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SPB the greatest singer that India had ever produced

Topic started by greatest_spb_fan (@ 212.2.14.241) on Thu Aug 2 04:57:19 EDT 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

why don't anybody start a thread like 'SPB the greatest singer that India had ever produced', pls

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Lord LabakuDas (@ 12.162.224.5) on: Sat Oct 26 18:49:48 EDT 2002
  
  I always had a doubt that whether they sold Rafi's cassettes to only that particular community..:-)
  
  
• From: outsider (@ 66.206.32.131) on: Sun Oct 27 01:50:36 EDT 2002
  
  Ali,
  By the way where you hail from?
  
  
• From: Prabhu (@ 203.197.77.146) on: Sun Oct 27 09:59:08 EST 2002
  
  Ali,
  thanks for your views and for retaining your composure. But I guess you will agree that when it comes to nominating "THE BEST" in any field, it's mostly a matter of tastes.
  BTW, see what SPB has to has on singing in Tam and Hindi..
  http://www.newtfmpage.com/forum/16159.03.12.52.html
  
  Peace.
  
  
• From: av (@ 132.206.52.157) on: Sun Oct 27 21:27:22 EST 2002
  
  In some ways, SPB is right when he says Hindi songs are easier. Most Hindi songs - even the golden oldies - have had simpler tunes than the ones composed by Ilayaraaja and MSV in particular. I also think many old Tamil songs had simple tunes. In those days I guess, the emphasis was on lyrics and sheer melody rather than complicated orchestration, excessive show of vocal wizardry and speedy tunes (classical or otherwise). Thus Hindi songs may in general be simpler - or perhaps seem simpler. The word "seem" because, such songs need to be elevated to those "dizzy heights" by sheer voice quality, without any "acrobatics", but by clever execution of even the most simple phrases. For instance, songs like Mohammed Rafi's "hum bekhudi mein tumko pukaare chale gaye" (sung for SDB) are not really tough songs to render as such.
  
  But when other singers attempt this song, they dont seem to create the magical effect that Rafi did. Perhaps its due to Rafi's superior voice modulation techniques or his sheer voice quality. In this respect, Hindi tunes (the golden oldies) are more difficult. Execution of simpler tunes needs more efforts on part of the singer perhaps, because the tune by itself may not be that astounding.
  
  All of the above is just a "conjecture" and stand open to correction. No flames please :-).
  
  
  
• From: av (@ 132.206.52.157) on: Sun Oct 27 21:28:30 EST 2002
  
  the last line - "stands open to correction"
  
  
• From: Super * Fan (@ 12.254.72.191) on: Sun Oct 27 22:16:43 EST 2002
  
  I don't know who Rafi is or what his contribution is o Indian Fils Music. But being is TFM, I'm sure no one is going to dis agree if I say there is no one better than SPB in TFM.
  
  Than you god for people like SPB and Ilayaraja and KJY and the list goes on..
  
  Hindustan Zindabad.. Vaazhga Tamil.. Valarga Tamizhargal.
  
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 217.158.120.226) on: Mon Oct 28 05:12:07 EST 2002
  
  hello ali;
  
  >>SPB's sister mentioned in an interview about wanting to marry Rafi>many artists and Swami made the point that expressing in Hindi is harder than in South Indian languages>SPB could only pass Rafi after the death of Rafi. If Rafi hadn't passed away so suddenly Rafi would have been leading in the amount of songs sung at this point
  because in the year 1979 he was the only one to have sung more than 30, 000 songs>Ofcourse SPB has mentioned that he has other favourites but he has always mentioned that Rafi is the greatest of all his favorites. >SPB's songs were branded as south indian hindi by northies , which was why it was not widely accepted..<<
  
  very true!
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 217.158.120.226) on: Mon Oct 28 05:15:33 EST 2002
  
  uh oh, here we go again, I can not seem to post the whole page, hence I have 2 post bit by bit, sorry :(
  
  hello ali;
  
  >>SPB's sister mentioned in an interview about wanting to marry Rafi>many artists and Swami made the point that expressing in Hindi is harder than in South Indian languages<, sorry , I don't agree with that @ all, my wife is pakistani, she can't pronounce a word of tamil correctly, even though, she has been trying for last 4 years, but I can pronounce hindi words & understand hindi more than she can understand tamil, South Indian languages are in deed lot harder to understand & express, esp tamil.
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 217.158.120.226) on: Mon Oct 28 05:16:16 EST 2002
  
  Ali;
  
  >>SPB could only pass Rafi after the death of Rafi. If Rafi hadn't passed away so suddenly Rafi would have been leading in the amount of songs sung at this point
  because in the year 1979 he was the only one to have sung more than 30, 000 songs<<
  
  oh come on man, don't be silly, SPB came inti singing in 1966, so u expect him to sing 30,000 songs in 13 years, do u think SPB is a super man :), rafi's been around from 50's till late 70's yet, he & latha could only manage 15,000 - 20, 000 songs, while SPB had crossed 40,000 within 36 years of service, SPB also holds the record for RECORDING 18 songs in a day !!!
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 217.158.120.226) on: Mon Oct 28 05:17:01 EST 2002
  
  Ali;
  >>Ofcourse SPB has mentioned that he has other favourites but he has always mentioned that Rafi is the greatest of all his favorites. >SPB's songs were branded as south indian hindi by northies , which was why it was not widely accepted..<< very true!
  
  
• From: Ali (@ 149.99.117.164) on: Mon Oct 28 10:09:49 EST 2002
  
  Hello all,
  
  Ok first of all I agree that when it comes to choosing the BEST in any field it mostly matters upon ones own tastes and opinions. But when we share these opinions with others, we tend to get into unnecessary arguments so it is best to see what other artists or experts say. I could have very well written a whole article on why I think Rafi's the best based on my opinions but since i knew it would stir contoversy as does other subjects i decided to choose the alternative of writing about what other artists and experts think of him who have been exposed to ALL the greats which is the best option after our opinions because it gives us an insight on what people with expert musical knowledge think.
  
  >>>oh come on man, don't be silly, SPB came inti singing in 1966, so u expect him to sing 30,000 songs in 13 years, do u think SPB is a super man
  
  I didn't mean to say that SPB had to reach 30,000 songs plus in 13 years to match Rafi. I said that just because SPB has sung the most songs as of now along with Lata, doesn't mean he is the greatest because Rafi held the record and if he was still alive he would have been the leader. Ofcourse SPB is not superman. Also, it seems that records have been sometimes too hyped in talking about recording 40,000 to 50,000 songs. According to many experts Lata hasn't even sung this much songs and she's been around the most number of years out of anyone. AV & Raghu, give your views on this.
  
  >>sorry , I don't agree with that @ all, my wife is pakistani, she can't pronounce a word of tamil correctly, even though, she has been trying for last 4 years, but I can pronounce hindi words & understand hindi more than she can understand tamil, South Indian languages are in deed lot harder to understand & express, esp tamil.
  
  Hindi/Urdu may be more easier to learn but when it comes to expressing these words, they take up more breath as opposed to SI languages when it comes to singing. That is the reason why it is harder to express in Hindi/Urdu than in SI languages. This is a trivial point made by many experts including Swami. That is why you will see many South Indian artists who have had a good exposure say that it is beneficial to learn Hindustani music since it improves breath control.
  
  Also another point i would like to make is that when Rafi & Lata burst onto the scene, music directors didn't have to be confined to the normal range of creating their compositions. They could now explore high and wide ranges and experiment with different scales ranging from low to high because of these two singers. Now if you say that though Rafi was unmatched at high scales, SPB is unmatched at low scales, the point is that music directors didn't have to be confined to mid to low scales as for other singers. Majority of singers can do good at mid to low scales because they have limitations but it is very hard to find singers doing justice to both low and high scales as Rafi or Lata could manage. That is why music directors could explore different ranges with these two in mind and compose different melodies when dealing with high scales. Melody created with an open range from low to high sounds more sweeter than melody created with a normal to low range. And Rafi could sing as freely in high ranges as he could in lower notes. That is why Rafi is referred to as "Saatwan Sur" that he could glide through the seven basic notes easily. People exposed to his and Lata's talent will not find words to describe their virtues.
  
  By the way AV what's your e-mail address if you don't mind ??.
  
  
• From: Raghu (@ 217.158.120.226) on: Mon Oct 28 10:29:01 EST 2002
  
  hello Ali;
  
  Lata has sung around 15,000 to 20,0000 songs, but P.Susheela has sung around 40,000+, and PS has been around a lot more than Lata
  
  >>. Now if you say that though Rafi was unmatched at high scales, SPB is unmatched at low scales, <<
  
  yes, I agree 2 a certain extent, that, Rafi had a soft voice, while SPB has a heavy voice, hence SPB's low scales are indeed unmatched, SPB can reach high notes as rafi with ease, how ever, I prefer SPB's low scales than high scales,Rafi could not sing rough, as he had a soft voice, but SPB can be as tender as possible & be as harsh as possible with his voice, that's the beauty of SPB!
  
  talking of high scales, what do u think about TMS?, he often sang in high scales, which sounded like he is straining his voice to limits, he was never good at lower scales though!
  
  I am singer myself, singing from mid to lower notes, is difficult than singing from lower notes to higher notes. :)
  
  
• From: Ali (@ 149.99.114.143) on: Mon Oct 28 16:01:11 EST 2002
  
  Raghu,
  
  >>Lata has sung around 15,000 to 20,0000 songs, but P.Susheela has sung around 40,000+, and PS has been around a lot more than Lata
  
  Lata is in the Guiness Book of Records for most number of songs sung and not P. Susheela, can you explain that ?. Lata has certainly had a longer career than P. Susheela has had. When P. Susheela went to audition for becoming a singer, she sang only Lata songs at her audition which shows Lata came before her.
  
  I didn't say that SPB's low scales are unmatched, I only said IF you MAKE that Statement along with the statement about Rafi's high scales being unmatched then the point is that music directors had a wider range when it came to Rafi.
  
  Rafi neither had a soft voice nor a heavy (bass) voice, he had a good voice. There are many songs in which he has reached low notes with ease as well as he does high notes. There are singers who venture into high notes but they sound strained such as TMS as you mentioned.
  
  When you say that singing from mid to low is hard then i agree it can be difficult to an extent. But reaching high notes is as difficult to reach because many a times a voice is not capable of venturing into those territories. A normal singer with a normal range can sing in low notes and continue through a low scale and his voice will never sound strained. When he reaches high notes there is a certain tendency to sound strained and more than often he will never venture into those territories unless he has to. Sometime back i read here that SPB only ventures into high notes if he has to. So the compositions for him are made at a mid to low scale unless otherwise the MD decides to make a song at a higher pitch. For Rafi, the MD's could make songs at different levels because of the range he possesed. That's the difference. When you hear a good song, the comfort level over ranges is what adds the punch to the song and comfort level over ranges is what your throat can support. Yesudas once said to Swami that god has been partial to Rafi, "god gift term anavasyamaa romba common aa ippo use aardu".. but idu Rafi kee thaan 100% porundu".
  Rafi could sing "as intricatley as a lady without sounding thin","cover any mood", "versatility odey perfect example rafi".
  Yesudas said most important is the comfort level over ranges which makes you feel that god has been partial to Rafi. SPB though good in lower scales can never reach Rafi when it comes to high scales.
  
  >>Rafi could not sing rough
  
  There are many songs in which Rafi has employed an excellent bass. Rafi could not only sing in a soft mood but also in a deep voice. His voice was so good that when he sung at a deep voice he didn't sound too deep as does SPB's bass with SPB's heavy voice, but just at the right amount of bass accompanied without a heavy voice and still deep which is hard to find anywhere else. You cannot describe this. A voice like his is hard to find anywhere you go.
  
  
  
• From: Thiru (@ 63.95.59.197) on: Mon Oct 28 16:01:41 EST 2002
  
  >>Most Hindi songs - even the golden oldies - have had simpler tunes than the ones composed by Ilayaraaja and MSV in particular.>>
  absolutely true AV.... and that's why most of the songs by Rafi sound pretty soft in nature... SPB has matured in the last 30 years or so to be adaptable to the changes in the film music scenario and no wonder he's still the no.1 in south indian films... His voice and skills have not made him to sing only particular type of songs like Rafi & KJY...
  
  

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