Home   Forum   Wiki   Notes   Register   FAQ   Sitemap   About Us   Contact Us  

The INVISIBLE and The UNHEARD - What role can Listeners play in re-establishing QUALITY in TFM?

Topic started by Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on Thu Mar 28 10:41:25 EST 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Vanakkam/Namaskar !
This is the first time I am initiating a discussion. In the last year that I have visited this site I have heard many views on the current state of Tamizh and Tamizh Film Music. Moving out of the ARR-IR tugs and pulls, it would be good to hear your comments on the FUTURE of Tamizh/Film Music:
Points to consider:
1. Globalism is a Reality: How has this affected the packaging of TFM?
2. Is blatant imitation of "Western" trends in TF Music a sign of Progress/Evolution?
3. There is a strong sense of discontent among tamizh film music listeners (what I have gleaned from posters here - no definitive survey :-)) with regards to the way Tamizh has been corrupted in the name of "fashion" or "novelty" - Is this trend reversible? Or is this the way of the Future?
4. Masses and Music: The old Chicken and Egg argument: Masses influence the Music/ Music influences the Masses - What is the role of the Tamizh Audience in this? Are criticism and discrenment powerless vis-a-vis the Marketing Machinery?
5. The slow decline in meaning and music - singing/lyrics/refinement - can these be fixed? Or is this undeserving of serious thought/input?
6. How (and where) do you see Tamizh Film Music - five years down the road?

These are some genuine concerns. Please, let us do our best, to make this an engaging discussion. I look foward (no personal blame-games please) your insights and ideas. Do add to the above list of concerns if you find them to be incomplete...

Best to All!

---

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Fri Mar 29 02:09:04 EST 2002
  
  That's interesting VR. Orientation/Context are also two essential aspects of how one perceives "cool" and blends with the "in" crowd. I never quite looked at it that way. Thanks for opening yet another interesting window on this issue.
  You are also right about when you say that teen pop music sells. Teenagers are eager for rhythm and not quite old yet for meaning and memory. That is a valid point. But say, even if they were 40% of the TFM market (would you consider that significant?) where does it leave the rest who crave something more fulfilling than just fast tunes and farcical lyrics? Are they all just resigned to Andha Naal Nyabagam Nenjile Vandhadhey...Nanbane?
  
  
• From: ROTFL (@ 203.106.162.202) on: Fri Mar 29 07:28:27 EST 2002
  
  I would like to categorically state that I had nothing to the posting made in "old responses" as follows:
  
  From: ROTFL (@ 198.232.250.51) on: Thu Mar 28 14:57:14 EST 2002
  Come on guys ... I am waiting for that one comment on ARR ... to spoil this thread also.
  
  It is not my nature to disrupt good discussions.
  
  To the guy who made the above posting: I know that ROTFL is a common term, but I have been using the handle for quite some time, so please..
  
  I am of course giving you the benefit of doubt that your intention is not to smear my name.
  
  Others, sorry for the digression. This thread makes interesting reading.
  
  
• From: Sam (@ 132.235.18.15) on: Fri Mar 29 13:35:14 EST 2002
  
  "I think part of the problem with living abroad and listening to true rock, jazz, hip-hop, blues and the like day in and day out, exposes the amateurish compositions of TFM MD's trying to ape the west"
  
  VR, I beg to differ with u. I feel that our MDs are perfectly capable of giving a true Rock, or Jazz, or Hip-hop or whatever western genre. Rahman, Sivamani, KeithPeters, Ranjit Barot etc used to/or still play in bands that usually play rock music. But then who will listen to Rock in India? For most of the people in India, Rock is noise, Rap is Crap and like that. How many rock bands are popular in India? Even good rock bands like Euphoria, end up doing mixed stuff, instead of pure rock. (My bro saw them live in BITS, Pilani, and there they played mostly cover versions of GNR, Metallica and other such things besides their own, and he says they are impressive). I saw the band Millenium in Vizag, and they were decent too.
  
  Mostly it is young people in cities who would like a GNR being played in movie theaters or on their sound system. U cant expect a daily Indian to listen to a Rock song. I had good expectations when I heard Musthafa Intro, but except for that and the 1st interlude, u cant call that a rock song. No power chords, or heavy drumming or something like that. But does that mean the MD cant do it? I dont think so. The MD would eventually have to tone down the song to something that pleases the averages Indian ear, its not like an amaeturish composition in western style.
  
  
  
  Sometime back I read this on the net: Someone asks Rahman when he is gonna do heavy metal, and Rahman jokes back saying he hopes he doesnt do that, cos then the Indians would never forgive him.
  
  I differ with some of your other points too, but then lets not digress from this thread.
  
  P.S. What bands do u listen to?
  
  
• From: Sam (@ 132.235.18.15) on: Fri Mar 29 13:39:10 EST 2002
  
  Let me add this to my previous post
  There is not much audience in India for typical Rock Music (what I was trying to say in previous post).
  And if some brash MD (say an ARR or an YSR) indeed does a typical rock song, then he would be branded as an corrupting influence :-)
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Fri Mar 29 14:27:46 EST 2002
  
  Music is just not music. it is the cultural expression of a soceity. Though I listen to rock, I cannot identify with much of the lyrics. I am not sure how people in India understood and appreciated these. Anyways..coming back to the point, as a society if some 'elders'/'well-wishers' discourage certain activity/behavior there is some reason. We have a 'way of life' and we try to protect it. In the west, when they say they want to protect their way of life they only mean the economic aspect of things (against communism). I have even heard that FBI is very much against cults (for this very reason). I have been living in America for quite sometime (including Canada) and the older I get I see more differences between Indian culture and western culture. I am also getting 'protective' of our arts/music and ethos, more than ever. This has caused me to listen to only a certain category of music. I consider, certain kinds of music as promoting not so desirable 'social behavior'. Please dont brush this off as the ramblings of an old man :) Just give some thought to the points I mention..popular music from the west comes with its own baggage..their social behavior..do we really want it ???
  
  
• From: sarat (@ 67.34.132.86) on: Fri Mar 29 15:20:39 EST 2002
  
  check out this link for some tamil metal
  
  www.taalam.com.my
  
  
• From: vaal_payyan (@ 169.144.118.138) on: Fri Mar 29 17:36:12 EST 2002
  
  hey,
  i have listened to those malaysian tamil bands too. man, some of them are real 'heavy', eventhough its kinda amateurish. never thought somebody could do that in tamil. its a good move though. i would say not any worse than the half-cooked 'redungettan' stuff we are getting from TFM of late.
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Sat Mar 30 00:25:52 EST 2002
  
  Kiru..you make sense..
  
  I used to wonder, during my college days, there was always a group who were so much into metal and rock..more of a blind following i would say because they were very close minded when it came to Indian music....I attended a concert by some BITS Pilani group in Chennai and I couldn't believe the maddening American like adoration and fan behavior (included some head bangers in the crowd)...if the cream of our Indian youth consider this 'hep', 'in' and 'cool'...then God save us and Indian culture !
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Sat Mar 30 00:27:47 EST 2002
  
  BTW..great topic Naaz..just got in from my weekend (it is Thursdays and Fridays in Dubai)..so missed out on the earlier good discussions here...
  
  
• From: VR (@ 66.188.201.72) on: Sat Mar 30 01:53:50 EST 2002
  
  Sam
  
  I understand your points..
  
  I agree that the musicians are fully capable of playing ditto most of the western rock/pop music. That used to be true in my college days as well... I am proud of TFM musicians..
  
  Composing is different. But even here I will concede that some of the TFM MDs may be quite capable of pulling off original compositions that match western rock/pop.
  
  But their current compositions are mediocre ...for whatever reason...commercial pressure may be a factor
  
  But the main point is why lose the Indianness of the music and try and imitate the west...What is happenning is more than merging cultures. It is a true cop out.
  
  Another point is you know quite well the variety that is out there in Western pop/rock....The music that TFM is imitating is the type of western pop music that is mass produced and reviled today. Unimagintive, over produced, over engineered, manufactured. It is a bane here and it is a bane in TFM..
  
  Out TFM culture is rich. Our traditions are so unique. I am proud of TFM from even 10 years ago. Makes you weep at times. That is non existent today. Why? Why lose our soul? I think what tamil music had with the old days was precious and needs to be saved.
  
  I dont mind innovation or wetern influence...but we shouldnt sell out.
  
  Again, i think those of us who live far away, maybe getting a bit nostalgic, and maybe its our fault we dont know the situation back home. Also a problem is we listen to the songs without the contxt of the movie sometimes..
  
  I listen to a lot of different types of music. i really love to analyze the tunes and the orchestration. I am no music expert, but i beleive I have a good ear.
  
  Right now beleive it or not I listen to a set of 8 CDs I made with the best of IR's music..About 150 of his best ever songs. The music is awesome.
  
  here are my favorites
  
  Rock: U2, Eric Clapton, dire Straits, Mark Knopflers solo albums, Santana,
  
  I do listen (sheepishly) to top 40 radio
  
  Blues: no one like Stevie Ray VAughn.
  
  R and B: Boyz to Men
  
  Country: Garth,,What a voice
  
  I love classical music. Love mozart.
  
  This is a terrific discussion...
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Sat Mar 30 03:11:20 EST 2002
  
  VR....
  
  What you are lamenting about is only film music...there is whole sea of traditional, fusion, folk artistes who are now emerging.
  
  Actually what we in India need is now a well-funded channel that can support these kind of artistes...definitely not the crass, sloppy, snobbish MTV India and Channel V...it is very blatant and degrading the way they promote an alternate culture aimed only at reducing our youth into morons....A NEW CHANNEL IS A DESPERATE NEED...if I had the experience and knowhow I would definitely do it ! Maybe newtfmpage.com can start such a channel !
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Sat Mar 30 05:59:45 EST 2002
  
  I thought it apt to add one of Udaya's humorous writings about the future in TFH :
  
  From: Udhaya (@ 63.89.188.200) on:
  
  
  The future is all one can hope for. Here are my hopes:
  
  Future of TFM in 10 years:
  -India’s first Thamizh prime minister will order a Thamizh fatwa on Northie singers moonlighting in TFM as well as homegrown evils like Vasundra Das leading to their branded tongues with red-hot forks
  -Vairamuthu will get a reverse enema in the form of a lit firecracker that will magically disengage him from his algorithm format and English word usage
  -Ilayaraja will get divinely inspired to treat TFM as he has been treating Malayalam soundtracks and give one spellbinding track after another
  -Ilayaraja will also hearken to his early style of elaborate compositions with varying interludes and re-remember how to use guitar, horns, veenai and other instruments that he neglected since the mid-80s
  -Ilayaraja will stop blaming the world for lack of recognition and stop moping about others lacking the class to appreciate his genius and begin providing the true feast he promised his fans instead of the “appalam and oorugai” he confessed to be giving us
  -All the religious heads will summon Ilayaraja to measure up to his past greatness instead of lying on his laurels like a spoiled child. They will reprimand him for equating spirituality with a lack of excitement in one’s own work
  -Vaali will stick to writing honorable free verse epics and articles for print and quit being the self-proclaimed dog-for-money that he is in song lyrics
  -Following Thamarai’s success, distributors will demand female writers and this epidemic will spread so widely that women attain a permanent place as lyricists
  -The above trend will be justly followed by female MDs and directors
  -ARR will get into a Sufi trance and realize that Thamizh is sacred and will up*hold the correct pronunciation of Thamizh with a handy whip blessed by a Muslim prophet
  -The fad of rhythm-oriented music fades and melody regains its rightful place on top
  -Private albums will make a great impact on the music scene and affect the way soundtracks are made. Many different groups will be featured under one soundtrack like western movie soundtracks
  -The world music scene will recognize Indian music’s richness and will shower riches on all the local musicians
  -Every genre of music will survive and triumph on its own merit rendering copies irrelevant and forcing Deva, SAR, and Sirpi to oblivion or original work
  -Unni Menon and Srinivas will get their deserved recognition
  -Shankar Mahadevan will have long outgrown being typecast for high-pitched, high-strung songs and will display his immense potential as a musician and singer
  -SPB will gracefully hang up his acting and other peripheral gigs and focus on making his unique music by becoming a full-fledged MD
  -ARR will focus on the quality of new talent he introduces rather than the quantity
  -Vidhyasagar, Philip and Jerry, and Agosh will all have established themselves with market potential so as to revitalize TFM with new ideas and pave the way for a mob of talented newcomers
  -A revisionist trend will sweep TFM and works by past MDs and singers will be digitally re-mastered and preserved forever allowing for a greater scrutiny and appreciation
  
  

---

List all pages of this thread

Post comments