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Compare and Contrast IR's musical style(s), especially with the BGM tracks, with those of composers of Hollywood

Topic started by Music_lover (@ 202.141.98.226) on Wed Apr 28 08:58:08 EDT 2004.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Compare and Contrast IR's musical style(s), especially with the BGM tracks, with those of composers of Hollywood, viz., Maurice Jarre, Henri Mancini, John Williams, Jerry Goldsmith, Bernstein, John Barry, Alan Sylvistri, Danny Elfman, Ennio Morricone, Howard Shore, Hans Zimmer, James Horner and so on

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Mon May 17 03:57:47 EDT 2004
  
  One thing about IR is the stunning way his band mesmerizes the listener with its soulful rendition of the score he writes. The way each instrument emotes is one thing that differentiates orchestration with that of others (as far as India is concerned). As a true tribute to the musicians, and to the master i have mixed together a rather large 4:23 long brass orchestration. (Taken from 2 songs!!!)
  
  The Royal Budapest orchestra, Hungary performs the first 2.23 minutes. The brass orchestra includes Oboe, Harp, Piccolo, French horn and Clarinet. The remaining part is performed by our own people .
  
  The total mood of the track is about the uncertain danger looming large and the emotional struggle the lovers undergo wanting to be united. The mood changes dramatically from movements to movements.
  
  Listen how the orchestra plays to the immaculate score. Mesmerizing, a true pointer to this mans ability.
  
  Download the mp3 named “Tribute to the Master” from coolgoose http://www.coolgoose.com/go/song?id=117286
  
  I will reserve my comments about the orchestration after seeing your inputs. Enjoy :)
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 136.182.2.222) on: Mon May 17 04:47:58 EDT 2004
  
  Osho: There are very very few songs (India/Western) that can match up to Andhi Mazhai ... it is in a different league.
  
  >>One thing about IR is the stunning way his band mesmerizes the listener with its soulful rendition of the score he writes ...
  
  There are 3-4 songs that I would rate even 'better' than andhi mazhai in terms of this factor ...
  
  1. Thaalalttudhe vaanam from Kadal Meengal - especaily in the second interlude ... Raja moves the listeners into a higher plane .. strings, oboe, flute ... what a combination!
  
  2. 'Poove sempoove' from solla thudikudhu manasu ... what a fantastic song this is! Have you noticed the place when karthik enters the frame, there is a subtle shift in the pace and the theme of the music/instruments ... truly stunning!
  
  3. Last but not the least, 'Thendral vandhu theendum bodhu' from avatharam ... Can someone else give such a gift for a blind girl? I can almost 'feel' the way the colours change when IR sings 'vandhu vandhu pogudhamma ... eNNam ellam vaNNamma' .. Oh my god, IR is truly a legend!
  
  4. 'Sundari kannal oru sethi' from Thalapthy ...
  
  5. 'Edho Mogam' from Kozhi koovudhu' ... jeyachandran and SJanaki ... the violins and the flutes simply will mesmerize the listener ... you have got to listen to it to beleive this!
  
  Osho: Are there any songs in the league of 'Thendral Vandhu' and 'Poove Sempoove' in hollywood?
  
  
• From: Thoppus (@ 24.163.70.23) on: Mon May 17 13:15:45 EDT 2004
  
  //The brass orchestra includes Oboe, Harp, Piccolo, French horn and Clarinet.//
  
  correct me if i am wrong but aren't most of these woodwinds ?? and i think only these instrumentalists were from Budapest, the rest of the orchestra was local...
  
  i have always wanted to see the visuals of the first song...i hope rajiv anchal did justice to the music...
  
  
• From: k (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Mon May 17 18:32:46 EDT 2004
  
  Osho, of all the mixes you have done, this last one with Guru+Dalapathi music takes the cake. The arrangements are similar and the recording is of comparable quality. And above all the transition to the snare/march bit is almost imperceptible. Guruvukku nalla sishyanaaga iruppeergal polirukkE. Only thing is the Guru may not approve of your moniker :)
  
  SSSA, Please, please make sure Maestro gets to read this thread. Look at how Osho, has brought the mixture of hindustani+carnatic+western feel in the song. There is a silent mass who really appreciates the music of the Maestro. We eagerly look forward to his new works and enthusiastically collect his older works on CD (Project Gem) or from LPs bought in various conditions from places like (Old is Gold in Chennai). Of late, the Maestro seems to be concentrating on WCM in isolation, ICM in isolation (like in Ivan). We do not see him do fusion like say in, andhi mazhai. Maybe I am mistaken, but that is how I feel looking into his recent works. Probably, this is what is professional career goal is - to reach the heights in ICM and/or WCM. But I would like to request him to throw these small appalam/oorukaais , like andhi mazhai, - simple fusions probably to him - the way of ordinary people like us. I am not saying we will continue to be 'sangeetha gnanasoonyams' and just listen to film music. We do support his higher goals (like I contributed to TIS over a year back with the Father). We also want him to keep the younger generation and people who are focussed on melody encouraged and enthused enough to continue to pursue music starting with what that is available easily. If not for IR, I would not have explored the world of WCM. So please convey this point to Maestro - keep working on classical projects, while continuing to do film music.
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 136.182.2.221) on: Mon May 17 23:57:25 EDT 2004
  
  k: I kinda disagree to your views ... 'Ivan' is a film where the lead artiste was supposed to be a classical vocalist - you cannot expect a WCM fusion song for such a film. There are good recent films which have a nice blend of WCM/ICM - Solla marandha kadhai is one example ... 'Edho onnu nenaichurindhen...' is a good song with great instrumentation, and the mood the song conveys is totally apt for the situation.
  
  But I totally agree to what you say ...'request him to throw these small appalam/oorukaais , like andhi mazhai...If not for IR, I would not have explored the world of WCM'.Leave WCM, I wouldnt haven even listened to music in the first place if not for IR.
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Tue May 18 02:48:43 EDT 2004
  
  Thoppus, I guess Piccolo and french horn belongs to BRass. The orchestration includes Oboe, Harp etc and thats what i wanted to convey. As far as the visuals, it was a let down. You have to see it to believe it. IT was indeed a let down. I guess the director was over whelmed by the song and he faltered.
  
  k, Well said. You said what we, as deserving IR fans have in mind. About the mix, glad that u liked it. Put it in repeat mode, you would be stunned to hear how when the sundari piece ends, the score mixes absolutely wonderfully well with the Guru starting piece!!!.
  
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Tue May 18 03:19:06 EDT 2004
  
  Srivatsan, have you ever wondered in the Sundari Kannal Oru seithi song, how the score has been written. Whenever the lead singers sing “Sundari”(word) the orchestration stops. It’s done with absolute mechanical precision. The stopgap is so subtle, that it will evade the consciousness of us, as the song binds us emotionally.
  
  IR is so magnanimous that he gave a short symphony in a 7-minute song.
  
  Thoppus, if you know can you clarify whether in a brass orchestration along with brass wind instruments the wood wind instruments are not used. Am just curious to know!
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 129.188.33.222) on: Tue May 18 04:34:20 EDT 2004
  
  
  Osho: Seems I have lots more to listen to in the 'Sundari' song :) ... Only after reading your post did I even started to notice that! Its really amazing when you think about the how part when Ilayaraja has done this kind of stuff! There is a song 'Oru nal, indha oru naal...' from Devadhai ... another amazingly orchaestrated peice by Ilayaraja. It is sung very beautifully by SJanaki, and the violins just take you away.
  
  Neenga andha 9th chords reasearch post padichuttengala? I am waiting for your comments on that article!
  
  
• From: Thoppus (@ 24.163.70.23) on: Tue May 18 05:03:42 EDT 2004
  
  Osho- piccolo, oboe and clarinet from your list are woodwinds...french horn is brass...harp is in a class of its own i think...
  
  since brass & woodwinds are different classes of instruments, I am assuming the term "brass orchestration" refers to the arrangement of only the brass section in a larger ensemble...
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 129.188.33.222) on: Tue May 18 05:07:49 EDT 2004
  
  THOPPUS: Welcome to this thread :D
  
  
• From: Osho (@ 203.197.136.34) on: Tue May 18 05:40:03 EDT 2004
  
  Thoppus thanks. Can we term the above mix as a ensemble of brass and woodwinds. Please share your thoughts in this thread..
  
  The next mix release is “Rhapsody”. Composed by David Newman for the animation film “Ice Age “ (What a movie, hilarious!) Followed by IR’s “Sathriyan”.
  
  Jerry Goldsmith heavily influences David Newman and almost all his track has brass and wood wind instruments. This track from the movie “Ice Age” happens when Sid (The Sloth), Manny (The mammoth) and Diego (The saber) are passing through the ice cave when they see various objects encased in ice, transparent enough to the naked eyes. They even see an alien spacecraft! It’s a feeling of awe and excitement when you listen to the track.
  
  Then comes our IR’s track. This is pure WCM. No transition and no fusion. Listen how the track expresses the joyous mood. Note how the Newman track starts and the way it ends. Bingo! If you slow down the way the IR track starts (classic piano) you get Newman’s track. Does Newman sound similar to IR. I think he is!!
  
  Download it from http://www.coolgoose.com/go/song?id=117436
  
  If you are a music lover, you might be also interested in hearing Rusted Root's hit single “Send me on my way” track that was beautifully used in the film (Oh! What impressive way the flute intermittently plays throughout the entire track). The rusted root track overshadowed the good score David Newman did for the film. If you guys are interested, hear the sample from http://www.rustedroot.com. The album name is “When i woke”.
  
  Srivatsan, romba technical terms enakkum theriyathu..Naan oru novice..I'm learning through IR's music. :)
  
  
• From: Srivatsan (@ 136.182.2.221) on: Tue May 18 06:17:16 EDT 2004
  
  Enakkum thaan technicals edhuvume theriydadhu ... just wanted your comments on this article: http://www.geocities.com/ilaiyaragam/rajaresearch1.htm
  
  

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