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Which of the Tamil dialects is the best?

Topic started by Tamil Kavi (@ gwnj.utstar.com) on Thu Oct 28 17:56:54 EDT 1999.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Could we discuss in this forum which of the tamil dialects is the best?

Sangam Val'artha Madurai Tamizha? illai
Sadugudu Chennai Tamila?
Ennala Eppadi enum thiru nellaiya
Enunga eppadi vanga Kovai Tamizha?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Pala (@ mel-0311-140.ports.iprimus.com.au) on: Sat Nov 6 19:25:39 EST 1999
  
  Eden
  
  In line with your comparison,Tamizh would be a dialect of Asian Language.English originated from the UK not from Europe-as Tamizh from India(Madras then and Tamil Nadu now).
  
  As you have mentioned NO one can question the uniqueness and richness of Tamizh with Uyir Ezhuthu,Mei Ezhuthu and Uyir-Mei ezhuthu with Vallinam,Mellinam and Idiyinam, although it has undergone some changes in the written aspect of the alphabets.
  
  Lets see if we can agree that every Nation(country) has a National Language.Then, what is the National Language of India?
  We can cotinue this discussion when you've answered the above question.
  
  "HAPPY DEEPAVLI(EVEN THIS HAS CHANGED FROM DEEBA OLI) GREETING TO ALL"
  
  
• From: Pala (@ mel-0210-106.ports.iprimus.com.au) on: Sat Nov 6 19:28:06 EST 1999
  
  Eden
  
  In line with your comparison,Tamizh would be a dialect of Asian Language.English originated from the UK not from Europe-as Tamizh from India(Madras then and Tamil Nadu now).
  
  As you have mentioned NO one can question the uniqueness and richness of Tamizh with Uyir Ezhuthu,Mei Ezhuthu and Uyir-Mei ezhuthu with Vallinam,Mellinam and Idiyinam, although it has undergone some changes in the written aspect of the alphabets.
  
  Lets see if we can agree that every Nation(country) has a National Language.Then, what is the National Language of India?
  We can cotinue this discussion when you've answered the above question.
  
  "HAPPY DEEPAVALI(EVEN THIS HAS CHANGED FROM DEEBA OLI) GREETINGS TO ALL"
  
  
• From: kooththan (@ on-tor-blr-a52-04-38.idirect.com) on: Sun Nov 7 23:52:14 EST 1999
  
  Eden,
  
  Don't waste your breath with Pala.
  
  Pala,
  
  Go find yourself a dictionary see what 'dialect' means.
  
  English and many other 'European' languages are considered 'Romantic' languages because they have their origin in Roman which was a laterday version of Latin. HOWEVER, all these languages are NOT considered 'Dialects' of Latin or Roman.
  
  Dialect has a totally different meaning. Madras Thmizh, Kovai Thamizh, Malasia Thamizh and Eezha Thamizh are dialects of one and the same language.
  
  The INDIAN LANGUAGE you are talking of, does not exist.
  
  If not for the British Raj, the India you and I know of today would not be what it is today. India was many small nations when foreigners captured all these nations and made them into one. Though all these nations share many commonalities, they are also very different from each other. That is the beauty of India. Trying to paint India with a broad brush, like you are doing with it's languages, robs India of this essential beauty.
  
  Also, Eden is not being 'PATRIOTIC' when she/he calls a Joker and Joker. Once againg, you could use a good dictionary. Patriotism has to do with one's country and not language.
  
  It is you who I see as a misguided patriot.
  
  ....later
  
  
• From: kooththan (@ on-tor-blr-a52-04-38.idirect.com) on: Mon Nov 8 00:11:14 EST 1999
  
  Pala,
  
  I missed this gem from you. So Vaalmeehi wrote the Ramayan in Hindi did he? That sure is news to me.
  
  The common thread in all the Chinese dialects is the script. The difference is the phonetics.
  
  The national language of India is Hindi. But, that does not mean every other language in India is a dialect of that national language. Why are you hell bent on be-littling India as a country with just one language? A country like India with so many LANGUAGES, I repeat LANGUAGES, has to pick one or two to be it's official language for administrative convinience and pure economic reasons. Can you imagine having to have an interpreter for every language in the Lok Sabha or the cost of printing the gazzette in all the Indian LANGUAGES?
  
  India chose Hindi to be it's official language. But that does not mean Hindi IS the Indian language. It is one of them - the one spoken by the majority of people in India.
  
  Eden,
  
  Seems to me like you and I are trying to re-invent the wheel here. Sorry to let you stranded, but I don't think I will come back to this thread. peasaama, oru aayiram thadava Sri Rama Jeyam solrathu is a better use of my time ennu thoenuthu :-)
  
  ....later
  
  
• From: eden (@ 202.54.71.158) on: Mon Nov 8 04:13:51 EST 1999
  
  Koothan!
  Just my thoughts!
  BTW, I'm `He' and not `She':-)
  
  
• From: Jay (Jay Narayanasamy) (@ 1cust32.tnt6.bos1.da.uu.net) on: Mon Nov 8 19:25:21 EST 1999
  
  It shows our total ignorance. How can Tamil be a dialect in India and language in Malasiya? Tamil is the oldest Dravidian/Indian Language. Harappa research gives some significant proof for this. It's very well recognized and being discussed in the International grounds. Dept of Tamil is functioning in the Bay Area University too. Experts determine its age as 5000 years old. Some say 9000 years! It has its own identity, high literature potential & strong Grammar. That's the reason why it's equally competing (dominating) with other major languages and surviving still.
  
  Sanskrit is another oldest language in India. Ofcourse, Most of the Indian languages are descendent of these two. There was a mutual transfer among Tamil and Sanskrit too. Other(world) oldest languages are Heebru, Roman etc. But none of them are spoken by people now. That's the power of Tamil. Some of my Sindhi friends say that there is a close association between Sanskrit & German, Tamil & Japanese. Quite possible! Another interesting point they said that both Sindhi and Hindi had been derived from Persian language and much more influenced by Sanskrit & Urdu. Finally Mother India Speaks Persian Language? Never mind.
  
  Based on Harappa ,Thiru Iravatham Mahadevan IAS has done an excellent work on Dravidian group native Indian languages. His theory concludes that oldest Indian, Harrapan language is Tamil. This incredible work is really amazing! Please visit this web site for more info: http://www.harappa.com/script/
  
  If it is forwarded to your friends,others and whole world that at would be appreciated! .
  
  (BTW still nobody hasn’t touched the main topic. How Tamil dialect enhances TFM, I will write something when I have time )
  
  
• From: Pala (@ mel-0511-175.ports.iprimus.com.au) on: Tue Nov 9 06:40:28 EST 1999
  
  Eden
  I stand to differ from my stand and agree that Tamizh is Language not Dialect of Indian language.
  Thanx also to KOOTHTHAN and JAY for their valuable
  contributions to this subject.
  I am sorry if this discussion has caused any distress to anyone.
  I hope KOOTHTHAN will continue to visit this thread to share his knowledge.
  
  
• From: Tamil Kavi (@ gwnj.utstar.com) on: Tue Nov 9 13:19:28 EST 1999
  
  Jay,
  
  It is a good information. Now we see there is an agreement on the real facts. Some time the facts are unacceptable to many as they do not see it clearly. We need to change their glasses to see it clearly.
  
  Friends,
  can we now focus on the real topic? Each location whether it is in Tamilnadu or other countries, they do have definite influences on the song and the music.
  
  When you hear a local music from Srilanka or Malesia, the songs are different. When the words are from a dialect the taste of the music is different. Can we spot these differences? Can our Srilankan and Malesian friends throw some lights on this?
  
  
  
• From: kooththan (@ 198.73.152.100) on: Tue Nov 9 16:44:12 EST 1999
  
  Pala,
  
  That was very mature. I wish I could be like you sometimes:-)
  
  Jay,
  
  Very interesting facts. Thanks for the link as well.
  
  Eden,
  
  I just couldn't resist the temptation. Good thing I came back:-)
  
  Coming back to the initial topic,
  
  Can someone explain why the Christian hyms/songs that are in Tamil have a totally different flavour altogether as far as language is concerned? A lot of the words found in hymns are not words in common usage.
  
  ....later
  
  
• From: Jay (Jay Narayanasamy) (@ 1cust25.tnt23.bos2.da.uu.net) on: Thu Nov 11 20:15:55 EST 1999
  
  Thanx Tamil Kavi, Koothan & Pala. Let me watch some time how this topic is going on. Will catch you later !
  
  
• From: Pala (@ mel-0508-227.ports.iprimus.com.au) on: Fri Nov 12 05:41:13 EST 1999
  
  Tamil Kavi
  
  Just a note:
  
  It's MALAYSIA and MALAYSIAN not as spelt in your posting.
  
  Jay
  The link is a good one.
  
  
• From: JK (@ 1cust49.tnt5.har1.da.uu.net) on: Thu Nov 18 20:52:45 EST 1999
  
  Koothan,
  
  'Christian hyms/songs' is another major area . Why dont you write something ...
  
  
• From: Jay Narayanasamy (@ 1cust49.tnt5.har1.da.uu.net) on: Thu Nov 18 20:59:51 EST 1999
  
  Ki. Rajanarayanan has discussed in detail about Tamil dialects in his ‘karisal kattu kaduthasi’. Except chennai ,I like all dialect forms. ‘Ceylone’ tamil had mixed up in our mind through radio, now ‘Singapore’ is coming through Internet! If they write something about their tamil that would be great. I ever see the domination of ‘thanjavur and thirunelveli’ in tamil literature. Puthumai pithan has initiated the nativity/realistic writing through his stories. He has inspired almost all other writers I guess. Sundara Ramasamy feels that PP is no way inferior than any other Nobel prize winners! Vanna Nilavan, Vannadasan,Thopil muhamathu meeran are other ‘nellai’ writers .There is a big list indeed!. Thi. Janakiraman & others are ‘ thanjai’ based writers. Thanjavur is well known for its arts and music as well. Jayakandan is exceptional writer. He has handled different dialects in his stories. Tamil world will curse me if I include Kamban/Bharathi in this ‘thanjai/pandi seemai’ divison :- ).
  
  Other than this, I could say ‘ever ruling std. common dialect’ in literature & TFM is ‘Trichy’ . Our contribution is Sujatha :- )
  
  
  
  
• From: Jay Narayansamy (@ 1cust49.tnt5.har1.da.uu.net) on: Thu Nov 18 21:14:21 EST 1999
  
  (OOP’s, posting again..)
  
  Ki. Rajanarayanan has discussed in detail about Tamil dialects in his ‘karisal kattu kaduthasi’. Except chennai ,I like all dialect forms. ‘Ceylone’ tamil had mixed up in our mind through radio, now ‘Singapore’ is coming through Internet! If they write something about their tamil that would be great. I ever see the domination of ‘thanjavur and thirunelveli’ in tamil literature. Puthumai pithan has initiated the nativity/realistic writing through his stories. He has inspired almost all other writers I guess. Sundara Ramasamy feels that PP is no way inferior than any other Nobel prize winners! Vanna Nilavan, Vannadasan,Thopil muhamathu meeran are other ‘nellai’ writers .There is a big list indeed!. Thi. Janakiraman & others are ‘ thanjai’ based writers. Thanjavur is well known for its arts and music as well. Jayakandan is exceptional writer. He has handled different dialects in his stories. Tamil world will curse me if I include Kamban/Bharathi in this ‘thanjai/pandi seemai’ divison :- ).
  
  Other than this, I could say ‘ever ruling std. common dialect’ in literature & TFM is ‘Trichy’ . Our contribution is Sujatha :- )
  
  
  
• From: Jay Narayansamy (@ 1cust49.tnt5.har1.da.uu.net) on: Thu Nov 18 21:32:23 EST 1999
  
  IR &BR have brought the nativity in their movies. Since then ‘madurai, (now kovai) has been dominating TF. IR would ever be remembered for his incredible contribution to TFM. BR’s earlier movies are praised much for ‘manvasanai’. In BR-Sivaji combination ‘Muthal mariyathai’ was a big hit! Sivaji has acted almost in all characters(dialects) I think. Now Kamal is coming up. Thevarmakan, Mahanathi are good examples. ‘Kameshwaran’ is a wonderful ‘palakad’character in MMKR. There was one more character for ‘local chennai’ tamil. JK’s Unnai Pol Oruvan is an excellent art movie came with ‘chennai’ flavor.. Seemed that it was in competition with Ray that time. For a change, BR took ‘ En Uyir Thozhan’. It’s a good movie. Since it’s a political movie, he might have selected ‘madras weapon ’ I guess :- ).
  
  KB is an experimental director. Nellai picturisation was good in his ‘Achamillai Achamillai’ & Thanner Thanner(I’m not sure). In Manathil Urthi Vendum one of his characters speaks ‘karaikudi’ tamil. It’s great! I like that tamil as I like Kannadasan. In, ‘anupavi raja anupavi’ KD had written ‘muthu kullika vareekala’ song in nellai ascend. In the same movie in another song he had criticized ‘madras’ as well. He is Gem! I find more threads for him in this TFM. In PKS ,VM (muthal mariyathai)songs ,their native influence is more.
  
  And, I must say about Udirpookal. Even now I believe ‘the best’ is Udripookal. It was a good team. Mahendran,KD,IR above all that story writer… It was written by Puthumaipithan. :- )
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  

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