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dhooL.com

Topic started by bb (@ 24.4.254.104) on Tue Feb 20 03:21:22 EST 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Hi! We've made a major addition to newtfmpage, and that is a big song bank. Dhool features thousands of songs for your listening pleasure. This site is a part of the newtfmpage.com - swara.com group. Together with newtfmpage, we wish to make this the best place to listen to tamil film songs online and know about tamil film music. Our collection includes old, new, famous, rare and unheard of songs. We are still fine tuning and fixing the database errors, so please bear with us. We value your feedback, and this will help us build the site better. Please post your comments below or mail to comments@newtfmpage.com.
This work was done by us (bb and RR) with MS and swara.com ravi.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 64.136.26.31) on: Sun Apr 20 14:20:59 EDT 2003
  
  Vijay,
  It's a pleasure discussing with you. It's amazing that I managed so many posts with an IR fan without suffering a cheap shot. The normal range of reactions would be that I'm old, or that I'm an ARR fan, or that I'm biased against IR. I'm not predisposed to liking or hating a song based on who created it, but it doesn't mean I can't have likes and dislikes. Mano bothers my inner core. I wish he were born a woman under the Taliban regime so that he would never have got to sing. But I still enjoyed, "Shenbagamae", "Andhiyilae Vaanam" since those songs had everything else going for them and couldn't be kept down by one bad element. This differenciation is lost on many who read my posts. They're just quick to slot me in one camp or the other. Why can't I say what I don't like without being harassed for it or asked to prove my lack of bias?
  
  There are several individual songs from the mid80s to now that I like by IR, but if you take a time sample and the overall quality from that particular era, I favor the pre-83 era. Again, an opinion, not a Maxim. But I do wonder about people's lack of curiosity about anything before their time. Only pop music is this way, classical music or classical literature don't lose their appeal over time.
  
  About lyrics being a bias for me, it's more a standard than a bias. There was a discussion about music or lyrics in this forum recently and I believe people underestimate their need for good lyrics. If we could keep the same great music, tune, and singer for "Pani Vizhum Malar Vanam" and switch the lyrics to "Padai varum sori varum" would people enjoy it the same?
  
  Would Hariharan or MKT make "Lovennaa Lovvu manennai stovuu" a great song?
  
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 64.136.26.31) on: Sun Apr 20 14:23:07 EDT 2003
  
  oops, differentiation is the right spelling not differenciation.
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 68.51.215.28) on: Sun Apr 20 14:48:07 EDT 2003
  
  "I wish he were born a woman under the Taliban regime so that he would never have got to sing. "
  
  :-)))))))
  
  When I was looking at the rajangahm statistics I was also surprised at the no of songs MV has sung for IR, nearly 500! Either IR didnt have the time or inclination to seek out better male singers or he was plain unlucky.
  
  
  "But I do wonder about people's lack of curiosity about anything before their time. Only pop music is this way, classical music or classical literature don't lose their appeal over time.
  "
  
  Again you have a point. Probably its just a case of people tending to stick with the kind of music they grew up with a little more. You seem to be an exception though. Thanks to some of these P2P sharing programs, I have been collecting oldies from TFM/HFM as well as some American oldies. Some of the old rock/soul songs are too good.
  
  
• From: thoppai (@ 152.3.193.105) on: Sun Apr 20 18:01:42 EDT 2003
  
  hi vijay
  i think you meant to say Mano, instead of MV (Malaysia Vasudevan), right...interestingly according to Raajangahm both Mano and Malaysia Vasudevan have sung 443 songs for IR...
  
  bb, i think Vizhiyile is in Natabhairavi (one of the Minor scales) and not Sindhu Bhairavi...
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 68.51.215.28) on: Sun Apr 20 18:28:50 EDT 2003
  
  I meant only MV, but if Mano has sung 443 songs as well it only makes it worse. Thats almost 900 songs between them = 25% of IRs work. Ugh!
  There would probably be 50-75 songs at the most that I like out of that 900.
  
  
• From: Kavin (@ 152.163.189.230) on: Sun Apr 20 18:47:56 EDT 2003
  
  Udhaya,
  
  Your points are well taken, and also with all due respect. There is no doubt in my mind that music and lyrics can share a unique relationship. A lyric (poem) can stand on its own right, and doesn't need music; and vice versa. A relationship can be as sweet as 'amudam', no doubt. But then, it seems that such relationships are a rarity, unless it comes from the same creator. This, I see, a limitation in expectations, not necessarily a bias.
  
  Obiviously, 'keeping great music and tune', I am not going to like "padai varum sori varum" sung by Mano. But give me a singer for HTNI and NBW, for that matter a lyricist for this music. Of course, HTNI or NBW only because I am a tamilian, if I was an european or an american or anywhere else, I might refer to something else. It is also a very personal experience, as much as yours!!. Atleast, voice has been used reasonably well in HTNI and NBW.
  
  I do share your wonder, that people should restrict music to periods such as pre or post 80's. How can one ever think of placing reference points in time for music? But, it appears that for certain mortals, it is essential!! Relativity, which borrows time as its tool, also plays a role in appreciation of music.
  
  But then, after all, lyric and voice spells out human emotions, while music is by itself a langauge in its own right. I am ever willing to change my convictions!?
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 64.136.26.31) on: Sun Apr 20 18:59:26 EDT 2003
  
  Kavin,
  Great points. Yes, lyric can stand on its own as a poem. So can music. But as a Thamizh movie song, lyrics are just as valid as music and are often an overlooked aspect of a song. I have no qualms about instrumentals and yes their language is universal. But I often ask people who care not for lyrics why they bother with TFM, then? If brigas and vocal dexterity is all that's important, listen to Hindi Ghazals or Italian Operas. If Indian film music is all you care about irrespective of lyrics, you can listen to Hindi, Telungu, Kannada, Malayalam film music and no need to restrict yourself to TFM.
  
  To know Thamizh and to listen to TFM and not worry about lyrics just baffles me.
  
  
• From: Kavin (@ 152.163.189.230) on: Sun Apr 20 19:23:06 EDT 2003
  
  Udhaya,
  
  Rarely have I had a response as quick as yours. I am, of course, trapped by TFM to source music as a language of my culture. Or rather, I should say that, I look towards Thamizh cinema to show me the way to music. I do enjoy the perks of lyrics that tamil cinema can offer.
  
  I can listen to TFM, and know Thamizh, but Thamizh culture, I thought, can be beyond music or lyrics of the current days! Thai MaNuKu Vanakam solvOmA!
  
  
• From: Kavin (@ 152.163.189.230) on: Sun Apr 20 19:31:25 EDT 2003
  
  Also, when we talk about Thamizh as a ThEn Mozhi, we only refer to the past. How very sad? We refer to Kannadasan, Barathiyar, Barathidhasan, Kambar, Elango Adigal and numba elandha pazham Ovaiyaar.
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 68.51.215.28) on: Sun Apr 20 21:58:46 EDT 2003
  
  Udhaya, extremely bad lyrics like in "Lovenna Love" will be automatically noticed and discarded. The problem comes when one has to dicern between ordinary/mediocre and great lyrics. To a certain extent that is subjective(like music) and to a large extent it depends on how much literary appreciation/vocabulary(if the lyrics are not in yeliya or nadaimurai thamizh)/knowledge of the language does the listener possess. Unlike music, which anyone can appreciate instinctively, you need to possess some of the above things and an inclination to dissect lyrics which many dont have. In other words, for many, lyrics appreciation is not spontaneous. If I didnt know what "velvi" meant, I could'nt understand and appreciate the line "Kelvigalaal velvigalai naan seidhen". You understand what I mean?
  
  
  As long as the words fit the sandham and make some sense (i.e. they are not bad or offensive enough to cause a distraction) they are accepted. The tolerance level for lyrics is quite high these days. Your point(about language appreciation) raises a bigger issue which is perhaps not just confined to TFM alone. For many like me, appreciation of the music supersedes the appreciation of lyrical aspects and thats the way my mind is tuned to, when listening to a song. (But its funny that I do get irked when I hear a word like "olive yennai" stuffed right in the middle of Snehidhane's lyrics. It somehow doesnt sound right.)
  
  And one more thing, film music is for films and films are mostly an entertainment medium atleast in Chennai. So while you might think "Mustafa Mustafa dont worry mustafa" is garbage lyrics the lyrics might be considered "cool" by the college crowd with all the English words and the song might go on to be a big hit as well. So, the bar cant be set high as far as lyrics are concerned when you are talking about TFM, especially with the way musical trends are evolving in TFM right now :-(
  
  
  
• From: Udhaya (@ 64.136.26.31) on: Mon Apr 21 00:52:23 EDT 2003
  
  Kavin and vijay,
  Very well put. Absolutely agree on your takes.
  
  Kavin,
  We do have many young poets fully capable of Then Mozhi waiting on the wings for a break. For instance every poet from the "Tenali" soundtrack is worth getting a boost (even though Tenali soundtrack isn't full evidence of their capabilities). But since it's showbusiness and not showart, opportunities will continue to go to the tried and trite.
  
  
• From: OISG (@ 193.188.97.152) on: Mon Apr 21 00:59:08 EDT 2003
  
  Vijay
  
  "Velvi" - I feel that is VM s attempt to improve the listener s Tamil...prob being his first song and he wanted the change the world.
  
  Even for a regular,words such as "aaeizhai" to describe a woman (anbulla Athan Vanakkam) are difficult but thats the way poets are,VM (in his early days) being no exception.Somehwere down the line he shifted and wanted to outdo Vaali is Tamineglish.
  
  Like Olive Yeannai ,Oxygen irked me in Anbe,Anbe which is a good song in the lines of "Madurayil parantha" or "Aval oru Navarasa nadagam"
  
  But all said and done VM is the only one around from whom you can expect a line or 2 of Kavidhai these days.(Vali s Tamizh is now restricted to Ramanuja Kaviyam)."Unvizhyil pirark Azhauthal Kannerum Aanadham","Thayin Kathakathapu"- not bad eh!
  
  So,like the MDs,the lyricists too drift towards mediocrity (algorthmic approach follows!).
  
  I expect Shankar(Director who is a trendsetter and who first started regular Taminenglish) to come out with ideas of popularising chaste Tamil lyrics and words with Rehman and redeem.
  
  Quiz:Can someone tell the Ilakana Kurippu for "Aaezhai" and "Nerizhai"?
  
  
• From: Saravanan (@ 213.42.1.171) on: Mon Apr 21 01:17:12 EDT 2003
  
  Udhaya, Vijay & Kavin: Excellent discussion. It is a pleasant treat to see such a studied, sane and mature exchange of opinions, greatly enhanced by thorough knowledge, appropriate illustrations and a rare willingness to respect a divergent thought.
  
  At the end, I seem to agree with both sides : ))
  
  

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