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IR or ARR

Topic started by M.Anand (@ ihproxy1.proxy.lucent.com) on Tue Jan 18 01:03:04 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

hi all, I am Anand from bangalore and a new visitor to the tfm page. I am a great fan of both ARR and IR. I browsed through all the earlier threads on ARR and IR. It seems to me that there are quite a few anti ARRs out here.

Let me tell you something about IRs music. IRs music became popular and sounded different because he tried to bring in a westernization of Carnatic ragas in his songs. Even a dappanguthu was in Lathaangi or sivaranjani. That actually made the difference. Otherwise he is no great MD. One might argue that such a westernization or incorporation of a carnatic raga in a dappanguthu or jazz is something that demands great applause. But IR doesn't deserve that because, if u say u are tuning a song in a particular raagam, you have to bring out the nuances, the laya and bhaava of the raagam in to the song. Just traversing the swaras in the raagam here and there does not mean that u have tuned a song in that raagam. Ilayaraaja has done just that, a mere traversal through the swaras. In many places, there were apaswaras also. ARR has tuned very few songs based on Carnatic ragas but they were classics. For example Mettu podu in Anjali is a beautiful song in Ananda Bhairavi. He has brought out every nuance of the raagam in that song. Minsaara Kanna in padaiyappa is an excellent piece in vasantha. En mel vizhunda mazhai tuliye is again a beautiful piece in kaapi. A real mix of the east and west. That is what u call fusion. Ilayaraaja boasts of having composed songs in rare raagas like chala nattai, kanakangi etc. For example pani vizhum malar vanam in chala nattai is again a pure note traversal. There was no attempt to bring out the nuances in the raaga. So IR knew how to make songs sound good but ARR gives a fine polish to each and every one of his songs. IR composed music for 700 odd films. Hey Ram is his 785th film. Considering 7 songs per movie, he has tuned almost 5500 songs. Huge number indeed but hardly 5% of those songs are listenable others are 100% pure junk. But 99.9% of ARRs songs are listenable and they are also good numbers. What do you say about this?

Regards,
Anand

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Fri Oct 20 16:20:02 EDT 2000
  
  Observer,
  
  I think ARR has composed for about 50 films.There is no point in comparing the quantity of songs.
  
  I can give you another quantitative comparison.If you consider the total number of cassettes sold I'm sure there would be more number of ARR cassettes sold than IR cassettes.Isn't that very interesting considering between 50 and 793 films?
  
  Don't forget ARR is still not out and going places?And his best is yet to come.
  
  Sridhar,
  
  In my opinion my fav ARR album is "Uyire" and fav IR album is "Idhaya Kovil".May be we should compare these two.
  
  Trend
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Fri Oct 20 16:21:04 EDT 2000
  
  Oops! sorry for the double posting
  
  Trend
  
  
• From: kk (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Fri Oct 20 16:35:59 EDT 2000
  
  Trend keep you statistics is silly, dont try to add fuel for one more round of fight.
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Fri Oct 20 16:39:15 EDT 2000
  
  kk,
  
  I knew it was silly when I was posting it.Why do you see it as fight?
  
  Trend
  
  
• From: observer (@ 208.154.130.13) on: Fri Oct 20 16:47:31 EDT 2000
  
  Trend
  
  I feel this topic is very silly as musicians from different eras cannot be compared.
  
  MSV cannot be compared with IR, nor IR be compared with ARR.
  
  These musicians are from different eras and generations.
  
  I end my contribution to this thread.
  
  Thanks
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Fri Oct 20 16:48:26 EDT 2000
  
  tradition. :)
  
  
• From: kk (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Fri Oct 20 16:52:42 EDT 2000
  
  yeah true, ARR should be compared only to Deva :)
  same era. Note SG doesnt belong to IR era:)
  
  
• From: good_suggestion (@ 208.154.130.13) on: Fri Oct 20 17:11:44 EDT 2000
  
  fan
  
  I know you worked for MSV, why not compare MSV with IR, MSV with ARR, etc blah blah blah.
  
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Fri Oct 20 17:18:46 EDT 2000
  
  and ruin the weekend, ada pongappa, Nan varala in tha atathuku.:))
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Fri Oct 20 17:21:31 EDT 2000
  
  GoodS...also if you are looking for a free target practice, you can always goto a golf driving range or shooting range..my back is not free :)
  
  
• From: --chandru (@ 205.208.17.205) on: Fri Oct 20 17:23:18 EDT 2000
  
  fan buddy-
  
  adhu yennammaa "even arr
  is not spared here"
  statementu?arr yenna
  saamiya.netrikannai
  thirapinum kutrame:-)))
  
  dorai-
  
  Irai paththi publica yaarum
  pesalai.correctu.irum yaaraipaththiyum publicla pesalaiye.irai vachu yembuttu peru mela vandhinga.yennudaya nerungiya
  nanbar irukku romba vendappattavaru.avaru solra kadhaiyellam ketta, indha ulagathoda alagu theriyudhuma.in fact, ir has shown lot of restraintnu sollanum.appadipatta janango namma janango. andha ego kaattaatti, thalaila mottai pottu molagai arachiduveengapa. ego is blood. blood illaama irukka mudiyuma. summa neththu vandha aalu rendu padathukku paattu pottu thulli gudhicha kadhaiya pesareengale. ivaru seasoned veteranpa. industryila authority pala technical visayathula avaru. pala directorskku pala nunukkangala solraaru avaru. venumna kettuko illangatti udu.perusu panni ego pegonnu yen pesareenga?
  
  ''sarakkirukku murukkirukku yenakkedhukku manakkavalai''
  
  adhudhaan vishayam.innikki software professional yellam yennadhairiyathula inga okkandhu irukkeenga. ooottukku anuppinakooda vera yedathula velai kedaikkumnu dhairiyathuladhaane man. adhudhan avarukkum.vikkadha sarakkukku kotti kotti vilambaram kodukkara kaalaththula, avar sarakku vikka thayaar illai man. vaangatti yaarukku nashtam. unga thalaivithi verum saththathai kettukittu po, avalavudhan, yengiraar ir, yenna thappu. kaalaththin kolam avlavudhan. idhula ego,pego kadhaiyellam vaanam.
  
  nammavarukku isai oru vatradha jeevanadhi. maththa partykkellam naraya inputs venum. cut and paste velayellam nalla theriyanum, neraya aal pudichu ulagam poora poy CDs vaanganum. oru paattu compose panna moonu maasam venum...appadi potta kooda adhu yengo ketta paatu madhiri irukkum.irukku idhellam vaanampa. yenna isai avaroda middle namepa. bosela ketta isai aagiduma? sattiyila irundhadhane agappaiyile varum:-))
  
  -chandru
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Fri Oct 20 17:37:32 EDT 2000
  
  chandrujI , .
  Anyway, I cannot make you agree, I dont intend to also, I see world as world, not from a "reserved biased" tworld.
  
  As of today Arr is the king of Indian music.
  You agree or agree no one cares,
  
  Just give me reasons for arr success over everyone instead of emotional outbursts,
  I like to know this because one of my friend wants to write book so that people who arr replaced can read and try a comeback.
  
  after reading the posting, for the benefit of the people who wants to trash my views or me etc etc...., please do it on monday, i will be reading only on monday again.
  
  Have a great weekend guys.
  
  
  
• From: dontcare (@ 208.154.130.13) on: Fri Oct 20 17:49:29 EDT 2000
  
  This thread could be called "who cares" :-)
  
  IR fans do not care about ARR and vice versa.
  
  Why bother writing here.
  
  North and South can never come together.
  
  fan:
  Don't even dare try to convince IR fans about ARR and his so called music. It will never work out :-)
  
  
• From: aruLaracan (@ 134.124.160.10) on: Fri Oct 20 17:54:30 EDT 2000
  
  ndustryila authority pala technical visayathula avaru. pala directorskku pala nunukkangala solraaru avaru.
  
  yes. not many people know how talented ir is in many technical areas of film-making. no reason to write it here except that his ego, at least to me, doesn't seem so huge as his talents.
  
  i would like to bring in an almost non-sequitor. i used to hate/dislike bAlamuraLikrishNA. his singing used to sound jIvanless less and the void created by the absence of jIvan filled with ego. this was 10-15 years ago. in fact i have heard of a story when he miserably failed to sing even a single note in front of a sAmiyAr whom bmk, apparently, said would bind with his music. but, those days are gone. now, whenever i feel dull and whenever i need a vent to let out my emotions, i listen to bmk's shanmugapriyA-s. it soothes even the savage's breast. i am a mere mortal! his ego, his other personality traits, none of them come in to the picture anymore. maybe i have lost the ability to see beneath the surface; but, i tend to think that i have grown. i am not at all unhappy that he doesn't sing anymore (even when he does, not as he used to!). people age, people change, people's priorities change. i don't probe in to his absence; i don't reason out his decline. his one "sadaya mAna" is enough for me.
  
  the same goes for ir. if not a single song of ir has touched your soul, then there is no point listening to or talking about him anymore. if at least one song of his touched the inner recess of your soul, again there is no point discussing him; his purpose wrt is solved. if you are somewhere half-way in between, ... ir, wrt you, has failed!
  
  btw, please do not compare ir with bach, beethovan or mozart. those are in an altogether different class. ir is a genius of a different kind. he showed us that the way we have divided music in to different genres is artificial and unwarranted. his unique contribution to the music world is his effortless mixing of various genres/traditions to give a music which is more than the sum of its parts.
  
  
• From: --chandru (@ 205.208.16.23) on: Fri Oct 20 18:29:22 EDT 2000
  
  Mr Arularacan
  
  arumaya ir'ai defend pannineppa.appada.ippo manasukku idhamma irukku.hmmm......angangay vandhu nee ippadi yezhudhina yevvalavu nallarukkum
  
  --chandru sivaswamy
  
  
• From: Observer (@ 208.154.130.13) on: Fri Oct 20 18:33:48 EDT 2000
  
  arularacan:
  
  If it may be of interest to you, I was comparing Mozart, St.Thyagaraja, Bach and Beethoven to just compare their 'genius' and not the genres to classify IR's works.
  
  
• From: Diwakar (@ 206.175.176.2) on: Fri Oct 20 19:53:22 EDT 2000
  
  aruLaracan :
  
  Absolutely brilliant!!! IMVHO, this is the ultimate accolade that any music lover can give to a musician. IR the musician is a genius. IR the person is not my concern.
  
  
• From: kishmu (@ 198.102.112.201) on: Fri Oct 20 20:09:00 EDT 2000
  
  Total waste of time folks.
  
  
• From: T (@ 209.183.134.106) on: Fri Oct 20 20:58:28 EDT 2000
  
  Heard Zubeida???!!! AMAZING!!!
  
  Listen to the muzic...
  
  

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