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"Thiruvasagam" in "Symphony Style" - Amazing attempt by Raja

Topic started by Fliflo (@ 146.186.113.254) on Wed Oct 10 18:27:06 EDT 2001.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

http://www.dinakaran.com/daily/2001/Oct/11/cinema/cineNews1.html

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: alaghu (@ 148.87.1.170) on: Thu Oct 11 18:16:21 EDT 2001
  
  Thanks for the info Neels.
  
  
• From: Andhra Police (@ 202.12.144.21) on: Thu Oct 11 19:57:35 EDT 2001
  
  I'm looking for a metally retarded thief, escaped and hides in garbage/trash cans. If anyone get's to know about him, please inform your nearest police station.
  
  
• From: Donga (@ 64.209.142.190) on: Thu Oct 11 20:29:53 EDT 2001
  
  Beware!! He might be posing as Andhra police
  
  
• From: kavipPiriyan (@ 203.141.89.173) on: Fri Oct 12 01:02:04 EDT 2001
  
  namachchivAya vAzhga, easanadi pORRi... has featured in one old bhakthi movie, i think thiruviLaiyAdal. I have listened to thiruvAsagam chanted by some professionals called 'OdhuvAr' (tamil)when i was young. Some phrases will throb your heart and induces some grief feelings in you. Though most of its effect is due to the rhyming , the lyrics also play vital role in melting the listner down. I wonder how G U Pope managed to come up with verbatim for these phrases.
  
  
• From: Raguvaran (@ 64.124.150.137) on: Fri Oct 12 01:34:40 EDT 2001
  
  I hope Raja find singer with deep muthalan kattai and ettan kattai for album. Best kattai in universe is kamalhassan and second is SPB.
  
  
• From: Raguvaran (@ 64.124.150.137) on: Fri Oct 12 01:34:49 EDT 2001
  
  I hope Raja find singer with deep muthalan kattai and ettan kattai for album. Best kattai in universe is kamalhassan and second is SPB.
  
  
• From: Raguvaran (@ 64.124.150.137) on: Fri Oct 12 01:35:57 EDT 2001
  
  Sorry for two-post.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.25.204) on: Fri Oct 12 02:42:21 EDT 2001
  
  u better be sorry for the three :-)
  
  
• From: innocent (@ 128.107.253.39) on: Fri Oct 12 05:17:23 EDT 2001
  
  "Best kattai in universe is kamalhassan and second is SPB"
  
  I thot simran was the best :-(
  
  
• From: Karthik S (@ 164.164.82.29) on: Fri Oct 12 06:20:01 EDT 2001
  
  innocent: sutham! It did make me laugh though!
  
  Neels: Thanks for dragging this thread to its original intention. It was very informative. Being an iyer, enakke thiruvasagam pathi onnum thriyathu...I'd consider myself a Psuedo-Iyer (Brahmin) that way! Not that I'm very proud of it but I'm doing nothing to get that idea out too!
  
  BTW, this CD could work probably like the success of the Gayatri mantram cassettes which succeeded like nobody's business in the Indian music market. Even T Series and a few other companies came out with their own versions (akin the the original by Times Music) and made lot of money. I heard its the highest selling devotional album in Indian so far!
  
  But, a few valid queries from my side:
  
  Who is the target segment for this compilation? Iyer -> Brahmins only?
  
  How would it affect/matter to any other person? Would that generate enough enthu for the layman who enjoys 'vaseegara' to buy it?
  
  And finally how would one judge this album's success in the market? Critical acclaim or sales?
  
  
• From: Normal Man (@ 63.60.216.59) on: Fri Oct 12 07:48:02 EDT 2001
  
  Karthik ----> In my very honest opinion dragging iyer and hence a sect fight is not warranted here. Hope you would realize the bad outcomes.
  
  
• From: Neels (@ 168.143.112.8) on: Fri Oct 12 12:29:08 EDT 2001
  
  I agree... even earlier someone unnecessarily dragged the sacred 'thread' into this thread. ;)
  
  Karthik, I can understand your feeling of guilt: These works never got their due recognition and kids were never exposed to these as they were merely brushed off as tough Tamil literary works.
  
  The 'Odhuvaars' in temples I think are fast becoming history! I have listened to one Ganesa PiLLai coming to the temple in my neighborhood and singing ThEvAram and ThiruvAchakam every morning in his 'gaNeer' voice with so much devotion... and more often than not with tears in his eyes. The onlookers were always hooked to the rendition of this old man in his seventies and would invariably get involved in those feelings. Such was the effect! He was in fact my inspiration to learn music and appreciate Tamizh.
  
  Coming back to the album, as far as the target audience is concerned, it's unfortunate that everything with a devotional element is equated with the brahmin community. In fact there's a much broader audience to such works. This particular attempt IMO doesn't appear to be one of those typical devotional albums that get released in dozens these days, catering to the 'seasons'... Amman season, Ayyappa season etc. Far from it!! It appears to be a unique musical experiment and would appeal to any one who is open to appreciating good music.
  
  BTW, the composers of these divine works called themselves mere devotees and not saints. Their traditional work (or the so called caste) was as varied as:
  1. Gnyana Sambandar (Vedic Scholar)
  2. NeelakanThar (Potter - clay pots)
  3. Appar (Farmer)
  4. Thiru nALaippOvAr (Maker of leather articles)
  
  Hope we get to hear more details of this album in the coming weeks.
  
  
• From: UVII (@ 63.225.17.34) on: Fri Oct 12 12:40:15 EDT 2001
  
  Neels,
  Thanks for your very informative postings, and making things clearer for doubters about the end audience. Thiruvasagam, is to do with Bakthi, and Tamil as I understand, and not with any community.
  
  Hope we get more details about the album soon.
  
  
• From: Trend (@ 216.68.113.230) on: Fri Oct 12 13:01:07 EDT 2001
  
  Neels,
  
  "I agree... even earlier someone unnecessarily dragged the sacred 'thread' into this thread. ;)"
  
  This 'sacred thread' originated from muti-threaded programming.Unnecessary usage of anything(be it sacred or multi thread)is equally fair/unfair IMO.
  
  
• From: pg (@ 12.20.190.1) on: Fri Oct 12 13:09:19 EDT 2001
  
  Why does rAjA have to mix WCM this ? He is becoming obsessed with WCM. For works like this minimal orchestration is the way to go.
  
  
• From: bb (@ 216.217.80.202) on: Fri Oct 12 17:53:06 EDT 2001
  
  what is the release date for this album?
  
  
• From: haris (@ 148.87.1.170) on: Fri Oct 12 19:00:07 EDT 2001
  
  (just from a historical and trandition perspective - not flames intended.)
  thiruvasagam has nothing to do with brahmins anyways - anyways. does somebody think hymns are written by and only for brahmins? i doubt how many of 63 nayanmaras are brahmins.
  
  
• From: eden (@ 210.214.5.225) on: Sat Oct 13 01:06:40 EDT 2001
  
  pg, if you study `Guru' (Malayalam) (or HTNI), IR has that extra thing to mix ICM & WCM without even a hairline of irritability. Hence, I feel it should be welcome. (There are umpteen fellows to do the pure, unadulterated stuff and even more fellows to come out with so-called-fusions which cause nausea)
  
  
• From: G.Ragavan (@ 202.144.44.234) on: Mon Oct 15 04:48:27 EDT 2001
  
  Thiruvasakam was composed by Maanikavasakar who was not a brahmin. It doesn't talk about particular community. Better let us not digress towards castism.
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.126) on: Mon Oct 15 05:20:41 EDT 2001
  
  
  "Best kattai in universe is kamalhassan and second is SPB"
  
  I thot simran was the best :-(
  
  
  No, innocent actually best kattai is naattu kattai. That has the sturdiness. I quote a line from a famous lyric to support my point:
  Nalla katta naattukkatta namma kitta maatikkita.
  
  
• From: Raguvaran (@ 64.124.150.146) on: Mon Oct 15 07:26:15 EDT 2001
  
  You guys not know difference of muthalan kattai and ettan kattai. Pity!
  
  
• From: NagaS (@ 202.144.108.132) on: Mon Oct 15 10:01:02 EDT 2001
  
  pg,
  
  >>>> Why does rAjA have to mix WCM this ? He is becoming obsessed with WCM. For works like this minimal orchestration is the way to go.
  
  Appadi paNNinaa Radio Mellisai paattu maathiri irukku-nnu comment varuthae :-)
  I still remember one comment in this forum when IR's Bharathy was released, 'T R pappa paattu maathiri irukku' ....
  
  I feel mixing WCM is a nice idea - may get more audience than regular stuff !
  
  NagaS
  
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.149.4) on: Mon Oct 15 11:07:36 EDT 2001
  
  Neels, thanks for those valuable inputs.
  Re: ThiruvAsagam & WCM - There comes a point in your career where you want to believe/prove that what you did throughtout your life is much more durable than a lifetime and not a mere money-making activity. IR used WCM to a great extent in his work. He has been able to get the popular/entertainment market accept and enjoy his work. Making a WCM heavy traditional/bhakthi work accepted by the people will be the crowning glory on his effort to integrate WCM with Indian music. I think IR believes that WCM is a 'kalaich chelvam' that bArathy wanted from other lands. Jayendra Saraswathi Swamigal is one of the most knowledgeable acharyas we have had and also the most socially conscious of them all. He is aware of IR's bhakthi and talent and so has blessed him. So we have somebody with genuine motivation and talent (we know his WCM skills). This should ensure a good bhakthi music being produced. I am not sure about the English part but I think IR has the talent to make it as non-intrusive as possible.
  
  
• From: KS (@ 165.122.129.199) on: Mon Oct 15 14:01:25 EDT 2001
  
  This is something i like about him. This time, he knows there is more likelihood of him being criticized by the religious people, fans like us, other normal listeners of our music and of course, the critics, all alike if he fails to deliver. And this time they are going to criticize him for both his devotional and WCM endeavor.
  
  See the challenge he has created for himself and the risk he is taking. And as usual, he is all alone:) I hope he clicks. I want him to.
  
  
• From: innocent on ignorant (@ 128.107.253.39) on: Tue Oct 16 04:55:00 EDT 2001
  
  Raguvaran,
  
  indha pEru vechuNdu neenga kattai paththi ellAm pEsa koodAdhu...1.5 kattaila pEsara ALu neenga
  
  
• From: Venki (@ 216.115.36.65) on: Mon Oct 22 13:26:35 EDT 2001
  
  Hi all
  I noticed in the Interlude of the song 'Thendralai Kanndu Kolla Maane..' from the movie 'Nilave Mughamkaatu' (Karthik and Devayani movie). There will be some slogams in Sanskrit which IR will be singing and a chorus in the background translates it in Tamil. It is a wonderful piece of Melody.
  
  Will Raaja handle Thiruvaasagam in the same manner. My bet is Raja can do anything.
  
  
• From: Peter Pan (@ 209.177.206.90) on: Mon Oct 22 20:43:29 EDT 2001
  
  Venki,
  That was a very interesting connection.
  The Sanskrit verses that IR sings while the female chorus is singing a Tamil translated version of the same is really beautiful. Probably it was a Jayadeva's Ashtapati. It was a complete surprise addition to the main song sung by Hariharan.
  
  

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