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MSV and ARR - THE ONLY LEGENDARY COMPOSERS FOR TFM TO CHERISH!

Topic started by Kumar (@ 202.9.169.42) on Fri May 4 11:04:06 EDT 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

The melodies of MSV are longlived and cherished even today as new. They sound fresh.
ARR, though young in age can be considered as a current day counterpart in composing songs intact with melody, well orchestrated to the mood, giving importance to the lyrical content, the same way MSV did then! I think there is a similarity between the two geniuses.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.149.4) on: Tue May 8 12:51:50 EDT 2001
  
  Trend,
  If music were as subjective as you think it is - then there is no point in discussing about music. Same goes for music reviews and professional critical columns. The fact is there is lot of science behind music. The very fact an octave is divided into twelve semi-tones and that this has been done in the West as well as in other countries shows the underlying physics behind this. Same goes for guidelines on harmony/chord/counterpoint. Lots of studies have been done on psychoacoustics - on how much neural activity happens when a subject listens to particular peice of music etc. So you are not going to convince me or many here that there can be no consensus on what good music is. We all know that you are a great fan of ARR and people here are not intellectually challenged to think that ARR is brain-damaged and still manages to garner all the international and national attention just by using loops and computerised recording. I strongly suggest that you use this forum to learn rather than to insist on your viewpoint. Nobody is going to hold anything against if you listen to ARR all day and all night. But it is puerile to jump on any statement (that too from a music-savvy person) which attempts to credit IR for what he has done.
  
  Please dont mistake this as a sermon, but as plea from a fellow poster who just wants to move on to more technical exchanges here than spend time on wagering over one-upmanship.
  
  (Excuse me for the harsh tone, if you notice any)
  
  
• From: UV (@ 134.113.203.137) on: Tue May 8 12:53:25 EDT 2001
  
  most of the half baked here knows little or nothing about music,they just start all this trash threads just to get some attention.
  So Swamji dont waste your time.
  We can always discuss nice things about music,composing in our amateur thread.
  As such I have stopped checking TFM page as it has become a junkyard just like the other threads
  hope admin does something about this :( sad very sad
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Tue May 8 13:32:48 EDT 2001
  
  kiru,
  
  First of all,let me make it clear that I don't consider anyone here intellectually challenged(maybe I'm the only one).I think everyone here understands that just b'cos I say something Swamiji's statements doesn't become less effective or less truthful.
  
  Can you vouch that most music reviews and professional critical columns are sincerely catered towards enriching people's taste and surely not at all thirsting for sensation?I think nowadays,it has become a fashion to critique everything in a sensational language.Their reviews mostly sound like "You don't know what good music is at all.I have seen much better music in my time(that was the golden age).It's a shame you prefer this music".
  
  FYI,I listen to both ARR and IR everyday.
  
  "I strongly suggest that you use this forum to learn rather than to insist on your viewpoint"
  
  I'm learning everyday I guess from this forum.But when I'm not learning I would to know how weak or strong is my viewpoint.
  
  "plea from a fellow poster who just wants to move on to more technical exchanges here than spend time on wagering over one-upmanship."
  
  I think you are contradicting yourself here.
  
  BTW,I didn't find your tone to be harsh.
  
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Tue May 8 13:39:12 EDT 2001
  
  UV,
  
  I will take your viewpoint and I have a feeling everyone else feel that way.So I won't post anymore.I think that makes everyone happy.
  
  Kiru & Swamiji,
  
  If you thought of responding please don't.
  
  
• From: Ayoooo (@ 143.117.11.25) on: Tue May 8 14:00:17 EDT 2001
  
  Ayo . toiketinglah..
  Those with least knowledge of music started giving opinions.
  IR the only living legend. Even the album is not released for some reasons .. to enter RPO in London with his own composition is something impressive indeed.
  
  Bless yee
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.254) on: Tue May 8 14:55:53 EDT 2001
  
  There is too much of self-proclamations going on in this area. Don't ask me to point out..
  
  
• From: Swamiji (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Tue May 8 15:15:30 EDT 2001
  
  Ok Trend,
  I agree with you. I based my conclusions on serious critics, because in a way (IMO) they refined (or say analyze) someones music and tell us their opinion. I value critics opinion because they spend more time than I do to understand. Well thats about it.
  On the other hand, you base your conclusion on mass appeal. Theres absolultely nothing wrong in it. Fashions keep changing, and people like to stay parallel with whats new. Afterall life becomes boring when things don't change, which u and I agree. Thats whats happened to music. But the raw material is the same. People still play the piano as much as they play the electronic piano - although (it) might have become old-fashioned?
  Just don't compare is my request.
  
  
• From: comment (@ 12.5.10.153) on: Tue May 8 15:20:04 EDT 2001
  
  fliflo..U r bit late to the party :)
  
  swamji.....kojam vellai ya gavaninga...
  ur muzuka layoff ...........:)
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue May 8 18:53:56 EDT 2001
  
  i really want to know this I have been hearing for about a decade that IR has done recordings in RPO. my questions r...
  
  1) whats this RPO anyway ( i know its royal philharmonic orchestra)other than is it an organisation...
  
  2) what r the other popular musicians who have been selected for this RPO ....
  
  3) why is this being used as a yardstick for greatness especially that of IR.
  
  4) how is the RPO selection process. why being selected for RPO is something great. who r these people who select musicians frm everywhere.
  
  to me all the 3 MSV, IR, ARR have made/ been-making quality music for atleast a decade and so deserve to be bracketed together. right now since ARR has age on his side we will all know in our living days if he cud break into the international dimension and establish a name for himself.
  
  as for IR I sincerely thought he wud make path breaking classical music and when he retires he wud be bracketed along with beethovan and bach.
  
  sadly he hasnt risen above india and more sadly he hasnt been showing any effort to shun TFM music for a year or 2 and do some quality thinking with some international music...
  
  ARR in a decade is now working with ALW atleast i see some effort to realize his true potential..he really sacrificed TFM for a year atleast
  
  
  IR should be more aware of possibilities and try and raise the bar. frankly i wud have loved to have seen an ARR-IR competitive music scenario in TFM. where each wud do compettive music and out do each other and raise the bar sky high...
  
  but IR shied away from such things... instead of wasting the last decade in TFM he cud have done some international music.. he didnt acheive anything great that he hasnt acheived.. in the last 7 years atleast ...and thats stagnancy to me..
  
  I am still a IR fan but I like ambitious people and I may not be aware of exactly how IR attempted to realize his international ambition but its atleast not publicly evident..
  
  bye
  bharath
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 64.172.24.51) on: Tue May 8 23:39:00 EDT 2001
  
  I am not very sure about the details..but here's how it works. Every city in the US usually has an orchestra. People in the city are the musicians in the orchestra. It is the conductor who is the principal person in the orchestra (there are other jobs like music director etc too as well). There is a lot of encouragement for cities to have an orchestra. Initially the orchestras are funded by grants from government and non-government orgs. The conductor/musicians/etc choose what works they want to play. A 'special city' like San Francisco might have a womens only orchestra, with a woman conductor and sometimes the chosen composers are also women. So it is the orchestras which 'invite' the composers to write a work for them. (After they get sick of playing Lizst, or Bartok or Tchaikovsky :)) It is akin to producers picking a music director for a movie. Conductors and orchestras go together in popularity. Like SF has Michael Tilson Thomas, Claudio Abbado in London etc ( a few that I know of). So I guess RPO is also a popular orchestra (I think Philadelphia is very popular in the US). If RPO chooses some composer then it means atleast that person IS a composer. Later on, the marketing arrangements are worked. As I learn it costs about $60K to record an orchestra in the US.
  
  I do think IR will make a great fulltime WCM composer. Afterall, compared to the WCM guys I think our people are very good in the melody department. And usually the WCM works with melody that are popular.
  
  So what do you think is 'the international music' that IR should be working on ??
  
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.53) on: Wed May 9 04:40:37 EDT 2001
  
  "If music were as subjective as you think it is - then there is no point in discussing about music. Same goes for music reviews and professional critical columns. The fact is there is lot of science behind music..."
  
  Kiru...why all this...can you quantify the source of inspiration for music ? Science is what your mind and ears decipher and we all know how flawed our minds can be...I do appreciate your scientific outlook...but this so called "serious" criticism is welcomed as long as it does not kill the humaness and spirituality behind it....Remember the arguement in the film "Unnal Mudiyum Thambi" between "Bilahari Marthanda Pillai" and his son about music....I think Balachander sincerely believed in that and that's why he let Mani introduce ARR in Roja....because they found a youthfulness and passion in his music...
  
  So Swamiji - please stop this whole load of bull about being scientific to the point where you will accept anything only after scientists tell you what you want to hear...and Trend is right....follow your heart and Let go...you will enjoy music more !!!
  
  
• From: comment (@ 65.9.136.158) on: Wed May 9 07:38:47 EDT 2001
  
  follow your heart and Let go...you will enjoy music more !!! ...well said, cosmician.
  
  music cannot be fit into rules, simply something that pleases the ears is music,
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: dss (@ 203.197.80.33) on: Wed May 9 08:21:34 EDT 2001
  
  these silly HCFIRs hate it when anybody else is praised - that includes ARR,MSV, or any other MD. Guys, lets ignore them and continue our discussion on the greatness of MSV and ARR
  
  

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