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Ever since ARR entered into the cine field; 2 bad things have happenned

Topic started by naga (@ 209.47.143.226) on Mon Mar 18 15:22:53 EST 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Even since ARR entered into the cine field in 1992 (Was Roja released in 1991 or 92?), 2 worse things have happenned:

1.He was the one who introduced the use of drum machine (samplers) just to be different from IR and other MDs at that time. He wanted to be different to stay in the field and so created songs with a heave influence of western instruments. Being a 'sound engineer' he managed to be successful and now everybody is following him and calling it the 'trend'. He replaced the 'beauty of orchestration' with this new tread.. No catchy tunes, not so great melodies but just rythm... that's the secret of success...and he knew that. Our youngsters fell for it bcos it was different for them. All of us know that majority of young boys and girls listen to western music just for the rythm and for the quality of sound. They can't even understand the meaning of song and of course they don't need to... infact most of the engilsh songs have no lyrical value... That's exactly what ARR wanted to do... why listen to english beats when I can reproduce the same in tamil movies ???! Right...and that's what he did.. very clever and for this he didn't need to have carnatic music knowledge.. He started violating all the ragas, mixing and matching.. did everything.. (ennavae adi ennavale - a good example of killing 'kedharam' -- funny thing is that unni krishnan got national award for that song)...

It's 10 years now and ARR is still in the industry..charging crores of rupees for each movie, made 100 times the money that IR, MSV have made in their career with genuine music...

Where are we going with this 'tread'...... all songs sound the same...Any song can fit into any movie and for any situation...

2. And the second worst thing that has happened is 'tamizh kolai'. After ARR, now anybody can sing.. no need to know the language. Just sing and ARR will adjust it while recording.. what a shame to 'tamizh mozhi'. ARR is the one who started it. Can anyone deny that? Before that singers had some respect. Just listen to SPB, N.Vasudevan, TMS for their 'tamizh ucharippu'. No wonder why MSV and IR kept on giving using them..

Well I do appreaciate that ARR introduced a lot of new singers but how many can speak 'tamizh'. Can ARR justify what he has done to TFM ?

MSV, KVM and IR composed music for the song. ARR composes song for the music and that's the difference. And that's why we can't listen to any new songs after few months... one bad song will replace another bad song..

If this trend goes for another few more years... 'tamizh mozhi' will find a place in the history...

These are some of the 'tamil kolai seidha padalgal'...

chikku bukky raile.. (ARR)
andha arabi kadaloram (ARR)
poovukku porandha nalu (praveen mani) -- only God can help
all songs in parthale paravasam (ARR)

and a lot more... I don't remember them all..
Can anyone add such songs here??

please note that I do like ARR for many good reasons but I cannot forgive him for the above two bad things he did, knowingly or unknowingly to the TFM...

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Isai Priyan (@ 157.95.211.50) on: Tue Mar 19 09:46:14 EST 2002
  
  naga:
  I suppose I don't have to answer your quey anymore, I think Karthik S had been in my shoes to answer your query.
  BTW, I was about to answer another point in your topic:"He started violating all the ragas, mixing and matching.. did everything.. "
  Friend:If you are aware Film music is all about breaking the rules if there is any...
  I can quote as many examples as you want from the earlier MDs right from the days of GR where there has been an unorthodox use of the ragas in TFM.They are justified for the sake of cinema.After 50 years here is someone who realises that and puts the blame on ARR, how childish?!!!
  If you go to rajangahm.com, there is a interview peice by IR in which he says there is no rules as such in Carnatic music and that he has broken the rules and made many violations in his compositions..he even quotes beethoven on this issue as"rules are my humble servants"
  So naga there is absolutely no point in taking about wrong or unusual or illegal use of ragas.And for your info ARR knows carnatic music and is pretty knowledgable.
  
  
• From: naga (@ 209.47.143.226) on: Tue Mar 19 10:18:33 EST 2002
  
  wow! so many responses while I was away....
  unfortunately I can't respond to all messages here...but I will try
  
  Roftl: tabla is our instrument. we invented it.
  It's one of the best instruments ever invented and it's certainly better than a 'drum pad' which makes different sounds. You want to espape from that.. fine with me.. Then what is that 'variety' you are talking about?
  
  Mr Kumar:I am not mad. Please read my original message in the thread.. first of all I didn't say ARR is a bad MD. He did change the TFM for sure; for bad and for good. IR's sons(and many others) are following him because it's a question of survival for them...
  
  Mr O: I repeat..Read my original message in this thread. I can't write a long text book with facts to defend what I say. If you are really happy with ARR's 'tamizh sevai' in TFM then go ahead and praise him.
  
  Mr DirtyHarry: I can understand that you like western world as you are so proud to call yourself dirtyharry.. If tamil is not your language then you probably don't understand my concern in this thread... Guys like DirtyHarry can't understand what I am talking about.. ARR attracted many youngsters and that's exactly what I said in the thread. Maybe I don't see what everybody else is seeing...but I am one of those millions of people who can't tolerate 'tamizh' being killed in TFM and I hold ARR fully responsible for it.
  
  Karthik S: Music has a grammer. If you feel ARR has the right to change it then I don't have anything to say.. Let him change it, call it as innovative and sell it for millions. You say IR has changed the pattern before.. Can you give an example? Even if IR did that, I will blame him too..
  
  Mr ARR FAN: I don't represent all 'tamilians'. I love tamizh. Before ARR, singers took a lot of care to pronounce tamil words properly. ARR changed that. If you say that is innovation or novelty.. I have nothing to tell you..
  btw: are you saying that tamilians never progressed? that's so funny..
  
  Finally:I know this discussion or argument, whatever it is, can go on for ever.... There are hundreds of threads like going around..
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Dirtyharry (@ 150.131.113.127) on: Tue Mar 19 13:12:38 EST 2002
  
  Naga,
  
  I sympathize with your "tamizh" sentiments and ur refreshingly broad outlook on TFM and music as a whole, but would just like to let u know that it would be pretty wierd to change my name to "Azhiku_harry" :)
  
  [quote]Guys like DirtyHarry can't understand what I am talking about[/quote]
  In retrospect i think most of the people can't either
  
  [quote]Maybe I don't see what everybody else is seeing[quote]
  is that an understatement?..or did u say too much Naga?? NOM :)
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Dirtyharry (@ 150.131.113.127) on: Tue Mar 19 13:14:47 EST 2002
  
  pardon me for those embarassing quote unqoutes....just began venturing into HTML...but i guess u got the point :)
  
  
  
• From: Premku (@ 202.188.229.202) on: Tue Mar 19 13:24:45 EST 2002
  
  Well, after reading all the comments post above, i juz wanna say something to "naga". u mentioned tht ARR has done 2 bad things tht has altered the sound of indian music ever since he entered the TFM industry. well .. wat do u think about Deva ? i suppose if ARR wasnt in this industry .. it would have been Deva (since he has been around during IR's time) doing this typical things such as modifying English tunes & inserting tamil lyrics or maybe KR or YSR who enjoys adding Latin & Mexican beats into tamil songs.
  
  and about the intro of new singers which is killing the tamizh language .. well .. this all depends on how well a MD can make the best of the singers. For example (im not critizing any MDs here) Sukvinder Singh for 12B (jothi nerainchavva),Poovellam Kettupar(CBI Enggae) Navin for Unnai Thedi (Kattraga Varravaya). as far im concerned, ARR is the only MD after IR who brings out the best of the singers & coordinates their voice & talents properly. if it was for him, we will still be listening to SPB, KJ, Mano for eva and eva & not Hariharan, Balram, Unnikrishnan, Sreenivas and the list goes on.
  
  one thing for sure, if the changes didnt take place when ARR entered the TFM, we would most probably be having another MD to blame it on for sure !!!
  
  
• From: Premkumar (@ 202.188.229.202) on: Tue Mar 19 13:24:53 EST 2002
  
  Well, after reading all the comments post above, i juz wanna say something to "naga". u mentioned tht ARR has done 2 bad things tht has altered the sound of indian music ever since he entered the TFM industry. well .. wat do u think about Deva ? i suppose if ARR wasnt in this industry .. it would have been Deva (since he has been around during IR's time) doing this typical things such as modifying English tunes & inserting tamil lyrics or maybe KR or YSR who enjoys adding Latin & Mexican beats into tamil songs.
  
  and about the intro of new singers which is killing the tamizh language .. well .. this all depends on how well a MD can make the best of the singers. For example (im not critizing any MDs here) Sukvinder Singh for 12B (jothi nerainchavva),Poovellam Kettupar(CBI Enggae) Navin for Unnai Thedi (Kattraga Varravaya). as far im concerned, ARR is the only MD after IR who brings out the best of the singers & coordinates their voice & talents properly. if it was for him, we will still be listening to SPB, KJ, Mano for eva and eva & not Hariharan, Balram, Unnikrishnan, Sreenivas and the list goes on.
  
  one thing for sure, if the changes didnt take place when ARR entered the TFM, we would most probably be having another MD to blame it on for sure !!!
  
  
• From: Music Follower (@ 161.181.53.10) on: Tue Mar 19 15:48:00 EST 2002
  
  Naga, I sympathise with you for being so ignorant.
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 19 15:57:38 EST 2002
  
  "Innovation" (the scientific, everyday R&D that goes on in labs) without a commitment to previous standards of excellence (however commercial they may be)in what makes a "song," -- namely, singing and lyrics -- soon begins to look like a sad ego-trip. It doesn't really matter who the musician is.
  
  
• From: arun_uk (@ 195.93.50.172) on: Tue Mar 19 19:32:57 EST 2002
  
  Irrespective of various " bad things"(courtesy Naga)......one's got to understand that ARR is immensely talented and 'innovative'(sorry about stealing this word from your previous thread Naaz). It is important to recognize and appreciate his achievement in TFM & beyond.
  
  
• From: arun_uk (@ 195.93.50.172) on: Tue Mar 19 19:34:01 EST 2002
  
  Irrespective of various " bad things"(courtesy Naga)......one's got to understand that ARR is immensely talented and 'innovative'(sorry about stealing this word from your previous thread Naaz). It is important to recognize and appreciate his achievement in TFM & beyond.
  
  

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