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ALAVANDHAAN - fails miserably?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Topic started by abhinetri (@ 202.56.193.250) on Tue Nov 13 21:04:29 EST 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

This 'so-called' film critic from REDIFF.COM says 'ABHAY' (Hindi Version of ALAVANDHAAN' is a crap movie. The link is given below...
http://www.rediff.com/entertai/2001/nov/13abhay.htm

How crucial was 'music' a crucial factor for a film like ALAVANDHAAN?

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: WhyNot (@ 203.24.100.137) on: Tue Dec 18 01:21:14 EST 2001
  
  tigger, can't agree with u more.
  >>so when the heroine uses an Americanism (I think it is) like "do you mind??" to express displeasure it comes across as artificial, especially when there is no proper inflection/emphasis in her voice. Kamal’s accent too has started getting to be irritating in his movies<<
  It was so superficial and prententious.
  
  Bharath, u talk about social workers and social problems, but u fail to see that in this movie, kamal was not showing the negative consequences of sex at the wrong time (which i think every sexually active couple wud know), but rather glamourising it. I'm sure social workers don't want that.
  
  >>but arent we the same people who started caste system! encouraged sati, illtreated women and indluged in stupid superstitions like sticking glowing iron rods across your face and walking on smouldering coal.<<
  This is like saying, hey I've been a chain smoker and an alcoholic all this while. So I was probably wrong in avoiding drugs.
  U can't pinpoint at our past mistakes to argue that all that's been in the culture is wrong. I agree with tigger that the Indian culture and social norms are just simply different and kamal shud learn to respect that.
  
  
• From: neutral_fan (@ 202.88.152.159) on: Tue Dec 18 01:31:31 EST 2001
  
  helo, Bharath...r u around? waiting patiently for ur reply...
  
  
• From: neutral_fan (@ 202.88.152.159) on: Tue Dec 18 02:35:44 EST 2001
  
  in the meantime, coming back to you dearest & loveable whynot
  
  <<...but u fail to see that in this movie, kamal was not showing the negative consequences of sex at the wrong time..>> Why would he, for god's sake, have to show that? The story is not about "pre marital pregnancy & the gruelling aftermath", is it?
  
  <<..tigger, can't agree with u more about the issue of heroine using an Americanism (I think it is) like "do you mind??" to express displeasure, ..it comes across as artificial..>> When Richard Attenborough's Gandhi potrayed Indian characters speaking Americanistic slang (GANDHI inclusive), it is considered OK, but Indians just cannot use Americanistic slang, is that it? That only shows an "INTROVERT-COLOUR CONSCIOUS-TIMID" mentality, that miserably feels that it has unlawfully "COPIED" something that is purely reserved only for the Americans..What the heck? There is no PATENTED entity called AMERICANISM..(By the way, RAVEENA is a STAR TV anchor and a Delhi gal, so sophistication is not out of place, is it?)
  
  <<..I agree with tigger that the Indian culture and social norms are just simply different and kamal shud learn to respect that...>> Hah, KAMAL should learn eh? Dearest & Loveable Hun,...u see a pierce brosnan intimate scene, it is OK with u..u see SEAN CONNERY getting dirty & naughty, it is still OK with u...but when u see KAMAL, u cannot stand it...Don't u think that even before KAMAL has tried anything to damage your CULTURE, half naked Brosnans & Sean Connerys have already damaged it secretively ? In the year 1997, only two movies went successfully..one was MAHANADHI (that gripping ANTI CHILD-PROSTITUTION story) and another was...well take a guess...RASIGAN (That vile VIJAY starrer, that was horribly SEXUAL in content)...That speaks volumes on the double standards of the society.Can we cut this crap?
  
  
• From: neutral_fan (@ 202.88.152.159) on: Tue Dec 18 02:59:19 EST 2001
  
  <<...btw, wud u have any idea wat ur ascendancy/rising and moon signs might be? (jus being a nosy aquarian) :-)...>> Why doen't u exercise your extremely gifted AQUARIAN intuition, dearest & loveable WHYNOT? ;-)
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue Dec 18 12:50:49 EST 2001
  
  neutral fan,
  
  i believe from your postings i have understood the movie better than you! :-) (seriously)
  
  please dont read too much into the movie and also please dont bring in concepts that kamal himself does not know!
  
  I have posted the real reason why the cartoon was shown! please chek old responses.
  
  your babble about +ve and -ve szcizophrenia is a load of bull crap. comes from expanding the cow dung that the alleged doctor threw at us in the movie....
  
  comes from an assumption that you have understood the movie better than anyone else on the planet.
  
  Look this is the bottom line. If Kamal or the movie doesnt say so I'll safely assume it doesnt exist. Reading between the lines also needs to obviousness in a movie.. otherwise it might lead to various contorte theories about what the movie said. Since kamal and the movie didnt talk abot a +/- scizophreniac I'll assume he didnt think it existed.
  
  all your questions indicate again that you think you were only the only one who understood the movie. I am sure you have some long winded answers that were never shown in the movie at all and hence all answers will be your theories.
  
  Those theories of yours have been formed because you liked the movie like hell even b4 it started and no matter whatever hell crap was thrown at you you still liked it.
  
  as far as this movie is concerned there is no subjectiveness.
  
  A trite story line of step children beng ill-treated (from the days of rajinis padikathavan)
  
  The word " delusional scizo bla bal" being mentioned 1'ce and a doctor giving an interview in star TV abt a mental asyllum inamte for 30 secs is all that is there to it in the movie to describe your scizophreniac.
  
  as far execution is concerned. The only idea that was good was kamal acting as a psycopath. The execution in terms of
  
  1) step mother story
  2) mindless car chase scenes etc
  3) an entire plot that simply revolves killing raveena and that concept conveniently forgotten in the climax....
  
  are load of crap.. i have analyzed tis in prev postings of mine and also abt the cartoon scenes..
  
  Dude! dont explain to me whats not in the movie... explain for what is there. thats enough!
  I have had my share of crazy fans trying ever so hard to justify their hero's work!
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue Dec 18 12:54:55 EST 2001
  
  neutral fan,
  
  here is an extract from some old responses 1 from karthik and one from me... read it... and plz understand that we also undertood the movie..
  
  From: Karthik S (@ 164.164.82.29) on: Mon Dec 3 01:47:46 EST 2001
  
  
  Brijesh:
  
  The Animated sequence were specifically created to tone down the depiction of violent scenes. Kamal/Suresh Krishna have flicked the concept of using animation to this effect from the Oliver Stone movie 'Natural Born Killers'!
  
  
  
  From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Mon Dec 3 16:18:03 EST 2001
  
  
  my opinions abt aalavandhan...
  
  see the 2nd half of the movie... it has no dialogue after "anbulla diary.." sequence and its has kamal chasing the other kamal like an ape without any logic...and for no reason decides he has failed and commits suicide.
  
  if kamal thinks he is bringing out the randomness of a mental case ...sorry we dont think so... we think its the randomness of the director and kamal..in running out of ideas and coming up with a 2nd half that is NOT a continuation of the first half but some stupid sequence of events that makes no sense....
  
  BIG MISTAKES:
  1) cartoon sequence: kamal! what were u thinking.. its extremely difficult to fuse cartoon-movie . I quote from oliver stone's interview i saw once .The concept involves the viewer being made to think he is seeing a harmless bit of imaginary cartoon and when reality is shown...the viewer must be genuinly surprised that manisha is dead and must be aghast once he thinks back the cartoon sequnce and transalates it to reality...
  
  there was no deception in this case and we fully knew 2 hrs b4 that manisha wud die... and we ended up thinking the cartoon sequence was put in to avoid A certificate...
  
  2) Jumping on the baloon that too twice.. what were u thinking...
  
  3) whats with the ape liking beating on the chest and chasing on car scooter lorry (driving the car with legs)
  
  4) dual language... any movie with a solid story and screen play will run in any language irrespective of the cast. In order to make it hindi compatible (or vice versa) u have reduced close-up shots and dialogues... not to mention story and narrative content..."naan bommai pakka varalai.. kathaiya sollunga " kathalam pola irukku
  
  this is one time where a megalomaniac overshadowed kamalahaasan!
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue Dec 18 13:31:27 EST 2001
  
  why not,
  
  how can u be sure that tthis equalant of kamal showing sex scenes is like Drugs and not the equalant of our cultures past mistakes.
  
  
  
• From: tigger (@ 205.219.204.23) on: Tue Dec 18 16:41:23 EST 2001
  
  << Kamal is a dheergadharsi! >>
  
  What is a dheergadharsi?
  
  << who is to say what is wrong in this contantly changing world. Who are you to dictate to kamal and others what is correct for culture. >>
  < 1) do u become an BAD person by sitting in movies which have simple flying kisses ?
  >>
  << Well! it is true we have conciously avooided discussing sex in the outside because it was considered private/sacred/holy but arent we the same people who started caste system! encouraged sati, illtreated women and indluged in stupid superstitions like sticking glowing iron rods across your face and walking on smouldering coal. >>
  
  Bharat,
  I am not dictating. this thing is very subjective. It is just a point of where do we draw the line, and everyone, including me is entitled to his/her opinion. I feel that it is OK to show a flying kiss on screen. Maybe my grandmother would be outraged at it. I draw the line at discussing one's sexual activities on screen. You obviously dont. I was critisizing Kamal because he is an entertainer and there is nothing wrong with telling him what I like and dont like about his acting.
  
  just because some of the things our forefathers did were wrong doesn't mean everything they did was wrong. You throw in examples that any decent person would say is wrong and try to club in sexual modesty along with them. I dont see the connection. Are you saying that feeling uncomfortable talking about sex in public, modesty etc. are something to be uneqivocally condemned? Your other examples are.
  
  
  
  
  <<..tigger, can't agree with u more about the issue of heroine using an Americanism (I think it is) like "do you mind??" to express displeasure, ..it comes across as artificial..>>
  
  << When Richard Attenborough's Gandhi potrayed Indian characters speaking Americanistic slang (GANDHI inclusive), it is considered OK, but Indians just cannot use Americanistic slang, is that it? That only shows an "INTROVERT-COLOUR CONSCIOUS-TIMID" mentality, that miserably feels that it has unlawfully "COPIED" something that is purely reserved only for the Americans..What the heck? There is no PATENTED entity called AMERICANISM..(By the way, RAVEENA is a STAR TV anchor and a Delhi gal, so sophistication is not out of place, is it?)
  >>
  
  Easy there neutral fan. I am not saying Indians should not copy Americans, merely saying if you do copy, do it right, else it sticks out like a sore thumb. If Raveena had taken the effort to study American slang I would have been happy.
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 192.25.158.12) on: Tue Dec 18 16:56:50 EST 2001
  
  neutral fan,
  
  Manisha and kamalhaasan were doing a lot of american slang... yes it does stick out like a sore thumb because it NOT good!
  
  it looks very artificial and its the moral equalant of indians in US trying to put american accent with other indians... oru local party kitta innoru local party enna peela vidalattam!
  
  kamalhaasan a mental asylum inmate for arnd 20 years has little chance to pick up american english... which if you go by criminal asylum standards in delhi that are only marginally better than tihar jail he should have forgotten how to talk...
  
  stereo typing such critisism as a lack of self esteem on us colored people is not wise. its better to use phrases and expressions natural to oneself.
  
  kamalhaasan assumes (for a long time) that some of best expressions are better done in english... he did the same stupidity in guruthipunal with his "breaking point" rhetoric... and this is no different!
  
  I guess it comes from watching too much english movies and getting too enthued about it. His devar magan and nayagan didnt have these extravaganza still it did well! its the style attempts like kalaignan and alavandhan that dont gel well!
  
  he must remember that story and narrative content is important!
  
  
  
  
  

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