Home   Forum   Wiki   Notes   Register   FAQ   Sitemap   About Us   Contact Us  

IR or ARR

Topic started by M.Anand (@ ihproxy1.proxy.lucent.com) on Tue Jan 18 01:03:04 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

hi all, I am Anand from bangalore and a new visitor to the tfm page. I am a great fan of both ARR and IR. I browsed through all the earlier threads on ARR and IR. It seems to me that there are quite a few anti ARRs out here.

Let me tell you something about IRs music. IRs music became popular and sounded different because he tried to bring in a westernization of Carnatic ragas in his songs. Even a dappanguthu was in Lathaangi or sivaranjani. That actually made the difference. Otherwise he is no great MD. One might argue that such a westernization or incorporation of a carnatic raga in a dappanguthu or jazz is something that demands great applause. But IR doesn't deserve that because, if u say u are tuning a song in a particular raagam, you have to bring out the nuances, the laya and bhaava of the raagam in to the song. Just traversing the swaras in the raagam here and there does not mean that u have tuned a song in that raagam. Ilayaraaja has done just that, a mere traversal through the swaras. In many places, there were apaswaras also. ARR has tuned very few songs based on Carnatic ragas but they were classics. For example Mettu podu in Anjali is a beautiful song in Ananda Bhairavi. He has brought out every nuance of the raagam in that song. Minsaara Kanna in padaiyappa is an excellent piece in vasantha. En mel vizhunda mazhai tuliye is again a beautiful piece in kaapi. A real mix of the east and west. That is what u call fusion. Ilayaraaja boasts of having composed songs in rare raagas like chala nattai, kanakangi etc. For example pani vizhum malar vanam in chala nattai is again a pure note traversal. There was no attempt to bring out the nuances in the raaga. So IR knew how to make songs sound good but ARR gives a fine polish to each and every one of his songs. IR composed music for 700 odd films. Hey Ram is his 785th film. Considering 7 songs per movie, he has tuned almost 5500 songs. Huge number indeed but hardly 5% of those songs are listenable others are 100% pure junk. But 99.9% of ARRs songs are listenable and they are also good numbers. What do you say about this?

Regards,
Anand

---

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: satish (@ 139.85.161.184) on: Thu Oct 19 14:36:57 EDT 2000
  
  Ramesh
  do u mean to say that IR is very modest down to earth person.
  
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 15:00:45 EDT 2000
  
  Dorai, sorry i am not 100% in agreeing with u.... IR worked/works (not sure about future) with new director's right from day 1 of his carreer - its not after ARR's arrival as u had said.... sorry i think u got it wrongly.... and u said "head strong attitude" - i tend again not to agree with u.... i can say the other way - especially in Rajini's case - cause Rajini was the first one to air something.....
  
  Dorai - ur other point - his best friends from childhood - again it goes to the same point i had said initially.... say i and some Mr.X is a very close friend.... we grew up together came to a field to gether became no.1 in our fields respectively..... say if some other Mr.Y comes in and suddenly says "hey u became no.1 because of Mr.X", then certainly iam going to be pissed off and certainly there is where the "hatredness" is put in on me by Mr.Y on Mr.X.... same is what happened in BR's case.... he and IR came together were no.1 in their fields, and suddenly the press started to say "oh its because of IR music that movies are running" and do u think BR or for that matter any other director will think....
  
  iam not saying IR does'nt have ego.... hey, tell me who does'nt have ego.... my point is "Its not only IR's fault"..... as far as his decline - i would simply say the same thing i said initially - "peopole's taste has changed....".... maybe he is not as humble as MSV, but wait why should he be? that's my question.....
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 15:04:07 EDT 2000
  
  Ramesh,
  I have met him and talked to him when he was in New Jersey for Tamil Association meet in 1994 and got a glimpse of his not so friendly replies to fans. One of the fan told him that he likes his music a lot and has all his "musical collections starting from Anakilli" for which IR retorted "its your Musical Collections, not mine". It was a totally embarassing for the fan.
  
  If IR was so well liked by Directors then he should have worked with them for more time and ARR would not have come in the picture so soon. Did you ever listen to his songs prasing himself or offending other MDs like for E.g,
  
  "Pattale Buthi Sonnar.." (Self Praising, "Naan Padum Padugal Antha Edugal, Athil Ezhuthinaanum Mudinthidathu"
  
  "Enna Pattu Padda..." which goes on like ....Alla Pollave Thallam Poduraan (hinting Sankar Ganesh???)
  
  "Naatupura Pattu Onu Naan Padikiren" which goes like... "Pavalaru Varadarasan Padi Vacha Pattu Idhu... Yen Sakthi Therunchirucha...Un Budhi Thellichiducha... (Taking a dig at ARR???)
  
  and may be more...
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 15:04:31 EDT 2000
  
  Ramesh,
  I have met him and talked to him when he was in New Jersey for Tamil Association meet in 1994 and got a glimpse of his not so friendly replies to fans. One of the fan told him that he likes his music a lot and has all his "musical collections starting from Anakilli" for which IR retorted "its your Musical Collections, not mine". It was a totally embarassing for the fan.
  
  If IR was so well liked by Directors then he should have worked with them for more time and ARR would not have come in the picture so soon. Did you ever listen to his songs prasing himself or offending other MDs like for E.g,
  
  "Pattale Buthi Sonnar.." (Self Praising, "Naan Padum Padugal Antha Edugal, Athil Ezhuthinaanum Mudinthidathu"
  
  "Enna Pattu Padda..." which goes on like ....Alla Pollave Thallam Poduraan (hinting Sankar Ganesh???)
  
  "Naatupura Pattu Onu Naan Padikiren" which goes like... "Pavalaru Varadarasan Padi Vacha Pattu Idhu... Yen Sakthi Therunchirucha...Un Budhi Thellichiducha... (Taking a dig at ARR???)
  
  and may be more...
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 15:08:01 EDT 2000
  
  Folks,
  Sorry for the duplicate posting.
  Ezhuthinaalum == Ezhuthinaanum
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 15:10:23 EDT 2000
  
  Dorai i agree with u on this - his "self praising" songs.....
  
  but about the other case - look its the way he speaks - why do u want him to be different? why can't u accept him as he is? why do u think that he is adamant or something? did he not accept to meet u? did he not talk to u? did he say something toooo harsh? may be ur friend had expected him to say "oh really, thats' great good work".... if that's what u want, i beleive, IR is not the person to talk like that.....
  
  ok, let me stop here..... there is really no point in discussing about other's attitude or character - we need to accept them as they are...
  
  fan, enaba edhu..... ellorum indha threadla irukeenga, can u all visit the two "postive threads" on ARR and IR and write something please...
  
  
  
  
• From: sabesan (@ 63.203.255.254) on: Thu Oct 19 15:11:06 EDT 2000
  
  closing bold
  
  sabesan
  
  
• From: Ravy (@ 158.106.50.3) on: Thu Oct 19 15:11:11 EDT 2000
  
  Dorai,
  
  Then why did MGR use other MDs like S-G (Idhya veenai, Naan En pirandhEn) and Kunnakkudi (Navarathinam). Do you think MSV was too busy to accept offers from MGR?
  
  
• From: Ramesh Ganesan (@ 206.175.176.2) on: Thu Oct 19 15:15:39 EDT 2000
  
  Dorai
  
  Your own posts answers your questions. Are u sure that he was hinting at Shankar Ganesan or ARR. If so why those question marks. Should not the benefit of doubt go to the person you are accusing.
  
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 15:18:12 EDT 2000
  
  Ravy,
  How many movies did S-G and Kunnakkudi did for MGR??. Even KVM has scored for MGR's old movies. Kunnakkudi was definetly the director AP Nagarajan's choice.
  
  Its not because MGR had a dislike or anything for MSV that he went to S-G but more for a better variety and promoting a budding musician(???).
  
  
• From: Ramesh Ganesan (@ 206.175.176.2) on: Thu Oct 19 15:20:27 EDT 2000
  
  Dorai
  
  Also I dont understand how that would have stopped ARR from comming into the industry and making it big. Are u suggesting that ARR has not talents and that it was IR's Rudeness that gave ARR a break.
  
  
• From: Dorai (@ 216.217.47.130) on: Thu Oct 19 15:24:03 EDT 2000
  
  Ramesh,
  The Benefit of doubt is not the question. I just used those songs as an example of IR's mind.
  
  Unless he specifically uses names like ARR or SG in his songs else benefit of doubt will go to IR and IR will be portrayed as the most "Down to Earth, Humble, Likeable..." personality.
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Thu Oct 19 15:53:42 EDT 2000
  
  
  I don't care if IR is rude or the nicest person on earth.But if his attitude is preventing him from opportunities to work in good films then I would be concerned.
  
  I don't know whether it's just a coincidence or not but whenever there is a verbal battle going on between IR and someone else.IR's statement is not made publicly.It is just insinuated from the other party's statement.
  
  So,I'm beginning to doubt accusation made on IR.At the same time,there is no smoke without fire which makes me think otherwise.His attitude seems enigmatic.
  
  Could someone throw light on this?
  
  Trend
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 16:02:11 EDT 2000
  
  ramesh and doarai, very interesting , i like your posts,
  
  Apart from talents, to enter tfm we need some push!, timing etc. Arr had both, besides being in the advt world he knew how talk over good deals, MR only tried arr, he did not assure him next movie, but arr made sure he will get the movie by working hard in Roja. Actually MR started to belive Arr only from thiruda thiruda
  
  But downfall of a person does not happen because of luck etc...,
  
  Ir is talented, yes i agree totally with you here.
  this is a big factor for his greatness , any day i will vouch any where ...dam this man is talented in his music. There is no chance for him to slip down the ladder just for the reason he failed deliver good music.
  
  The question is what bought him down the "commercial" ladder ?
  
  
• From: fan (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu Oct 19 16:07:06 EDT 2000
  
  Basically when we go and buy something we expect good customer service,
  Likewise producers "buy" music from the composers, they expect a level of customer service, hope people agree with me here,
  
  Directors and producers did not get the "customer service" so they went to a different merchant.
  Also point to note is buyer is not a chotta banana corporation, they have also achieved something in the industry.
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.227) on: Thu Oct 19 16:20:11 EDT 2000
  
  fan,
  
  He slipped down the commercial ladder because his gradual decline is faster now.I have a feeling that his talents are not what it was now.
  
  His disinterest in projects,his ego clashes with different people are just excuses.
  
  The reason is simple.He is not giving good enough music.
  
  I don't agree if someone starts criticizing people's tastes for enhancing his musical ability.
  
  If he has the potential let him come out with that.There is no point in speculating.
  
  As an ARR fan,I am desperately expecting some kind
  of challenge from IR.Is he interested?
  
  Trend
  
  

---

List all pages of this thread

Post comments