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Mumbai Moham - What do Tamils put up with the bad and mediocre singing of Mumbai artistes?

Topic started by Indhu (@ 24.76.127.63) on Sat Dec 1 22:44:28 EST 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

This is my question....Udit Narayan, Hariharan, Sadhana Sargam, Kavitha Krishnamurti,Sonu Nigam - All sing in Tamil. But their Tamil is really very bad. Are Tamils deaf, tolerant, or have no PERUMAI in their own language? Is there really a shortage of good, tamil-speaking singers? Or is this really Tamil Inferiority Complex?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: NCR (@ 206.30.30.2) on: Thu Dec 6 12:18:22 EST 2001
  
  After discussing so much, after having this many thoughts, are we just going to have just thoughts, discussions or are we going to do some thing about that? Any suggestions on what to do next?
  
  I guess what majority thinks is that this mispronouciation in general is happening more now adays and most of that is happening with Morthies which is natural. Who ever resposible for letting this happen are not taking care of this as they have their own reasons doing so.
  
  Lot of questions pop up after these thoughts...
  
  1) Is somebody going to represent this resentment with those responsible persons?
  2) Are we going to do that? If yes how are we going to do?
  3) Is it possible to change the things the way they are happening?
  4) Do we have people in the cine field, first of all who know what is correct Tamil and how should it be pronounced?
  5) If Tamil is pronounced properly without any accent or changing the style, doesnt the MD's can tune the Pop stylish tunes?
  
  I am not sure..
  
  
• From: NCR (@ 206.30.30.2) on: Thu Dec 6 12:21:08 EST 2001
  
  Some typos, It is Northies not Morthies,
  It is "changing the style, can MD's tune" instead of " changing the style, doesnt the MD's can tune "
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 130.203.169.52) on: Thu Dec 6 12:23:22 EST 2001
  
  "What's he defending?"
  
  Is that not the same question I have been asking you guys so far..
  
  
• From: rajaG (@ 208.24.179.129) on: Thu Dec 6 12:28:10 EST 2001
  
  Fliflo:
  rajaG..no point in giving random thoughts..everybody has that
  
  After reading your posts, I am not sure of even that :-)
  
  If you managed to read most of the sane posts here, you should have come to the conclusion that this is not a crusade against talented and dedicated artists, merely because they are NOT thamizhars. If you think that Indhu is referring to "mumbai singers" to mean "singers NOT from thamizhnadu" then, I am sorry to say, you need to work on your comprehension skills. Or you have spent too much time on truth tables that you have lost perspective on substance over form.
  
  If you believe that Chitra's, Sujatha's, Yesudas's, Srikumar's, occassional mispronunciation is the same in quality as Sadhana Naragam's, Suckwinder's, U-shit's unfathomable renditions......I am sorry, I cannot argue with you (In any case, I sometimes feel arguing with you is futile, but that is another matter:-)) Coming to HH's, SM's, UK's, Kavitha's....they are definitely 90% ready raw material in terms of pronunciation. I only wish that the MDs spend (or provide the resources) time on correcting their pronunciation (which I don't expect to be an enormous time consuming effort). At a minimum, it will atleast ensure that I don't have to (in future) argue in the future with the Fliflo's of the world, why HH is an uncut diamond and U-Shit is unflavored crap :-)
  
  As a corollary, if we must import talent, let us atleast get the top-notch variety.
  
  
• From: Indhu (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Thu Dec 6 12:30:08 EST 2001
  
  Yes, we have put up with KJY's "Therukoyile Odivaa-s" and Chitra's "Ammanu sollavum AdhiHaram Illai-s" and "Palli(you know the la)koodam Naan Ariyens". Why, even "maestro" SPB has pronounced things like "Nalvall-vu thandhaye Neeye". But these instances, rare as they are, have been corrected and the singers have demonstrated enough regarding their investment in the "Tamil" language. What's more, they have not moved on to new bloopers.
  
  A word here, an ending there is forgivable. As RajaG says - every singer, at some point, twists his/her tongue the wrong way. It is human.
  
  But song after song after song. Oh Pul-eeeez!
  
  Yes, this is indeed about Mumbai singers. Encouraging new (and foreign) talent should not be at the cost of fine, impeccable Tamil/(mastered)Tamil - talent. Period.
  
  Call me a racist and a counter-pig. But learn to call a spade a spade, yourself.
  
  
• From: Indhu (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Thu Dec 6 12:41:37 EST 2001
  
  Hi NCR,
  
  Please go back to a few of the old postings. I did offer a list of suggestions/ideas about collective action. Let me know what you think.
  
  Look forward to your feedback. Thanks.
  
  Indhu
  
  
• From: FATHIMA (@ 203.199.248.66) on: Thu Dec 6 12:44:43 EST 2001
  
  Yesudoss and K.S.Chitra have spoilt many telugu songs with their bad pronounciation...But Anuradha,Harini and Hariharan...all tamils sing telugu songs very well....Tamils singing for telugu and telugus singing for tamil films are absolutely fine.....Others singing in both these languages always pronounciation is not good...One has to bear with this as all front line singers today are from North....Shankar Mahadevan is very good in Telugu as he is tamilian....
  
  
• From: Indhu (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Thu Dec 6 12:53:18 EST 2001
  
  In a recent interview MSV had to say this about the whole "foreign" trend. I've posted this before, but I think it bears repeating:
  
  "If you mispronouce a little the producers will give you 10. If you mispronounce entirely they will give you a 100."
  
  Vani Jairam - a fine, exemplary singer has withdrawn from Tamil (and southern film singing, generally) for the same reason. She says it is humiliating for a trained and qualified artiste to endure the political shenanigans and commercial unscrupulousness that has invaded the mainstream Tamil film industry.
  
  She has, however, sung for Vijayabhaskar recently, in the Kannada film Neela. The songs from that film hark back to a time of purity in rendition and composition which is all but lost these days. Give it a listen. The album is available on www.musicindiaonline.com (Kannada section)
  
  Ask yourself this: Is a Sadhana/Kavitha/Anuradha - really a replacement for such Tamil excellence?
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.218) on: Thu Dec 6 13:08:31 EST 2001
  
  Fast going...good
  
  If you think that Indhu is referring to "mumbai singers" to mean "singers NOT from thamizhnadu"
  
  There is a wonderful saying in tamil denoted as "Sappai Kattu". You can't have a better example than this.
  
  I am sorry, I cannot argue with you (In any case, Sadhana Naragam's, Suckwinder's, U-shit's unfathomable renditions
  
  You don't seem to be addressing the generality. If they mispronounce, come with an example where and which place. Putting it so general leaving others show nothing but just your racist attitude.
  
  I sometimes feel arguing with you is futile, but that is another matter:-))
  
  I don't feel so. Because, no reason to do so. My arguements are basically non-personality dependent factor. (happy that you know me, in whichever sense)..This hardly bothers me.;-)) How can I help your problem..;)) It seems that you're a guy, who believes whatever you say is right kinda attitude.
  
  it will atleast ensure that I don't have to (in future) argue in the future with the Fliflo's of the world, why HH is an uncut diamond and U-Shit is unflavored crap :-)
  
  That's great. That keeps a big full stop to your racial attitude;-)). But just because they are northies, I do not see any reason to hate them/their songs. Anyway, their users know better than you and me.
  
  
  
  
• From: NCR (@ 206.30.30.2) on: Thu Dec 6 13:16:31 EST 2001
  
  Fathima,
  
  Which songs you heard of Shankar Mahadevan that his telugu sounds good?. He mispronouces quite often and also you know what has an accent that he doesnt sound telugu. If you know telugu songs, I can list couple of songs, panchavannela ramachilukaa from premaku velayera.. Man he is horrible. Dabbu Dabbu from nuvvu vastavani. he sounded an alien to me with his accent.
  
  
• From: Indhu (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Thu Dec 6 13:21:04 EST 2001
  
  Fliflo,
  
  A humble request: Please read the topic definition about. I have enlisted a range of queries. Not Just One.
  
  Indhu
  
  
• From: Indhu (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Thu Dec 6 13:21:42 EST 2001
  
  That should be "above" - just a typo. Sorry
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.230) on: Thu Dec 6 13:32:23 EST 2001
  
  Indhu,
  
  I think you misunderstood me.What I said was these things may not be in our control and we may not be able to influence a change.In times like this usually a elderly person says:life is a cycle, at one time a certain thing goes up reaches its maximum and then degrades to the other extreme and again rises up.
  
  As RajaG mentioned in one of his thoughts we have to find out the following:Does MDs know what we actually want?If the MDs know, are the MDs doing on producer/director's insistence or their own choice?
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.218) on: Thu Dec 6 13:32:39 EST 2001
  
  ARR seems to use lot of south indian singers for his songs in hindi version too,
  
  1947 earth - Sujatha Mohan, Anuradha Sriram,
  Srinivas
  Bombay - Chitra, Remo, Pallavi, noel, anupam
  
  Chor Chor - Anupama, Sujata, SPB, Srinivas,
  Suresh, Mano, Chitra
  
  Daud -Yesudas, SPB
  
  Dil Hi Dil Mein -srinivas, Swarnalatha, Devan
  
  Dil Se - mahalakshmi, Sree kumar, Anupama
  
  Lagaan - Anuradha Sriram, Srinivas
  
  Nayak - Kavitha Subramanian, Vasundara Das, Pravin Mani
  
  Hindustani - SPB, Suchitra, Swarnalatha, Yesudas
  
  the list goes
  
  It does prove that it is not true that we do not go and sing there. All ARR songs come a big hit there. I donno what kinda pronounciation problems they face. In that case, they might try to avoid, which is what is going on here.
  
  Long live India..
  
  
  
  
• From: KS (@ 165.122.128.250) on: Thu Dec 6 14:16:12 EST 2001
  
  Yesterday’s contd…
  
  oh my..!! where is that sarcasm ? or was that somebody telling something directly ? Anyway, its good to see a change for better.
  
  Today’s…
  
  RajaG,
  
  I fully agree with the 3rd point you made. Another way of getting a fair assessment of how much a MD REALLY CARES for the language/pronunciation is probably going by his comfort-level in composing songs PRIMARILY with native instruments (Pl. do not mistake this to be saying that they should not use other instruments). The less they use the native instruments, the less they would care for language/pronunciation. Some may ask “Is it not possible to use purely western/foreign instruments/equipment and still churn out songs with good pronunciations?” The answer is yes/maybe, if they are less in number. But, as there is an increase in the usage of purely western/foreign instruments/equipment, they take a liking to it. That results in less preference for usage of native instruments which in turn would make them care less for pronunciation (which is a major reason, I feel, has lead to the current situation)
  
  I am certainly not against singers from other regions if they can get a decent pronunciation of the words in the songs they sing (implies, they may not be fluent in the language). As a matter of fact, more than these mispronunciations what bothers me is the English accent they give to the words/songs. Be it Tamil singers or others, they should stop doing this and should pronounce the words properly. And for this cause, I am with you.
  
  Indhu,,
  
  Of the options you’ve mentioned, I think “A signed letter to all Tamil cinema journals/mags.” seems more possible than others.
  
  (I will see how things materialize here before I respond)
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.218) on: Thu Dec 6 14:28:31 EST 2001
  
  Of the options you’ve mentioned, I think “A signed letter to all Tamil cinema journals/mags.” seems more possible than others.
  
  KS; Would you eloborate what the content is going to be. I am eager to know that
  
  

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