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Why was 78-82 songs of IR considered his best?

Topic started by Prabhu (@ 203.90.94.162) on Fri Oct 4 08:37:47 EDT 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

A curious question. It is commonly perceived that THE BEST of IR's hit songs came in the 78-82 period. Why is it so?
It does appear that IR songs of this period had lengthy pallavis with heavy orchestration(consider 'Ore naal unai naan, Kanmaniye kaathal enbathu, Poonthaliraada, songs from Alaigal oivathillai, Nizhalgal,etc). The post-85 songs had pallavis that were more or less toned down and gradually culminated with greater emphasis on melody in the charanams.
Your comments?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Awe (@ 66.138.140.86) on: Wed Oct 9 20:07:37 EDT 2002
  
  Ofcourse it is hyped up more than other movies. Hitchcock used to do this trick. But he was masterful technician. In the 60s americans used to go to movies any time they want.. i mean they would join even during the middle of the movie... When he released his Psycho the poster said "Watch the movie from the beginning or not at all..."... So tickets were not issued if they were late. He created a hype. It was a massive success. Nowadays Night Shayamalan is creating some sort of hype. All movies come with hypes. ARR is using this technique. But the problem is when the hype doesn't meet expectation, people won't forgive it. After 2 or 3 movies people won't care about the hype created.
  
  
• From: hehehehe (@ 32.97.182.45) on: Wed Oct 9 21:18:47 EDT 2002
  
  and moat of the hype to those ARR films comes courtesy of IR fans here who are among the first ones to come to some thread discussing ARR music and spam it with some vayatherichal commments. but i guess, that works well for ARR fans as IR fans reduce their work of creating the hype for the movie.
  
  
• From: Aalavandhan (@ 203.106.140.180) on: Thu Oct 10 03:43:40 EDT 2002
  
  Precisley Yaaro.
  All the movies mentioned above, came with plenty of expectations because of the factors I wrote beside each one.
  And as you recognise, the internet is partly responsible for the extra hypes these days.
  As for Baba, maybe the movie is a flop (is it?) but the songs certainly are not. All world over, it is riding the charts. Please distinguish the forest from the trees.
  
  And talking about all songs wre good, let us re analyse the list again:
  
  Payanangal Mudivathillai (All songs were great, no argument)
  Kadhaal Oviyam (All songs great hits)
  Kozhi Koovuthu (Etho mogam and to a certain extent Poove ilaya poove)
  Salangai Oli (All hits)
  Sakalakalavallavan (Hit songs but not great. Best 2 songs in the movie better not be reminded.)
  Moondram Pirai (Kanne kalamaane)
  Thooral Ninnu Pochu (not great songs)
  Ninaivellam Nitya (All great songs)
  
  
• From: Vj (@ 203.199.251.218) on: Thu Oct 10 04:15:25 EDT 2002
  
  Aalavandhaan..
  
  regarding forest & tree, please refer Alan Carter's 4-in-1 book on MCSE 2000... :-))
  
  
• From: Aalavandhan (@ 203.106.140.180) on: Thu Oct 10 04:21:52 EDT 2002
  
  Vj, neenga unmaiyile nadigar/iyakkunar Visu thaane?
  Athusari, neenga mattum ein Ilayaraja-vai payanpaduthale? :)
  
  
• From: Prabhu (@ 203.124.139.195) on: Thu Oct 10 05:15:47 EDT 2002
  
  OISG:
  Your statement reminds me of Disraeli's quote: "There are three kinds of lies..Lies, damned lies and statistics". However, stats are just one of many nails to hang a picture..they are meant to complement and not to be used as a sole criterion.(That nails can be used to crucify is another issue!)
  If a student gets good marks doesnt mean he studied well, but a student who studies well will surely get good marks.
  
  Kiru, UV:
  Thanks for those highly enlightening posts...that is what sincere seekers of musical know-how want from this forum.
  
  
• From: Prabhu (@ 203.124.139.195) on: Thu Oct 10 05:28:54 EDT 2002
  
  Another angle...
  How much was IR influenced by the roles played by lead actors?
  Not until 'Murattukalai' till Rajini establish himself as a star of mass-appeal. His earlier movies like 'Ilamai Oonjal..', 'Dharmayuddam' had terrific songs..IR wasnt constrained by RK's standing.
  Kamal starred in multiple roles right from mid-70s..never stereotypical.
  In the early-mid 80s, Mohan emerged as a soft-spoken hero with 'mike' as his speciality...songs featuring him had melody as backbone.
  
  I guess Ramarajan's stereotypical roles drew IR into the tabla-flute formula...that's when the formula was born(Karagaatakaran was somewhat different). Holy cow!
  
  RR was going down by '89 end..the established stereotype was over. New innovations started around this period - IR had 9 diwali releases in '89, didnt he? Prabhu was slowly making his mark..Chinnathambi established him as a forefront actor.
  Similarly with Prashant-Chembaruthy..seems like IR was inclined to experiment with non-stereotyped actors.
  Is that right or am I going too far?q
  
  
• From: Are Yaar (@ 203.197.141.186) on: Thu Oct 10 08:10:44 EDT 2002
  
  Yaaro:
  >>>alavandhan a secret-psst-I liked KV very much.in fact,the one song all fans are disappointed-bailamore-I just cannot get it out of my head!
  
  I thought of pouncing on you after reading your earlier postings. But this line of yours seems to have suddenly cooled me. Good Tactics. Okay...escape this time. I will catch you next time...ha..ha..ha
  
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Thu Oct 10 14:50:42 EDT 2002
  
  Prabhu..do you know when pudhiya rAgam came out ? This movie has a distint style of songs, except for one song by IR.
  (yaaro..can you help avoid digression here :))
  
  
• From: UV (@ 134.113.4.168) on: Thu Oct 10 15:08:21 EDT 2002
  
  Kiru
  its an interesting album,isnt Rahu/rehman and jayachithra starrer
  
  
• From: Prabhu (@ 203.124.139.195) on: Fri Oct 11 07:36:36 EDT 2002
  
  Kiru..intamm.com shows it's a 1991 release. Don't know about the songs :( Will check them out if I can.
  
  
• From: Awe (@ 65.69.58.80) on: Fri Oct 11 12:56:04 EDT 2002
  
  I have some songs of from the movie. Songs are good. But after seeing the video of some of the songs i was completely turned off by Jayachitra.
  In 1989 She acted as mother in law for Rahman. In 1991 she produces this movie to act opposite him as a hero. Ridiculous
  
  
• From: purv (@ 205.231.147.67) on: Fri Oct 11 21:01:29 EDT 2002
  
  I found the notion that early IR songs had longer interludes than recent-day ones to be questionnable! If old songs had long interludes, then how come their running times were, on average, 4 minutes? Nowadays, the average running time for IR's songs are 5 min 30 sec, approximately. That trend started in the early 90s. What's the reason behind that? Longer intros? Longer stanzas? Or longer interludes? Or weaker singers/musicians? (Sheesh, if the last is true, then TFM IS in a declining state big time!)
  
  Anyway, kiru, in regards to 'Pudhiya Raagam,' (maybe you could forgive Prabhu's not responding to your posting first) I think the soundtrack released 1990, cause that's when I obtained a copy of a tape (a compilation album) with IR's song on it (a great melody song I might add). The film then released the following year.
  
  
• From: purv (@ 205.231.147.67) on: Fri Oct 11 21:04:48 EDT 2002
  
  Oh, sugar! Prabhu already answered your question! Hope you will forgive me. Yah, like Awe stated, songs are good. I mean, not that I've heard the whole album, but the two songs I have heard (Maalai Soodum and Malligai Maalaigathi) I liked immensely.
  
  By the way alavandhan, what does KV stand for?
  
  
• From: purv (@ 205.231.151.251) on: Sun Oct 13 22:01:44 EDT 2002
  
  Hello again. I have another point I'd like you guys to consider. Have you noticed, in the 70s and early 80s (up to 1985), IR's albums had less songs on average than his recent day albums. Now, the average number of songs per album is 7. Then, the average number of songs per album was 4. Maybe that was why IR's songs were [supposedly] so much better then than now? If you doubt what I am saying, go look at Raja's discography at www.raajaNGHAM.com. Browse the list of soundtracks by year, and you will find that older soundtracks in general contained less tracks than more recent ones. Very few 90s albums consist of less than 5 songs (ex. Chinna Kannammaa (4 songs), Sathi Leelavathi (3 songs), Ilayaragam (4 songs), Captain Prabhakaran (2 songs)) Now, you can't even have an album with less than 6 or so songs!
  
  
• From: geeth (@ 213.121.248.170) on: Mon Oct 14 01:03:31 EDT 2002
  
  purv, yes, noticed that many of IR's albums in this period had less songs. one reason is, the songs were released in records at that time and running time was a constraint there. IR's albums were mostly EP discs (45 rpm size but running at 33 1/3 rpm) which gave a choice of 2 off 2 saranam songs and 2 off 2 saranam songs. If one more song is added then there will be a release of another disc mostly with 2 songs in it. This EP fashion was already doing good in Malayalam esp with Salilda's albums. Then came the Cassette/Tape and duration of a song was no more a consideration. But IR had standardised and is still sticking to his 2 saranam format. Many a times songs are repeated to fill the running time of the second side of tape. Instead of an average 7 songs (with repeats) if it is still 4 or 5 songs with long duration in each - say 7 minutes, i feel it will be more impressive. 7 minutes may be too long for a movie scene and a shortened version can be adapted there, but in the album we will get nice full songs.
  
  
  
• From: geeth (@ 213.121.248.170) on: Mon Oct 14 01:04:56 EDT 2002
  
  sorry, typo in 3rd line.
  -2 off 3 saranam songs and 2 off 2 saranam songs--
  
  
• From: purv (@ 205.231.145.62) on: Sun Dec 1 21:23:35 EST 2002
  
  Awe, which film is 'Maaman Voodu Machaa Voodu' from? I think i have that song on tape.
  
  
• From: purv (@ ) on: Sun Dec 1 21:29:13 EST 2002
  
  btw, are my figures for Chinna Kannammaa, Sathi Leelaavathi, and Ilayaraagam correct?
  
  
• From: Venkatesh (@ 212.72.11.66) on: Mon Dec 2 00:44:04 EST 2002
  
  Purv,
  
  Maaman voodu is from Ellam Inba Mayam (*ing Kamal)
  
  
• From: purv (@ 205.231.31.233) on: Mon Dec 2 20:12:22 EST 2002
  
  That was my initial thought, after browsing through Raja's discography at Raajangham.com.
  
  Well, geeth, how are we going to communicate that to the producers?
  
  
• From: Narendra (@ 64.128.204.186) on: Mon Dec 2 22:56:03 EST 2002
  
  It was high time, people were looking for a different kind of music. IR came up with a blend of folk and carnatic with stress on instrumental western. No one tried that in Tamil cinema in a big way as IR did. As years passed, that also became an old style. This may be the reason, why "most" of his songs in the late 70s and early eighties were super hits.
  
  
  

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