in carnatic music - where the total cycle has 4 beats and each beat is a thisram
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ ) on: Wed Jan 23 23:18:03 EST 2002
  
  In 3/4 the number "4" has got nothing to do with the cycle. It means there are 3 count of 1/4 notes. Upper number denotes the cycle.
  3/4 is rupakam, which is waltz.
  (we count 123|123|123) , (each bar count is 3)
  
  now coming to 6/8 this has got 6 counts of 8th notes (which can be also 12/4 - 12 counts of 1/4 notes.)
  we count 123456|123456|123456|123456|
  
  like wise , 5/8 - 5 counts of 8th notes, this is by far the most interesting timing.
  this goes 12345 12345 12345 (it can be also 9/4 meaning 9 1/4 notes in a bar)
  
  I have provided a sample from one of my composition as a demo, this is raw track set to 6/8. Hope this helps people to understand.
  count : 123456|123456|123456
  
  http://www.srikanthd.com/media/cut.mp3
  
  If this is still not clear, as mentioned above by arul he can come forward to explain it if he has time.
  
  
• From: Prabhu (@ 202.88.152.159) on: Thu Jan 24 02:39:54 EST 2002
  
  Attn IR :
  
  what is the raga of the song 'Rakkoli rendum mulichirukku rendum thoongama vizhichirukku' (sorry i dont know film name...MD :AR Rahman)?? sung by Yesudas and swarnalatha ...
  I feel it belongs to Natai family...
  could u please clarify my doubt ...
  
  
• From: Gayathri (@ 64.26.198.30) on: Thu Jan 24 02:55:11 EST 2002
  
  "Raakozhi Rendu"is set to Dharmavathi.
  
  
• From: Gayathri (@ 64.26.198.30) on: Thu Jan 24 02:56:09 EST 2002
  
  Is the song Gadothgaja in Pammal K Sammandham set to Charukesi?
  
  
• From: IR (@ 4.62.117.121) on: Thu Jan 24 08:34:35 EST 2002
  
  hihi :-) my 2 cents worth... yes and no... well it is just another 'kind' of tala that does not fit into the rules and grammar of the Sapta Tala, which I listed earlier. Usually it is considered challenging to sing in any beat other than "Chathusra nadai/jaati" (Eg. Adi, ekam, roopakam). It is very easy to compose/sing in, say, a common Aadi thalam or a roopaka thaalam.(I do not want to use Western music jargons as am still trying to understand them!). But a thisra/kanta/mishra nadais/varieties are comparitively difficult to sing and usually students of carnatic music are not taught songs in these talas until they reach a particular level of proficiency in their laya/rhythm!
  
  Chapu tala is considered challenging as the 2 most popular kind of Chapu talas are the Kanta and mishra varieties. But once you start singing/performing a lot in these talas, you would definitely feel that they are "just another nomenclature and nothing more"
  
  Mishra Chapu is more popular and consists of 2 beats - the first beat has a duration of 3 units and the second has 4 units. The second beat is also commonly split into 2 beats of 2 units each. This totals to 7 which is the "meter" for a mishra chapu tala. (3+4)
  
  Similarly, a kanda chapu tala has 2 beats, the first beat would be for a duration of 2 units and the second 3, totalling up to 5. (2+3)
  
  Let me know if you want me to elaborate/clarify anything... This is from my understanding of the talas...
  
  I think we scared the ROS thread makkaLs with this tala talk :-) IR Fan enga poneenga :-)
  
  sriks: indha pedhayin sandegaththai theerthu vaingo :-)
  
  "3/4 is rupakam, which is waltz.
  (we count 123|123|123) , (each bar count is 3) "
  
  Rupaka talam = 1234|1234|1234
  Eka Talam = 1234|1234|1234|1234
  Adi Talam = 1234|1234|1234|1234|1234|1234|1234|1234
  
  But, from your example it looks like a 3 bar count - a three bar count would make it thisram and not chathusram illayo??? A 123|123|123 beat cycle would be roopaka thalam, thisra nadai - not the common roopaka talam (with a duration of 4 units) - please explainnnnnnnnnnnnnn. COuld you take the example of a common carnatic song like Sobhillu or Sabaapathikku - set in Roopaka thalam and explain so I understand better :-) romba torture paNren nna vittudungo :-) badhil sonna one kamarkattu parisu :-)
  
  Prabhu and Gayatri, would find out tomorrow - cant listen from home :(
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 164.164.142.12) on: Thu Jan 24 09:16:43 EST 2002
  
  IR waiting for ur opinion!!
  Thanks in advance.
  
  Kupps - en doubt patta pathinathu alla. ragangalai pathinathu.;-)..
  
  Swati tirunal keerthanam romba common.sudha raghunathan cassette, sanjay subramaniam cassette kooda irukku.Bom Jay'sree kooda padiyirukkaa.
  Guddi film song net le oru search potta kidaithu vidum!! ;-)...
  
  
• From: IR (@ 4.62.117.121) on: Thu Jan 24 09:33:17 EST 2002
  
  Raghu - sorry meant to post this earlier - somehow I forgot - Chaliye song is a very popular one - but I also listened to the Guddi song in MIO yesterday. You are right it does sound a lot like Brin S ... it seems to be a combo of Brindavana Saranga and Kaanada -beautiful raaga indeed... I think they are all offshoots of Karaharapriya and hence the common notes and kind of similar feel... I noticed a lot of "Ma1 Pa Ni2 Dha2 Ni3 Sa" phrases in Miyan ki Malhaar. The avarohana phrases in that song resembled kaanada too (Ma1 Pa Ga2 Ma1 Ri2 Sa phrases)... All three ragas seem to be very close to one another and especially Brindavana Saranga and MKM seem to have a lot in common because of Ni3 in aaro and Ni2 in avaro.. This is just my opinion ... I may be totally wrong!
  
  
  
• From: check (@ 216.65.106.130) on: Thu Jan 24 09:39:14 EST 2002
  
  Check
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ 216.65.106.130) on: Thu Jan 24 09:49:59 EST 2002
  
  Ir ,
  First of all, I am sorry I crossed my own ground rule, I dont like to map western with carnatic, an eye to eye.
  3/4 is waltz to me. and I gave a light classical song of Maharajapuram as example. Rupkam or not I am not clear, basically here we have 3 - 1/4 notes per cycle. (123|123|123|) (or 2.1|2.1| (2= 8th note and 1=1/4 note which is also = 3 notes)) I should have added "might be" Rupakam :) anyway the point is I am no expert in carnatic (infact even western classical), I dont think so I can help with carnatic songs, however I can point you to some famous western classical song in 3/4.
  You can make the decision whether 3/4 is rupkam or not. :)
  happa IR kita irundhu thapichachu..:):)
  
  
• From: IR (@ 4.62.117.121) on: Thu Jan 24 09:59:03 EST 2002
  
  sriks :-) sema killadi pongo :-) Therinjukkalam/purinjukkalam nnu keLvi kEtta ippadi orediya kavukkareLe :-)
  
  give me some film songs in 3/4 - it might be easier for me to understand - indha maharajapuram song a enga poi theduven - is it available on the net?:) give me some examples that are easily available in dhool or MIO and I would listen to them tomorrow :-)
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 208.61.227.242) on: Thu Jan 24 11:47:21 EST 2002
  
  IR, "ore naal unnai naan" from Ilamai oonjalaadugirathu is an example of waltz..I think you would heard this song..
  
  

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