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Pudhumaiaana PaadaLgAL

Topic started by Gokul (@ p1.echostar.com) on Sat Mar 21 20:36:45 EST 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I am not sure if this thread has been attempted
before: If so , Ravi..Knock this off!

Many pioneers in TFM have innovated in a variety
of ways to make TFM absolutely Great.

The Keyword here is UNIQUENESS!

I would love to identify songs that are truly unique.

Uniqueness could be in

--Construct of Music (Style,Instruments etc)
--Singing
--Lyrics

As my knowledge of MDs other than IR is very limited , I request Kanchana,SK,Gopal,RajaRam,
Ramki & others to pitch in for TFM prior to IR.

My Examples for Unique Songs:

1. maNNil Indha Kaadhal - Keladi kaNmanNi
-- For SPB's Singing

2. KalaivaaNiye - Sindhu Bhairavi
-- For the musical construct

Now.. Over to you folks..

---

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Ravi (@ hope.cs.umass.edu) on: Mon Mar 23 17:17:14 EST 1998
  
  RV: I have mentioned the hindi song in my prev. posting. I think it comes during the titles or something like that. It also is the favourite song of the villain in the movie. thiruppi thiruppi sollikittE iruppaan. :).
  
  
• From: Bhaskar (@ freeway.proxy.lucent.com) on: Mon Mar 23 18:10:42 EST 1998
  
  Ravi:
  
  OTOH: appdinna ennannu enakku ippo neenga sollunga :-))))
  
  I was thinking exactly on these lines that the splitting reduces the fun, as people do not visit the old responses. Is it possible to split only after say about 30KB of information is collected or more than 20 pages worth of information.
  
  I found this problem with the JEANS thread too, people missing out queries, missing out information etc. Also splitting makes it very difficult to understand the flow of information, flow of postings etc, backing up and front is really painful. Also multiple nesting of Old Responses is more painful.
  
  My suggestion is to split after say about 30KB of information. Also if there is only one old response or max two per topic would be good, rather than having many nested Old Responses.
  
  Eventhough this approach is same as the old approach, this definitely increases the fun and people reading all the information before they post something.
  
  
• From: RV (@ nat-20.avanticorp.com) on: Mon Mar 23 18:39:14 EST 1998
  
  bs:
  I hvnt heard Poo Malaiye Thol Sera Va in a long time. From what I remember, it doesnt hv "two or more threads".
  
  Matthadu Matthadu is kinda qawali. But I would rather think that it belongs to a family fun song. ( more in the format of HAHK family song ). Kannalane is not qawali.
  
  Qawali, in general, has two teams each trying to outsing each other in a "standard" kind of tune. I am no qawali expert but can figure out what is qawali. Qawalis are definitely potti ( competition ) songs. Not all potti songs are qawalis.
  
  Ravi: I was also referring to your posting only. Thats the first time I heard about this Jadi Malli Hindi song.
  
  
• From: Gokul (@ 204.76.129.177) on: Mon Mar 23 19:39:19 EST 1998
  
  Firstly, Thanks to all for the info.
  
  Now, I am making a list from all our postings to draw a tentative list of Unique Songs. We can discuss further on this.
  ------------------------------------------------
  
  Unique Musical Construct:
  
  1.Aayiram Karangal Neeti : KarNan
  (Vedic Chant'sque)
  
  2.Maasila Nilave Nee : AmbigaPathy
  (Use of Muhari for a Romantic Song)
  
  2.Adhisaya Raagam :Apoorva raagangal
  (Rare of usage of 4 note scale for a film song)
  
  3.Paruvame : Nenjathai Killathey
  (Use of Running Feet as the Percussion Instrument & Single Tune for Pallavi & Charanam)
  
  4.En KaNmaNi : Chittukuruvi
  (Use of Counterpoint - What is this?)
  
  5.Mahaganapathim : SindhuBhairavi
  (No Percussion Instrument for a Carnatic Song)
  
  6.AahAya vennilAvE : ArangEtravELai or
  KalaivaaNiye:SindhuBhairavi
  (AaroHaNam Only)
  
  ------------------------------------------------
  
  Lyrically Unique:
  
  1.ThamThana Thamthana ThaaLam Varum : Pudhiya VaarpuGaL
  (Longest Pallavi. Longer than Vaan Engum (MooDraam Pirai) )
  
  2.Ithu Oru Pon Maalai:NizhalGaL
  (Populistic PudhuKavithaiy'in Arimugam. IMO,Also optimism in a previously untold way!
  (Very Subjective though) )
  
  3.Nivedha : Nee Padhi Naan Padhi
  (Use of Swarams ending with Nivedha being the only words!)
  
  ------------------------------------------------
  Singing:
  
  1.MaNNil Indha :KeLaDi KaNmaNi
  (SPB's Non-Stop Stanzas)
  
  ------------------------------------------------
  
  To Verify> :
  
  Sangeethame :koyil puraa
  (Is this the only film song in the rare rasikapriya ragam?)
  
  MSV-TKR's use of yAzh in karNan
  
  ------------------------------------------------
  Ambiguous:
  
  
  Vaa Vadhyare ? - For its Madras Thamizh Usage
  
  Nammavar Song? - For its acapella Type
  
  Pettai Rap Vs Vikram?
  
  Qawwali Songs
  
  ------------------------------------------
  
  RV,Ravi : Let us just ignore the Hindi Song (be it Jaathi malli or Nandu) because it is not TFM!
  
  Murali : We are talking about the only musical form/lyrics & singing in a song
  to determine its uniqueness.So Athisayam (Jeans) will not count.
  
  Gopal : I Agree with you. Carnatic Experts are invited to contribute generally.
  
  =======================================
  Thumb rule: Firsts need not be unique.
  =======================================
  
  Breaking News:
  
  Sangeethame : Koyil Puraa
  
  "Sangeethamae is the only song in Rasikapriya that any music director has ever tuned" as confirmed by
  my pal LakshmiNarayanan (Of classical IR ).
  
  ------------------------------------------
  
  
• From: RV (@ nat-20.avanticorp.com) on: Mon Mar 23 20:23:55 EST 1998
  
  Gokul and others:
  Some issues:
  1. Aayiram Karangal Neetti sounds like a vedic chant. The song Kadhal Oviyam Kaanum Kaviyam has a similar ambience. I am not sure about this, but this is the feeling I get whenever I listent to this song. Maybe because of the "sadamanam Bhavathi" segment which starts this song. Kanchana is the expert here and maybe she can comment on this.
  
  2. Pallavai and Charanam being the same meter is fairly common. Palum Pazhamum song is the one of the instances.
  
  3. Counterpoint: Basically there are two threads in the song. One thread goes "En Kanmani Enaip Paratthadhum Sirikkindradhe" and the other goes "Un Kadhali Unaip Paratthdhum Sirikkindradhe". Both threads hv been merged brilliantly.
  
  Idhu Oru Pon Malaip Pozhudhu is not an example of Pudhuk Kavidhai. How does it differ from say a song like "Madai Thirandhu Paadhum Nadhi Alai Naan" ? How does one become Marabuk Kavidhai and the other Pudhuk Kavidhai ? I believe there are some pudhuk kavidhais in Agni Satchi. Can someone confirm this ?
  
  Will the high-faluting stuff that Prakash Raj spouts in Iruvar qualify as a song ? I dont know. If it does, it is unique. Prose as TFM.
  
  
• From: Rajaraman (@ 192.122.135.224) on: Mon Mar 23 20:24:58 EST 1998
  
  Gokul
  
  I think we can remove "madras thamil", "rap" and "qawwali" type of songs. They fit the list if we are talking about firsts.. right?
  
  Correction: The ambikapathy song should be "vaadaa malare"
  
  Addition: "nee yenge en ninaivugal ange" (Mannippu) song comes thrice in the movie each time in a different tune.
  
  
  
• From: Rajaraman (@ 192.122.135.224) on: Mon Mar 23 20:27:49 EST 1998
  
  Bharat
  The malayalam song I refer to is sung by KJY. I think the song also starts "kanakaangi".
  
  
• From: Gokul (@ p1.echostar.com) on: Mon Mar 23 20:58:40 EST 1998
  
  RV:
  
  Idhu Oru Ponmaalai Pozhudu...Distinctly fits the
  populist/Commercial form of Pudhu Kavithai and I believe this song paved way for more.
  
  I am careful in saying this is "Populist form of PudhuKavithai"
  as this does not fit the form evolved by MaNiKodi Writers or the form followed by poets like
  Gnani,athmaram etc.
  
  This song implemented the typical commercial Pudhukavithai form in places like
  
  KeLviGaLal VeLviGaLai naan seiven...
  
  Vaanam enakku oru Bodhi Maram
  NaaLum enakkuadhu Sedhi Tharum..
  
  etc.
  
  Difference between Pudhukavithai & Marabu is a discussion by itself. If you are
  interested I can email you my thoughts on that.
  
  Agni Saatchi does have some PudhuKavithai bits by Vaali!
  I vaguely remember something about Kosu(Mosquitos) and maamiyar.
  
  
• From: mannAru (@ ns.arraycomm.com) on: Tue Mar 24 00:00:14 EST 1998
  
  Gokul: Nalla topic. NanRi.
  
  "PudhuchEri katchEri" - starts with
  ka kA ki kI ku kU ke KE
  
  "mArugO maruGo marugayi" from Sathi LeelAvathi-
  Few lines from many songs set to Kanada raga
  beautifully.
  
  "Meena meena tika" first proper Jazz style
  song(Original is from hindi?).
  
  "OndRanavan uruvil irandAnavan" from ThiruvilaiyAdal has beautiful lyrics. I am
  not sure what category this belongs too.
  But this is definitely a special one.
  
  "aDadha manamum undO" from mannAdhi mannan.
  I think this is the only song sung by
  Dr. MLV.for TFM. Can any body confirm?
  
  In general "MayamoulaGowla" only ragA used
  maximum no. of times in TFM, esp. by IR. pal/ravi/rajaram can confirm this.
  
  "Ayiram NilavE vAA" controversial first
  song of SPB. In some program, he said
  that is some other song for an un-released
  movie. (athAnai pArthu ethanai nAlAchu .. something like that)
  In a way, in many stages this question
  was asked to him. This way it is special irresp.
  of whether it was actually his first or not.
  
  "nAn sirichAl deepAvali" from nAyagan,
  first old style
  song in a contemporary movie, to portrait
  the old story.
  
  mannAru
  
  

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