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Raga of song please

Topic started by Gopal Prasad (@ greed.cs.umass.edu) on Sat May 17 07:42:45 EDT 1997.
All times in EDT +9:30 for IST.

Note: You may want to refer to the list of raga based film songs before posting a query.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Wed Mar 24 15:28:35 EST 1999
  
  Questions for the knowledgebales out here,
  What are the raags for the foll. songs ?
  1.NaaLaam NaaLaam thirunaaLam"(movie:Kathilakka neramillai)
  2. Manaivi amaivathellaam (manmatha Leelai)
  3. Lilly malarukku kondaattam (U.Su.vaaliban)
  4. Radha Kaathal varaadha (Naan avan Illai)
  
  I guess the raag has not been resolved for song no.2 yet.
  
  Geetha had posted elsewhere that "VaNNa nilave" was in Chandra Kauns. How is it so ? If so, is "Nalam Vaazha ennaaLum" in the same Raag ?
  
  
  
• From: rama (@ 166.37.14.241) on: Wed Mar 24 16:56:41 EST 1999
  
  I want to know the raga for the song "Vanna nilavae vanna nilavae varuvadhu needhaana", from movie ninaithen vandhai. For me it sounds similar to "mere rangnae rangnae vaali pari ho ya ho pariyon ki rani" from maine pyaar kiya, which i think was a lift from a famous piano tune. could somebody explain
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Wed Mar 24 18:29:21 EST 1999
  
  SL,
  
  thanks. But the link does not work. Can you help ?
  
  
  
• From: Vasu (@ 63.white-plains-03-04rs16rt.ny.dial-access.att.net) on: Wed Mar 24 21:51:34 EST 1999
  
  Murali:
  Gambhira nattai: janya of chalanattai (mela 36);
  s g m p n s+; s+ n p m g s
  
  Thilang: same pattern, but janya of harikambhoji. they differ only by Ni.
  
  Jog: I dont know. Need to find.
  
  Sriram Lakshman:
  I am not sure whether GN is equiv. of Thilang, i will keep my eyes n ears open.
  
  Well, nAlAm nAlAm sounds like thilang. dunno bout others.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Wed Mar 24 23:24:34 EST 1999
  
  Vasu,
  
  I use the following notation:
  
  S R1 R2 G1 G2 M1 M2 P D1 D2 N1 N2 S
  
  thanks. you have said that "Innum ennai" is in GN. As per my observation, the sharp "N2" has been used right from "Innum ennai" to the middle of the charanam. But I find the clear usage of "N1" when the last line of the second stanza comes. It reads:
  
  "M P N P M P N P M P N P M P N2 P S"
  
  It is probably this which had confused me. please correct if I am wrong. Also one characteristic of Jog, I have noticed is the usage of all the swaras that come in chala naattai. the prayogam seems to be
  
  "N2 S N1 P M1 G2 M1 G1 S"
  
  All these are inferred from my own observations on "Smara varam" and Pramadhavanam. Another eg as Ramaswamy Gireesan says for Jog is "Metti oli" - a beautiful number from IR.
  
  
• From: Unni (@ sable.soc.staffs.ac.uk) on: Thu Mar 25 05:35:58 EST 1999
  
  Sriram: I'm new and have been reading for a while I think that Geetha said that Vanna Nilave had some Chandra Kauns in it. I saw what she meant, the song seems to be Sivaranjani, with the THEME music of the film, which has humming by female voice in Chandrakauns which appears in all the songs(even Manisha Manisha), like the Neelambari does in two En Swasa Katre songs.
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Thu Mar 25 12:07:09 EST 1999
  
  Vasu,
  That was mentioned in the site I had referred to in my previous posting. This Raaga business drives a person nuts sometimes. I have a reference book which states that Carnatic Tilang is the same as Hindustani Tilang.
  
  MS,
  As Vasu mentioned, Tilang and G Nattai
  (according to your notations) should have the foll. pattern.
  Tilang : S G2 M1 P N1 S
  G.Nattai : S G2 M1 P N2 S
  I personally did not come accross any usage of N1 in "Innum ennai".
  I tried playing "Pramadavanam vendum" last night and I too ended up with the same swara patterns as Chala Nattai. Probably what I said in my earlier posting is true, Jog is its Hindustani equivalent. Maybe the gamakams differ.
  
  I had stated that "Maadathile" could be in G.Nattai. It is not so, but definitely a Janya of Chalanattai.
  
  Ar : SGMPDS
  Av: SDPMGRS
  
  "R" comes in only in the line "Madisaarazhagi Vaadi Sivagami". Can you tell me what Raag this is in.
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Thu Mar 25 12:12:05 EST 1999
  
  MS, I accessed the site. Here is a cut and paste of the comparison list.
  Carnataka Kalyani is handled as Yaman in Hindustani
  Carnataka Thodi as Bhairavi in Hindustani
  Mohanam as Bhoopali
  Hindolam as Malkauns
  Sankarabharanam as Bilawal etc.,
  Subha Pantuvarali as Thodi
  Chakravakam as Ahir Bhairav
  Devagandari as Bhimplasi
  Madhyamavathi as Brindavan Saarang
  Saaranga as Hamir
  Suddha Saveri as Durga
  Nata Bhairavi as Asavari
  Sahaana as JeyJeyvanti
  Dharmavathi as Madhuvanthi
  Hamsanandhi as Marwa
  Pantuvarali as Purvi
  Mayamalavagowlai as Bhairav
  Harikamboji as Khamaaj
  Karaharapriya as Kafi
  Gambeera Nata as Tillang
  -----------------------------------------
  Valaji as Kalavathi
  Mukhaari as Jonpuri
  
  This is said to have been compiled by Nithayshree Mahadevan.
  Hope this will help.
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Thu Mar 25 12:18:34 EST 1999
  
  Vasu,
  Naalam....has too many other swarams too which are consistently used like (going by MS's notations) , G1 and D2 etc. So do the others songs I have mentioned.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Thu Mar 25 23:14:39 EST 1999
  
  RR,
  
  You had once given a link to the rags and notes. Can you help with that once again ?
  
  SL,
  
  If RR gives the link I have requested most of our doubts will be cleared.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Thu Mar 25 23:20:56 EST 1999
  
  Sl,
  
  Another query regarding HFM. If somebody objects, I prefer discussing it in hub.
  
  Tere mere sapne - I feel it is in desh. The usage of N1 and N2 are completely similar to desh. Comments ?
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Fri Mar 26 11:39:34 EST 1999
  
  MS, are you referring to "Tere Mere Sapne ab ek rang hai" sung by Mohd. Rafi ?
  Please confirm.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Fri Mar 26 11:47:02 EST 1999
  
  Yes, SL
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Sat Mar 27 14:34:26 EST 1999
  
  MS,
  In the first line itself I think M2 is being used and later somewhere too. It is not Desh. The song does not seem to sound like Desh too.Similarly, MSV's "Androru NaaLile Iravil" was also said to be based on Desh, which I do not agree with. This song also uses M1 and M2.
  
  If need be, I will E-mail the notes that I ended up with and we could compare notes.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Sat Mar 27 22:41:30 EST 1999
  
  Sure, I look forward to it. I do not find M2 in the song. It reads:
  
  te(M1) re(P) me(P) re(N1)
  
  
  Then the appropriate "deshi" usage of N2 comes. But I have suddenly started doubting if it is in Kamaj. I heard "Tere mere milan ki yeh raina" is set in Kamaj. I see great similarities between both. please correct if I am wrong.
  
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Sun Mar 28 07:01:34 EST 1999
  
  Sriram/Rama: "Geetha had posted elsewhere that "VaNNa nilave" was in Chandra Kauns. How is it so ? If so, is "Nalam Vaazha ennaaLum" in the same Raag ? "
  
  Unni has answered this - Unni, you're not THE
  
  P Unnikrishnan are you?. I know he surfs from time to time......
  
  Sorry for this delayed reply, Vanna Nilave is basically in Sivaranjani, but what the MD did(well, I think that Deva lifted most of it from Maragathamani) is that he put a humming bit in all the songs, with CHANDRAKAUNS in it. I believe that Azlagu Malar Aaada from Vaidhehi Kaathirundhaal is in Chandrakauns, I'm not sure about Nalam Vaalha.
  
  For this difference b/w Thilang and the rest, does this info. help?
  
  Azlagu Malar Aaadum Niaithaaladi(from a Vijaykaanth/Amala starer) is in Thilang, as is Abinaya Sundhari from Mirudanga Chakaravatthi.
  
  Jog is confusing, as it takes Anya swaras to Thilang, I believe, as it's a Hindustani Ragam, and these have a lot of extra notes, unlike Pure Carnatic Ragas....
  
  If any of you have Raga Pravaham, please look up the Ragas, I haven't got it on me, but if SL or MS can please try and do some notation, particularly on the Alzaga Kazllaga song, it would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance.
  
  
• From: Geetha (@ gatekeeper.oracle.co.uk) on: Sun Mar 28 07:01:43 EST 1999
  
  Sriram/Rama: "Geetha had posted elsewhere that "VaNNa nilave" was in Chandra Kauns. How is it so ? If so, is "Nalam Vaazha ennaaLum" in the same Raag ? "
  
  Unni has answered this - Unni, you're not THE
  P Unnikrishnan are you?. I know he surfs from time to time......
  
  Sorry for this delayed reply, Vanna Nilave is basically in Sivaranjani, but what the MD did(well, I think that Deva lifted most of it from Maragathamani) is that he put a humming bit in all the songs, with CHANDRAKAUNS in it. I believe that Azlagu Malar Aaada from Vaidhehi Kaathirundhaal is in Chandrakauns, I'm not sure about Nalam Vaalha.
  
  For this difference b/w Thilang and the rest, does this info. help?
  
  Azlagu Malar Aaadum Niaithaaladi(from a Vijaykaanth/Amala starer) is in Thilang, as is Abinaya Sundhari from Mirudanga Chakaravatthi.
  
  Jog is confusing, as it takes Anya swaras to Thilang, I believe, as it's a Hindustani Ragam, and these have a lot of extra notes, unlike Pure Carnatic Ragas....
  
  If any of you have Raga Pravaham, please look up the Ragas, I haven't got it on me, but if SL or MS can please try and do some notation, particularly on the Alzaga Kazllaga song, it would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance.
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ ifmxlenx.na.informix.com) on: Sun Mar 28 16:57:02 EST 1999
  
  MS,
  Kamaj is nothing but Carnatic HariKambhoji.I will E-mail you tomorrow morning.
  
  Geetha, new Tamil cassettes are really hard to come by where I am staying. I am having a tough time adding to my collection. Hence all this delay. Another question, in books like
  Ragapravaham, you do not come accross ragas which have N1 and N2 or D1 and D2 etc.
  MS in his earlier posting said that Desh has N1 as well as N2. How many such raagas are there and what is the best source of info for such raagas?
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Sun Mar 28 19:55:56 EST 1999
  
  Did I do a mistake ? I think I meant kamaz (Bro cheva yevarura) and wrote Kamaj.
  
  SL,
  
  Konjam paadip paarungaLEn. You can find a lot of similarity between Brocheva, tere mere milan ki and tere mere sapne..
  
  reg rags which have N1 and N2. Theoretically infinite. But the rags I know are:
  
  (1) Brindavana saranga
  (2) Many varieties of chalanattai
  (3) Desh
  (4) Kapi
  (5) Anadha bhairavi (?)
  
  I do not remember now if I know more like these. But these are the most familiar. Kapi and anandha bhairavi have G1, G2, D1, D2 prayoga as well.
  
  Geetha,
  I think we need to sort out the differences on Jog, kapi etc.. Can you plase explain what you mean by notes ? Let me see if I can be of some help.
  
  
  
  
  
  

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