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What do we want from IR in future ?

Topic started by Natarajan (@ pryout.mecon.com) on Wed Mar 11 14:49:39 EST 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Being the resposible fans of IR, shall we define what we want from IR in future ?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Mr.Kuzapam (@ 206.139.13.152) on: Mon Apr 19 14:07:33 EDT 1999
  
  Without any doubt KK sucks than padaiappa --- same illa arun was torn into pieces here when he was used by ARR..Now she is baptised and accepted, Nala story.
  What Isai priyan says is correct, IR scores are pretty poor these days...thangala. Only one tune was sagikable, but alas IR sings it and spoils it gracefully.
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Kuttaiyyai_kilarubavan (@ 202.41.117.61) on: Mon Apr 19 14:33:29 EDT 1999
  
  Mr.Kuzhapam,Ila Arun has become Illa Arun - and the gender has been changed to "He" from
  "She" - neenga nijamaavey bayangara (Mr)Kuzhappam !!
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Mon Apr 19 15:57:10 EDT 1999
  
  Mr.K,
  
  I am sorry to tell you that we (me and SM) did not appreciate Ila Arun's performance. We had rather expressed our rage aginst it. I think you have misunderdstood and have gone to a Nal(l)a - Damayanthi story :-)
  
  It is tormenting to hear DFers claiming that KK sucks more than Padaiyappa. Is the taste down a declivity ? Still, it is your opinion and I have nothing to say about it.
  
  May be the the view point has shifted from a classy to a negotiable one.
  
  
• From: Isai Piriyan (@ square.apprentice.uwaterloo.ca) on: Mon Apr 19 16:28:17 EDT 1999
  
  MS!
  I didn't compare KK and 'Padaiyappa'. I said that recent albums done by IR are just medicore. I didn't like, 'Padaiyappa', 'Jodi'. 'Kaathalar Thinam' also doesn't impress me at all.
  
  
• From: Clarify (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Mon Apr 19 16:34:52 EDT 1999
  
  

  Raveeeeeeeeeeeeee

  
  
  
  
• From: Clarify (@ webgate0.mot.com) on: Mon Apr 19 16:35:02 EDT 1999
  
  

  Raveeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!

  
  
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Mon Apr 19 16:52:55 EDT 1999
  
  Isai Priyan:
  
  I was not referring to you. I was referring to Srikanth and Mr.K.
  
  
• From: SM (@ nat01smurugap.sgum.mci.com) on: Mon Apr 19 17:45:27 EDT 1999
  
  MS,
  
  Mr.Kuzhappam kuzhappathila appadi ezhudhittaarnu ninaikkiraen. Anyway, thanks for clarifying our stand to him.
  
  
• From: eden (@ 202.54.71.150) on: Tue Apr 20 00:27:16 EDT 1999
  
  Isai Piriyan!
  Before blanketing all the recent IR albums as mediocre, why don't you please listen to the following albums calmly:
  
  a) Kaalapaani (strictly the Malaylam version)
  b) Guru (Malayalam, I got this cassette very recently after searching all the shops at Palakkad, in a dusty-non selling-outfit; I won't hesitate to include this album among all-time-greats including the master pieces of 80's from IR)
  c) Manam virumbuthe unnai
  & also d) KM (not KK)
  
  
• From: eden (@ 202.54.71.150) on: Tue Apr 20 00:32:32 EDT 1999
  
  Again Isai Piriyan,
  How many non-IR, non-Mediocre (in your opinion) albums have been released in TFM in the past 5 years? I'm afraid, despite all the hype, sat TV propaganda and media glorification, very very few!! (i.e. if you select with real musical consciousness and filter out the copies, recycles etc.)
  
  
• From: D.Srikanth (@ slip-32-101-16-38.il.us.ibm.net) on: Tue Apr 20 08:53:26 EDT 1999
  
  Guys.
  As far as IR album is concered I expect, a proper beat pattern (not using read made beat), better chord progression and arrangement. But in KK nothing is present. Raja falls into the trap of readmade beat, bass parts etc.
  
  If I book a first class ticked I expect all the services, if it is not found I am bound to comment or compare it with a second class, hope everyone here got my point. The reason I put Padaiappa songs are better in the sense, I expect more and better score from IR, which he is capable of, because of some unknown reason he is not ready to compose.
  
  (If you see padaiappa, ARR runs out of ideas at times, he did not do his best, the recording quality is poor, arrangements are jumbled etc etc, )
  I found similar things in KK, though the recording quality has improved.
  
  I cannot hear songs just bcos it came from IR., cannot drink rotton milk even though it came from "Kamadehnu".
  
  Thanks
  
  
• From: Isai Piriyan (@ square.apprentice.uwaterloo.ca) on: Tue Apr 20 09:12:04 EDT 1999
  
  eden!
  I'm talking about TFM, not MFM. So the first two are out of the list. MVU, yaa right. HH spoiled most of the songs, so does the bava. Now back to the point, why do care about the other MDs? I'm just talking about IR alone. Other MDs might be bad, it doesn't mean that IR is good. We are here talking about IR's recent album, not others's album. So, I'm not going to comment on others album. Don't just compare apple and oranges.
  
  BTW, don't just pull down other MDs leg, for the sake of promoting IR. Remember, you've once said that Shangar Ganesh is yester years Deva.
  
  
• From: chandy (@ 209.125.83.228) on: Tue Apr 20 10:33:30 EDT 1999
  
  Eden,
  
  You have listed 5 recent albums of IR after 1993. Why dont we think of the days where every album of IR was a treat to our ears? Compare IR's albums in 80s, with the number of hit-albums he gave with in recent years. Look at the proportion of the number of good-albums as a proportion of all the albums made by IR for the recent time period and compare it with what it was in 1980s... Isnt the contrast jarring???
  
  Srikanth put it aptly that he cannot consume rotten milk just because it came from kamadhenu!! when its Kamadhenu there are some great expectations, and kamadhenu needs to live up to those. If IR feels TFM doesnt suit his specific needs, let him move over to symphonies, general music albums and such stuff! He can definitely excell there and will remain a kamadhenu forever!
  
  chandy
  
  
• From: Barbers paradox :-)) (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Apr 20 10:48:28 EDT 1999
  
  IP: If one gives equal respect to all MD's, how does comparing S-G to Deva constitute an insult ?
  :-))
  
  
  
• From: Ravi (@ envy.cs.umass.edu) on: Tue Apr 20 10:54:47 EDT 1999
  
  Barber: Simple.. dEvA is not an MD. ;-). (I know I am going to regret this.. but this is the logical conclusion... so had to point it out.)
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Apr 20 11:15:37 EDT 1999
  
  And dear chandy: Srikanth was alright about kamadenu. But that logic doesnt, I repeat, doesnt give anyone licence to call slightly dilute milk from the kamadhenu as rotten just because the expectations from kamadhenu are high. That doesnt justify deriding this diluted milk in comparison to *rotten* milk from an *ordinary* cow.
  (BTW, Srikanth and chandy, since you two use that phrase with so much convciction, may I ask you what is rotten milk? :-)) ..and please dont take it as an attempt to deride your language skills ..I genuinely want to know what is rotten milk)
  
  Srikanth! If I have told you once , I have told you hundred times....for God's sake, keep off Raja-bashing. When a srikanth says something it is taken as a convenient handle by other full time raja-bashers. For example, kuzhappam used to take refuge in your statements. "I used to think annan srikanth was a hardcore rajabasher" was something he psoted somewhere. If he can get that impression, just stop and think what will be the feelings of genuine Raja fans like me, Srinath, madhan and vijay and many others. Do you want to keep hurting us just for the sake of refuting praise on Raja? If so, please continue your sevai.Ofcourse it doesnt mean a thing to me. But it reflects poorly on a musician of your atature, honestly , to pull down a fellow-musician just because otehrs praise him. It is not befitting your standards. I have no locus standi to advise you. These are just my requests.
  
  Lastly one word to the objective members of the DF... what price objectivity viz-a-viz timeperiod just as there is objectivity in terms of MD? I'll explain this in my next post. If mr.X consistently heaps praises on even obscure albums of a certain period while applying very strict standards to the latest songs(even though they may be by a MD who was active in the period that is the favourite of X)? Will not you apply your objective pirambu on them?
  
  Srinath: Finally, I am in a caffeine-dispensing frame of mind :-))).
  
  
  
• From: Raj (@ master.hyd.deshaw.com) on: Tue Apr 20 11:33:50 EDT 1999
  
  IP: If one gives equal respect to all MD's, how does comparing S-G to Deva constitute an insult ?
  :-))
  
  Assuming you practice what you preach(give respect to all MD's) either
  1) You feel Deva is inferior to S-G. Which goes against the assumption that every MD is equal IYO!
  or
  2)You have a tendency to dismiss most new songs as not of the quality that IR,CB and S-G(not to speak of M-G, Thaianban and Abavanan) produced in late 80's. In which case you are as biased as eden et al.Only, you are biased about the period as opposed to MD. The words "glass house" and "stones" cross my mind. But, for the life of me, I am unable to articulate these into the sentence I want to construct- why? :-))
  
  Ofcourse you can refute me by saying you like very old songs as well...but IMO that wont hold any water because so do we..if I am silent on the numerous old songs I like that doesnt make me an raja-obsessed ignoramus. BTW , this paragraph and the next are not addressed at you specifically...these are general points. Please read only the rest of the paragraphs as addressed at you specifically.
  
  I dont quote here the no. of cassettes etc. of I have of old songs as opposed to that of Raja - because I dont want any certificate from Raja fans or ARR fans or objective listeners. Infact I have a pathetic TWO cassettes of Raja as opposed to many of old songs. Ofcourse I am not pining to be called objective on the basis of this revealing piece of information :-))
  
  And lastly, I specifically brought up Kadhanayagan vs KK(though it is a deep insult, IMO, on KK:)) ) because I know you have a liking for many such (obscure,IMO)80's songs. It is purely a matter of taste but I would like to know how many of the objective(and when I say objective, I mean no offence, sincerely. I mean people like Udhaya et al who can be considered to be free of any bias in the form of MD, Singer, Lyricist and most importantly,Time-period too )listeners share your opinion that KK sucks in comparison to Kadhanayagan(and similar obscure albums of the 80's). Kadhanayagan had but one 'popular' song, let me remind you, poo poothathai. While a decent tune, can you speak for its interludes ? Orchestration? Finally as a melodious tune does it stand in comparison to Alai meedhu? . There you are one song vs one song and your candidate fails(I would like to have a vote on this in the DF:)). And that is the only song in your candidate that passes muster whereas KK has atleast a couple more.Any which way you look at it ,your assertion that KK sucks ICT(in comp. to) KN is a brave assertion indeed! And to those who are thinking of advising me that it is silly of me to make such an obviously poor comparison, let me point out KN is an aagu peyar for all those obscure 80's albums which IP holds dear (possibly for nostalgic reasons..ofcourse this includes a few IR albums too!). My point is why not apply the objective parameter to the time period of a song as well. Why not condemn IP as being 'biased' towards 80's songs just as I am 'biased' towards Raja songs? Not that I want him to suffer the same typecasting that Raja Fans have been subjected to. I am saying this in the hope that people will realise that bias and objectivity are subjective and to create a general impression that only Raja fans are biased is itself not objectivity. Bias exists in other forms , such as lanuage and as in this case, timeperiod, too.
  
  Udhaya sir, a specific question here to you. I remember that once you specifically asked for the links to OTTAM as opposed to DAUD because you wanted the songs in Tamil. Is that not 'bias'? Is that not lack of objectivity? Afterall music is music. Isaikku mozhi illai? I have no vested interest in drawing you into a controversy but I felt that this is a very valid question to ask you. Please dont mistake me as trying to demean you. Ofcourse you can say that you need to have meaningful lyrics in order to enjoy a song, so you cant enjoy enjoy Hindi Songs. I have two pints to make on this:
  1. Just as you need good lyrics, I and Raja fans, generally, need good orchestration and interludes and arrangements that describe the emotions of the characters and the situation. What lyrics are to you, these factors are to me. Hence I dismiss songs which lack in this factor as not of the kind I'll listen to . How does that make me biased? Either both of us are biased or neither of us is? :-)).( Again, let me make it clear, I dont want a certificate but I want you to think of this viewpoint as well). And I addressed you specifically because I believe if anyone can, you can address these issues clearly and lucidly, with a straight mind. Please dont misinterpret me as trying to unnecesarily draw you into this argument, which I know you dont relish. This once, I need your specific views here. I suppose we two can walk through this without feeling the 'stench' and the 'garbage'? :-))
  
  2. In my excited state of mind, I have forgotten the second point I had in my mind when I mentioned " two points to make" a few lines ago ;-)))
  Oops!
  I have run out of coffee-powder at this point ,srinath. Wait till I replenish my stocks :-)))
  
  
• From: Isai Piriyan (@ library.uwaterloo.ca) on: Tue Apr 20 11:40:21 EDT 1999
  
  Barbers paradox :-))
  You don't know the whole stroy. Do you? This what I wrote about.
  Do you want to know the whole story? Perhaps, you don't need it. -:-))))
  
  Raj:
  Can you explain, what is verty strict standard?
  In 80s, many of the MDs provided really good songs, be they SG, IR or CB. Such a good piece of works. I like music, not the MDs. I don't care where it's coming from, but a good one. I still firmly believe, 80's is the golden period for IR. That's it. Can you list any IR's album achieved platinum status, during the past 5-6 years. Don't just say that people's taste has been changed over the years. The same people continued like IR's music for a such a long period of time. Remember, 'Punnagai Mannan' was different at that time, and it was a big hit. Perhaps IR cannot provide a really good album now a days. I've listened all the albums recently released and none of them impressed me at all. IR's style is completely changed over the past 5 years? why?
  
  IR, didn't change his style about 13 years, all of a sudden there is a change? Why? After that, none of the album wasn't that hit either. Don't just bring other MDs in this issue. I'm not talking about Deva, ARR, VS or any other MDs.
  
  

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