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ARR's plagiarism--tamilians are not dumb.

Topic started by R.BALAJI (@ 129.130.140.38) on Mon Jun 8 21:27:56 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Hi guys,
I am going to india soon.If you want to show your disapproval against ARR's plagiarism please do reply to this new thread which I will eventually print and give it to ARR personally so that he realises that people are not dumb and listen to his fancy copying of music from abroad and boast himself as a musician.
Even his latest much talked "Vande matram" has one songs which has direct lift of a tune from Madonna's latest "FROZEN".
I don't know how he thinks that he can get away with these fancy copying.I think it is time for us to show him that we are not dumb.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Nithin (@ nc36.pr.mcs.net) on: Wed Jun 10 23:51:14 EDT 1998
  
  Is the sunrise tune composed by ARR? That is a amazing jingle. You know, pudiya sunrise...
  
  Then the Zandu Balm tune? Man, these two are superb jingles. If it is ARRrr who made these jingles, then guys, we have to switch gears. Bring in the reverse. But wait, I have remaining 996 questions? Are there enough jingles for those questions?
  
  Hmmm.. I can think of Parle Krackjack Biscuit. I was in school then, I doubt Dilip Kumar was kicking b by composing that super jingle. Raja's 'Aattukkutti Muttayuttu' actually paled in comparison with Parle Krackjack Biscuit. That was a super ad.
  
  Where are we? Nine hundred Ninety Five more to go. At this point, all I can recollect is ads like some Aunti ji comparing some detergent soaps.
  
  Srkanth, no offense meant, if ARR did those 4 ads plus another 995 then I will have to change my religion right now.
  
  Seriously, jokes apart, is there a possibility to find out from our Anney Anney Sipayi Anney Noel James about the actual ads that ARR composed?
  
  
  
• From: R.Balaji (@ 129.130.140.38) on: Thu Jun 11 01:57:57 EDT 1998
  
  Hi pals,
  I just want ARR to accept the fact that he is lifting some tunes from others.What difference does he make betweeen him and other copycats of hindi music directors.Except he is giving it in goood quality.
  I am unable to recollect this properly...I think it was the time when Kadaln was resleased and in the song muquala last bit resembled a direct lift from Michael jacksons album.And when it was asked about this to ARR he replied that it was mere coincidence.What do you say for this?
  
  
• From: siva (@ makom.fkm.utm.my) on: Thu Jun 11 02:29:18 EDT 1998
  
  well, to the fellow music critics and lovers, personally have the opinion that both IR and ARR are immesely good...but due to experience and ingeniuty IR is greater forever....
  
  
• From: dev mannemela (@ 131.107.3.71) on: Thu Jun 11 03:49:18 EDT 1998
  
  Hi Balaji,
  
  Let me jump into the fray.. :-)
  Before asking ARR to accept that he lifts tunes, why don't you let us know what those tunes are ?
  
  I mean "tunes" and not some bits and pieces of sounds here and there.. About the recently ballyhooed "Vaarayo Thozhi"'s resemblance to "Oh Mere Sonare Re", it doesn't go beyond those two words "Vaarayo Thozhi". That by itself doesn't make it a tune.. It's like "Anne Anne" and "Ek DO teen"..
  
  For me personally, lifting a tune is more like, for example, the "Azhage" song from Basha...
  Copying instrumental sections is more like the L.Subs violin section from "Manam Virumbuthe"..
  
  and inspiration is more like what IR has done with "Favourite things" song from "Sound of Music". He has retained the same flavour and mood and tweaked the tune a bit and came up with "Thiyyani Danimma" song for Balu Mahendra's "Nireekshana" ("Yatra", I think, in Malayalam)..
  
  
  
  dev
  
  
• From: buddy (@ synergy.nus.edu.sg) on: Thu Jun 11 04:16:13 EDT 1998
  
  Hi,
  
  SRIKANTH
  
  U r too much biased about Rehman.
  
  As raja says that every song is an inspiration of one or the other and the intelligence of the MD plays a big role in avoiding the resemblence.
  
  All the MD should definitely accept the fact that
  they were inspired by a particular song.
  
  For that matter the Kannodu Kanbathellam is definitely ispired by Singare vellane vella.
  
  But I can't agree that Akila Akila is an inspiration of buffulo soldier. Its a total copy.
  
  Even Rehman has copied lot of tunes.
  Porale Ponnuthye, Pakkathe Pakkathe, Ithu Sugam,
  ....
  
  One should accept the fact that Rehman has improved the quality of recording and the use of Sivamani, keith peters.....
  
  When u watch Kathik raja even he has improved tremdously in those areas.
  
  IR is something great, exceptional.
  We all should be proud that we have someone like IR.
  
  Rehman has a very very long way to go achive what IR has achived.
  
  Rehman has been quite a bit stereotyped. I won't say that it is his style.
  Can u imagine the king of varities raja has done.
  
  Rehman has to spread his boundaries by giving lot of varaities.
  
  Guys we have to accept the fact that Rehman has been doing well.
  
  Rehman has to learn how to respect his peers and telling that I have never listened to a particular MD's music.(All crap).
  
  Before rehman people thought that it would be Karthik.
  The kind of experience karthik would have accqired I think no one would have........
  
  I hope karthik will do really good stuff.
  
  Even vidyasagar has been doing well.
  
  Down the line in 10 years we are going to yet another prodigy.
  Once in an interview rehman predicted that it would be Yuvan Shankar...
  Who knows...
  
  IR is very much capable of getting his magical touch anytime.
  
  I hope he gives great music this year.
  Guys wait for Desiya geetham, Shankar's next(I pray).....
  
  Raja Rulz
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Viswa (@ webgate5.mot.com) on: Thu Jun 11 04:36:27 EDT 1998
  
  ARR has done some remarkable work in composing jingles for ads. No question about it. In fact, as we've discussed this over and over again in countless threads of the DF, ARR (no matter what his "drawbacks" are) has made some useful contributions for the TFM. Srikanth is perhaps right when he says that ARR takes his time for getting everything right (including the musicians). Now, another aspect of the whole thing is that each composer has his pace of doing things. It is possible that IR works at a quick pace, while ARR is slower in comparison. In fact, the same composer himself takes different lengths of time for different songs. I remember that MSV once said, he took 3 months to come out with the score for a song (I don't remember which), while another song was done in half an hour. So, that is a subjective aspect.
  
  Now, if the originality of the tunes are in question, a song cannot be dubbed a lift merely if the first two/three words are similar to that of something else, even if the rest is completely different. In that sense, I'm not sure if "VArAyO thOzhi" and "O mErE sOnA rE" can be dragged in. In fact, some IR songs like "En purushan thAn..." and "Dum mArO dum"; "KELadi kaNmaNi..." and "SO gayA yeh jahAn" sounded similar in their opening lines. But the similarity ended there.
  
  
• From: paramasivan (@ 192.228.152.155) on: Thu Jun 11 04:47:41 EDT 1998
  
  please tell me which music composer's have not copied one way or the other? why do you guys are so agitated with rehman? has he thrown some spanners into your well oiled musical thoughts? I think south indian music composer's are giving some good music that is attracting non-indians now towards tamil songs. that's great job done by the music composer's. if it is plagarism then let the original scorer initiate legal action against the culprit. we fan's if you like the song go for it and if you do not like it leave, just because most of the others are liking it and you don't, that does not mean you have to jump up and down against the music director!! saying what type of md is he, he is cheating the poor souls of tamil, going on a campaign to discredit the md and so on. this I think is very childish!! even IR has said once in an concert in Singapore that a great music composer is one who can package the music in a form that could attract a majority of the listeners!! so guys, listen if it is good, throw it out if it is not good! or you think you could do a better job then please go ahead and change the music scene of india!! kudos for you!!
  
  
• From: Srikanth (@ 27.minneapolis-06.mn.dial-access.att.net) on: Thu Jun 11 08:43:46 EDT 1998
  
  Hi,
  
  Mr.Buddy :
  "U r too much biased about Rehman. "
  
  If you have read my comments properly, I told - it is not only Ar every one copies...
  
  As per your comments I see that you are not only biased with Raja - you guys are all prarthanai club for Raja - you guys dont enjoy music as music ..you brand it - Raja's music , AR's music..
  
  I gave a list of songs Raja copied What is the answer to that? you cannot answer...
  
  Raja fans are blind with love over Raja and dont accept others music as Music... Pathetic!...
  
  Tamil Music has grown international, this did not happen overnight. It was flaged of from the days of MSV- THEN RAJA TOOK IT OVER - AR TOOK IT TO THE PEAK....
  
  
  If you really know music and capable of appericiating good things in the world
  you will enjoy AR's music...
  
  
  An Angry!
  Srikanth
  
  
  
• From: R.Balaji (@ 129.130.140.38) on: Thu Jun 11 09:01:17 EDT 1998
  
  Hi Dev,
  I am not sying that ARR copied exactly from a song.But he takes "lots" of bits from others and makes into a string and gives to us.I am telling that why can't he accept that he takes like this.
  Hi Srikanth,
  OK.IR too copied but look at the number of movies he had done.Before ARR could complete a handful of films he gets lots of "inspiration" from others.
  Moreover he goes around having diffenet hairstyle and giving a look like Michael Jackson with some crapppy white shirt unbuttoned in the video "VAnde MAtram".Why does he think of himself great and starts to create an image like that.
  By the by hope you must have enjoyed the Bull match yesterday.
  
  
  
• From: pg (@ gate02.merck-medco.com) on: Thu Jun 11 09:30:14 EDT 1998
  
  "ARR's recording is excellent" is a myth. ARR's recording is pretty poor in my opinion.
  
  1. Listen to the way he records voices - especially female voices. The voice is never clear - there is so much of pisuRu around the voices. Almost all of his songs have badly recorded voices. A simple example - listen to Asha Bhonsle's song in Iruvar. pisuRO pisurU. And this just an example.
  
  2. His mid-range is pretty muffled - generally you cannot make out the instruments.
  
  3. He enhances the bass and treble artificially - so in a boombox you will hear thump thump thump and ting ting ting ! Ah excellent recording.
  
  4. His Jeans was probably the worst ARR recording I have heard. (I have the CD). His recording level is so low I have to turn my receiver way up to get a decent volume. And he says he imported high-tech equipment for this album. In kaNNodu kANbadhellAm the thavil sound is so fake. Listen to the thavil sound on a nadhaswaram tape and listen to this and you will know what I mean. There is no bass in the thavil, it sounds like oosi pattAsu.
  
  Technology is no synonym for quality. Some of my favourite recordings were made in the 60s. I have two Ella Fitzgerald recordings (The First Lady of Song & Love Songs) recorded in 60s and remastered for CD. The way Ella's voice has been recorded is just amazing.
  
  I do not want to make this a IR-ARR comparison but IR's recording also leaves much to be desired. In most of his songs there is no bass. The drums/mridangam/tabla all sound thin and tinny. His recording of voices is OK though.
  
  In both IR-ARR's recording, the mridangam/tabla are double (or multi) - making the instrument seen ultra long. (One side of the mridangam sounds from one speaker and the other side from the other speaker - so if your speakers are 15 feet apart, the mridangam is 15 feet wide !).
  
  IR's veera thAlAttu/kizhakkum mERkum were recorded much better than any ARR's recording. But this is no praise for Raja, only his recordist.
  
  
• From: Mano (@ zap.uwaterloo.ca) on: Thu Jun 11 10:19:52 EDT 1998
  
  pg:
  You're absolutely right about Jeans recordings. No one can beat IR when it comes to re-recording. Check the vikatan for IR's master piece in 'Devadai' and what IR got to say about this. Unfortunately, I don't remember the exact date of the vikatan, so may have dig it out from the piles.
  
  

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