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IR or ARR

Topic started by M.Anand (@ ihproxy1.proxy.lucent.com) on Tue Jan 18 01:03:04 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

hi all, I am Anand from bangalore and a new visitor to the tfm page. I am a great fan of both ARR and IR. I browsed through all the earlier threads on ARR and IR. It seems to me that there are quite a few anti ARRs out here.

Let me tell you something about IRs music. IRs music became popular and sounded different because he tried to bring in a westernization of Carnatic ragas in his songs. Even a dappanguthu was in Lathaangi or sivaranjani. That actually made the difference. Otherwise he is no great MD. One might argue that such a westernization or incorporation of a carnatic raga in a dappanguthu or jazz is something that demands great applause. But IR doesn't deserve that because, if u say u are tuning a song in a particular raagam, you have to bring out the nuances, the laya and bhaava of the raagam in to the song. Just traversing the swaras in the raagam here and there does not mean that u have tuned a song in that raagam. Ilayaraaja has done just that, a mere traversal through the swaras. In many places, there were apaswaras also. ARR has tuned very few songs based on Carnatic ragas but they were classics. For example Mettu podu in Anjali is a beautiful song in Ananda Bhairavi. He has brought out every nuance of the raagam in that song. Minsaara Kanna in padaiyappa is an excellent piece in vasantha. En mel vizhunda mazhai tuliye is again a beautiful piece in kaapi. A real mix of the east and west. That is what u call fusion. Ilayaraaja boasts of having composed songs in rare raagas like chala nattai, kanakangi etc. For example pani vizhum malar vanam in chala nattai is again a pure note traversal. There was no attempt to bring out the nuances in the raaga. So IR knew how to make songs sound good but ARR gives a fine polish to each and every one of his songs. IR composed music for 700 odd films. Hey Ram is his 785th film. Considering 7 songs per movie, he has tuned almost 5500 songs. Huge number indeed but hardly 5% of those songs are listenable others are 100% pure junk. But 99.9% of ARRs songs are listenable and they are also good numbers. What do you say about this?

Regards,
Anand

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: sabesan (@ pppa78-resalesanfranciscometro3-3r7194.saturn.bbn.com) on: Sun Feb 13 12:45:02 EST 2000
  
  hey sriks, just now i posted and u also posted... come on sriks cool cool.... why do u bother these kind of postings.... do they really need to be answereed......
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ wdslppp129.sttl.uswest.net) on: Sun Feb 13 12:55:59 EST 2000
  
  sabesan...
  thanks for you advice.,I agree it was an outburts since srinath (I talk to him almost every other day! and we have small discussions) when he mentioned something about genius etc...I did not like it, why always bash arr. Basically when you call fellow musicians a plastic musicians you should be clean!...hope you go it...why these words are not taken seriously by people here...
  why it is ignored...but when someone like cho makes a statement he is being blindly trashed, forgetting what Cho is all about.
  
  See how angry guys go when I say a flop movie has poor songs!....blindly people here bash arr of all the hits he gave for the past 3 years....and when arr fans resiprocate...finally call them names...and be happy...about it.
  is this right....arr is a good musician, thats is all i am supporiting here. Yes raja was also a great musician during his time..I feel that fact should not limit us to accept other good musicians!...
  
  
• From: Sabesan (@ pppa18-resalesanfranciscometro2-2r7194.saturn.bbn.com) on: Sun Feb 13 13:06:26 EST 2000
  
  hey u know Rajini fans or for that matter any 'fans' of this tamil industry..... the 'fans' will certainly bash/trash anyone who says a wrong statement about their idol..... well, i don't know if thats human nature of if its a culture thats in tamil's alone who have a lot of worship on thir idols.....
  
  as far as Cho's statement, let me send u a mail in detail..... what's ur mail-id????
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ wdslppp129.sttl.uswest.net) on: Sun Feb 13 13:15:23 EST 2000
  
  d_srikanth@yahoo.com
  
  
• From: SM (@ pmnat01-p01.sgum.mci.com) on: Sun Feb 13 15:07:01 EST 2000
  
  > staements made out of personal grudges, biases > will never harm Ir's reputation nor can ever
  > take anything away from his accomplishments and
  > talents. All it can do is reflect on the people
  > who make those satements.
  
  Same applies if you substitute ARR for IR in the above.
  
  
• From: Srinath (@ 209.8.128.113) on: Sun Feb 13 18:23:05 EST 2000
  
  Gosh ! I seem to have missed the best part of the fight :-)
  
  Guys:
  ARR is great in his own right. He is a great MD because of what his music sounds like - not because of what his music sounds like when compared to IR. So that should pacify IR fans who don't have to feel humiliated by these comparions, and the ARR fans who need not feel that ARR is not being given due recognition. ARR deserves all the credit without the necessity for his songs to be compared with IR's. Personally, I like IR's music because it invariably exceeds my expectations. Perhaps I am not expecting the right thing from ARR. But can I be blamed for that ? :-) I mean, the expectations are all mine and if one MD satisfies it more than the other, I would naturally be inclined to listen to his music predominantly ! It does not mean that ARR does not regularly exceed expectations of his own fans, nor does it mean that the expectations of his fans are lower than mine ! So peace ! :-)
  
  
• From: Srisailam Vasudevan (@ 63.80.83.47) on: Sun Feb 13 20:25:18 EST 2000
  
  Ravi....R u there ????
  
  Do u guys really think that this thread is a worthy one ??? Maathi maathi oruthara oruthar thittikkaraanga...Yedhavadhu urupadiya posting vandhudha ???
  
  I guess Anand shld be really happy. Atleast indha DFla he has become popular. He has achieved his goal. Thread initiate panni vachittu avar paattukku odi poyittar...Nanbargale neenga yen adichukkareenga ????
  
  BTW, Mr. Srikanth, Y do u always like to have the last say in an argument ??? Maybe, u have a vast knowledge in Music. But that doesn't mean, ur review is the right one and others shld accept it.
  
  Krish, Srinath & all other IR fans...Dhayavu senju indha threadukku varadheenga...Thevaiyillama yedhukku Tension ???
  
  We cannot convince (we shldn't, rather) people with an obvious bias against Raja..
  
  'Thoongaravangala yezhuppalam..thoongara madhiri nadikkaravangala yezhuppa mudiyathu...
  
  
• From: Kamesh (@ hlr-42-175.tm.net.my) on: Sun Feb 13 21:23:05 EST 2000
  
  While you guys are very busy here is something that has happened. ARR has won the Filmfare award for the Best Music Director for Taal this year. (This is not for Tamil movies but for Hindi movies FYI)
  
  Link http://www.timesofindia.com/today/14home2.htm
  
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ wdslppp129.sttl.uswest.net) on: Sun Feb 13 21:28:46 EST 2000
  
  Mr.Vasudevan, sandadi sakula, enna ore bash!..., :-)))
  But that doesn't mean, ur review is the right one and others shld accept it.
  -- i never told so! or thought so....till date.
  --- i am one among 1000s who posts here thats all.
  as mentioned by you vast musical knowledge etc, why do you bring it here, it not required..does any of my posting have any personal talks about you or anyone here...
  the only reason I posted here is after reading a posting from a responsible person...srinath -- I did not bother about much about this thread till then.
  for which he had replied!...i was happy with his answer, thats all!...about it.
  
  'Thoongaravangala yezhuppalam..thoongara madhiri nadikkaravangala yezhuppa mudiyathu
  - pazamozigal applies to both the sides!.
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ wdslppp129.sttl.uswest.net) on: Sun Feb 13 21:31:18 EST 2000
  
  Ayo kamesh sir....I just thought the puyal has ended!....and you hit the rewind button. :-))
  
  
• From: Srisailam Vasudevan (@ 63.80.83.47) on: Sun Feb 13 21:55:21 EST 2000
  
  Mr. Srikanth
  
  Go back a couple of pages in this same thread. Go through the postings u made. Pls do this, when u r cool. Neenga unga reviewava Madraslendhu US varaikkum yellarum othunda madhiriyum yedho IR fans mattumthaan oThukkama adam pudikkara madhiriyum posting podala ??? Sir, neenga yaaro naan yaaro...Naan yen ungala bash panna poren ???
  Naandhaan theliva sollittene that u have a vast musical knowledge...Idhula bashing yengendhu vandhadhu...What i am trying to say is..
  
  U r biased against IR.
  
  Unga statementa yaaravathu oppose panni oru posting panna..U r not able to take it. U always try to have the last word.
  
  Yenakku newtfmpage pudhusu...1 varushama thaan indha sitekku varen...Indha oru varushathula...Thappo righto...U have never accepted others arguments. Naan pudicha muyalukku moone kaal appadindrathula theliva irukkeenga...
  
  Unmai kasakkum anbare...aana adhudhaan reality...
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ wdslppp129.sttl.uswest.net) on: Sun Feb 13 22:49:16 EST 2000
  
  My question was to you is why talking things personal about me!...always, when people cannot answer my questions even stand my questions ...they tend to rub my personal side...when I talk subject matter, I get personally bashed, before I could anwser those personal bashers...by then many things happen here!.
  
  my friend I can also repeat
  --- U r biased with raja.
  
  Unmai kasakkum anbare. ---
  please read it again and again and again....
  and again.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.112) on: Sun Feb 13 23:05:10 EST 2000
  
  Sriks..please cool down...
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ wdslppp129.sttl.uswest.net) on: Sun Feb 13 23:31:10 EST 2000
  
  ms.....done...
  
  
• From: Kamesh (@ hlr-42-11.tm.net.my) on: Sun Feb 13 23:42:42 EST 2000
  
  Srisailam Vasudevan
  Naamalae thaan nammala Bash saeidhukkanumaa??
  
  Sir, neenga yaaro naan yaaro...Naan yen ungala bash panna poren ??? ---- appadinnu ezhudi irukkingalae adhaan kaetten:-))
  
  
  
  
• From: Kamesh (@ hlr-42-11.tm.net.my) on: Sun Feb 13 23:44:04 EST 2000
  
  Srkanth
  
  On the contrary the (Isai) Puyal has just begun:-)
  
  
• From: Genuine musician (@ 202.9.148.84) on: Mon Feb 14 00:44:58 EST 2000
  
  I can see that there are die-hard fans of both I.R. and A.R.R.My only request to everyone is not to trash anyones music.Only a creator knows how difficult it is to compose.Mr Anand,pani vizhum was a path breaking song and is great to listen to even now whether it is in chala naatai or any naatai.You cannot trash such a great song or one of the greatest composers ever.And Minsaara Kanna was not entirely in Vasantha though it brought out every nuance in the raga.And all A.R.R. bashers,please ask yourself honestly what is yr personal grudge against this great composer?If you do that honestly you might actually start appreciating his music.Both I.R. and A.R.R. are great in their own way and it is a shame to see them trashed by unworthy people.
  
  
• From: e.hari (@ spider-tf083.proxy.aol.com) on: Mon Feb 14 12:05:57 EST 2000
  
  srikanth,
  We may need your expert services in musical defects in MSV thread. I thought, you can say few words, since you are the No 1 MSV fan in this forum.
  Why can't you pl ust ignore this petty IR-ARR
  fights, which dont seem to go anywhere.
  
  

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