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IR and Jayalalitha - Similarities

Topic started by Pozhudhu pogadhavan (@ 12.92.217.110) on Fri May 11 18:36:47 EDT 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

As all of you well known about the arrogance of them.
There are some more: Both were at their peak during 1991 to 1993. Their drastic downfall started in 1994,1995. Any more thoughts?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: kk (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Tue May 15 11:28:43 EDT 2001
  
  So its Mukkabla video thats most inspiring is it?There is N number of contry music video in the world made on the like of wildwest bars. So thats the most inspiring is it?.
  
  Come on bharath grow out of eye catchy stuff. Just look at vennilave vennilave (though its sort of copy) kind of song and see how good choreography and mood mixed with the song. Look at Mani way of showing tajmahal in iruvar againt the cheasy graphics by kathir. If only song video matters then ken ghosh will do better job than shankar and kathir.
  
  bharath,
  why do you think Iam criticising ARR. I am not against his working style at all. Let him work with the best, no with likes of kathir, KSR and rajnikanth, BR for god sake. I felt it would be nice if he works also with the likes of directors surya, cheran etc.
  
  
• From: polappu (@ 216.253.102.3) on: Tue May 15 12:28:41 EDT 2001
  
  Barath,
  wasn't 'mellisaiye...' shot in some exotic location?(may be just the presence of Shilpa shetti made it look exotic). Good song though...
  
  If these guys were scoring music just for money it would have no freaking feel to it.
  
  When it comes songs in shankar's movies, they are pop videos and I think thats the reason ARR likes working for shankar (remember, he once said he considers himself a pop musician).
  He(shankar) can actually ask ARR to just come up with some good song, rather, a bank of songs (say about 20 songs) then chose 4-5 songs each for his next few movies. It will still be just this effective and would save time. (would be even easier if he can get someone make 20 music videos for the songs and stock them up too..)
  
  Think I can be a good executive producer in koliwood.....
  
  Shankar
  
  
• From: bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue May 15 15:32:56 EDT 2001
  
  "vennilave vennilave" song location, choreography and even expressions were copied from "an american in paris"
  
  I dont agree with kk on "muqqabla" see u can see a thousand wild west bar videos in america. but to a kuppan and suppan sitting in downtown tanjavur thats exotic. it was the first music video i remember that used such a concept. plus graphic is often undermined by critics...
  well if its so straightforward how come no one thought of it b4.
  
  when u see a graphical marvel like jurrasic park..there was a kiddish graphical intro's in hollywood 20 years b4.which slowly grew in popularity and dimension to give such amazing stuff.
  
  so if want to see Tamil movies having graphical marvels atleast 10 yrs from now start encouraging amatuer attempts frm shankar
  
  see thats not my point... the basic intent and the reason for my frustration is... i put myself in arr's shoes and i see manirathnam and shankar do amazing videos for "pachai nirame", "dilse" "saat rangi re" "chikku bukku raile" or "shakalaka baby"
  
  even slightly above average music which has stunning visuals reaches mass audience and sales because of the amazing public-reach generated by those videos.
  
  it is so frustrating to see good songs like "thatti aaduthe " in En Swasa Katre or all songs in "uzhavan" all songs in "taal", "daud", "tajmahal" .. such good songs get wasted and unnoticed ... bcoz the directors r unimaginative and use ARR just for brand value
  
  so arr had to have some criteria to ensure that his good work (may not be good to all but to him it is) doesnt go unnoticed. which is why he chooses people with a reputation for making good visuals. c'mon accept its when there is an option to see u'r movies get splendid visuals like the ones in "thiruda thirudaa" u wud be cynical towards people who arent tech-minded.
  
  over techieness is a flaw but doesnt mean that u r cool only if u dont have techie-orientation... visuals r important...although i loved "sethu" i believe the songs were very very ordinary and so was the visuals....
  
  
  bye
  bharath
  
  
  
  
• From: Ctrl-C & Ctrl- V (@ 63.224.65.186) on: Tue May 15 15:34:28 EDT 2001
  
  ARR & Narasimha Rao - similarities and differences
  
  Topic started by Philosopher (@ 12.29.192.65) on Mon May 14 14:13:25 EDT 2001.
  All times in EST +10:30 for IST.
  
  
  I have nothing against ARR - but the stupidity of the topic IR vs Jaya made me start this (though IR was at his peak in 80s not necessarily 1991-93).
  
  ARR and NSRao both don't say much, both are quite unethical in what they do, one's in Jail - when will the other join? Anything else? - I know this is a stupid topic but compared to IR and Jaya comparison, this is great!
  
  
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  Responses:
  From: Philosopher (@ 12.29.192.65) on: Mon May 14 14:17:21 EDT 2001
  
  
  Another similarity - both of them rose to the top and were celeberated throughout India in their peak for no genius - just mediocrity and tight-lipped nature (leaving people to give benefit of doubt to their assumed talent/thoughtfulness)
  
  
  
  From: bb (@ 216.217.80.201) on: Mon May 14 14:28:55 EDT 2001
  
  
  you can probably put your comparison in that thread:)
  
  
  
  
• From: bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue May 15 15:35:53 EDT 2001
  
  polappu,
  
  all MD's put their heart and soul into their music thats a fundametal assumption... money is one layer above it.. its like a management decision of where to direct ur efforts not like a mercenary who just see the cash and and starts making noise with instruments
  
  plus! when songs itself is an extra unrealistic and artificial aspect in moviess.. shankar just makes it more interesting and enjoyable...
  
  to may there is no sing-dance sequence that meshes well with a movie bcoz song dance itself is unrealistic... since we dont have separate albums and music videos like MTV we have to use songs in movies to fill up that void
  
  bye
  bharath
  
  
• From: BORN Tamilan (@ 202.139.118.253) on: Tue May 15 18:52:37 EDT 2001
  
  IR fans seem to have the misconception that by condemning ARR, They are expressing the qualities of IR. Well guy(and girls) you're wrong.
  Stick to expressing IR's qualities only you will do well.
  When asked about IR write about IR.......simple rule
  
  
• From: kk (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Tue May 15 19:58:34 EDT 2001
  
  bharath,
  Just watch 'enge selum enpathai' indha sethu, the camera work and the tone is so good.
  
  If the stupidity of actors teleporting to 50 lakhs sets are the songs. Then god save people tastes. I wont mind if these songs come on MTV videos. But in a movie it should make some sense.
  
  Jurassic park has a story to back the graphics. It was not a "Picha karanuku mittai kadai" stuff.
  If we have to make world class movies, we do need tools like graphics, but it should make sense in the movie. West took notice of "hidden tiger crouching dragon" not for the graphics work, it was for the substance in the movie.
  
  I want also songs and picture to reach my heart atleast once in a while. You want it only for ears and eyes. We both wasted time talking to each other.
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.134) on: Wed May 16 02:27:11 EDT 2001
  
  well bharath,
  
  i believe there is a misconception in few of ur points. film should not mainly depended on amazing videos and Graphical marvels. It should depend more on other factors like story, screenplay, casts etc. Music is an important factor, agreed, but not the most important factor. films are not mere video ads or albums necessiating its songs to be pictured with marvels of graphics. But at the sametime songs are important, they should go with the other factors of the film mentioned above, so is the BGM.
  
  Do u expect a muqabla kind of song for a film like sethu? ok, leave it...why didn't ARR give a 'muqabla' in uzhavan??? don't blame the creator(director/producer) for that saying that he was inept.
  
  well someone mentioned "solai kuyile" song.. well that was 1970's even if the director wanted to spend crores of rupess he wud'nt have been able to make a "muqqabla" type of music video.., yes even ARR were there during that time he too would not have done "muqabla", u know it very well. we had been having songs like "muqabla" right from 50s and 60s (remember "yaaradi nee mohini" from uthhama puthran; remember "avaLukkenna azhagiya mugham" from server sundaram; remember "iLamai idho idho" from sakalakalaa vallavan). people did use the techniques exisiting then to tune and picturize those songs, public too welcomed them, but public were not expecting such kind of songs(tune and picturization) to be their daily diet.
  
  ever thought of failure of film as well as songs of uzhavan, pavithra etc (failure in terms of other ARR hits like kadhalan)? i feel, ARR is identified for album kind of songs, even among many ARR Fans. Hence his non-album kind of songs were not received well by audience. i doubt even ARR is suffering (or was suffering) from such a dilemma and that is also one of the factors he is hooking himself to Manis and Shankars alone.
  
  nowadays v feel only those songs which r rich in graphics are entertaining and earlier it was not there. had "muqabla" been tuned & pictured in same fashion in 60s or 70s, i doubt it would not have got such an applause.
  
  
  
  
• From: Raatchashan (@ 203.199.205.25) on: Wed May 16 03:14:22 EDT 2001
  
  "ARR does lesser number of films becuase he wants to give quality".
  
  Nothing can be farther from truth. ARR took months to produce a trash called Tenali.
  
  Let us understand one thing. ARR is a music composer with severe limitations in terms of originality, variety, speed as well as creativity. Somehow he is managing the show. And we people are wasting our time comparing him with IR.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.53) on: Wed May 16 05:53:18 EDT 2001
  
  "Trash like Tenali" ...why such senseless statements....say it straight that I am a HC"whateverMD" fan and I hate ARR and his music"....
  
  BTW Thenali had some fantastic rhythms and instrumentation that was let down by really bad choreography...
  
  When we go to the theatres for ARR music, we expect choreography and visuals that match the music...otherwise it's a wasted effort
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.53) on: Wed May 16 05:55:43 EDT 2001
  
  >>>Do u expect a muqabla kind of song for a film like sethu? ok, leave it...why didn't ARR give a 'muqabla' in uzhavan??? don't blame the creator(director/producer) for that saying that he was inept. <<<
  
  Kupps...FYI..."Maari Mazhai Peyatho..." was a real cool number...I remember that it created quite a stir in our college festival...
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.53) on: Wed May 16 06:01:57 EDT 2001
  
  Bharath is right....
  
  There is an Advertising rule that says that for an ad to be the most effective : The Visual has to speak 50% of the message and the rest 50% has to be backed by the words (if it's a paper ad) or music (if it's a TV ad)... (this is also a general rule for effective communication of a message not only advertising and movies are a medium of communication..)
  
  So if some songs don't make an impact be it ARR's or IR..it definitely is the Director's fault....how often do we hear the songs of the film first and expect really fantastic visuals and feel really let down when it's not the case...but real music lovers will preserve the songs in their best list...whereas general public will forget these songs...
  
  

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