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COPYING - IN TAMIL FILM HISTORY

Topic started by s.senthilkumar (@ 203.197.154.163) on Mon Jan 24 07:23:36 EST 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

i think "copying" is there for a long time in tamil film history.Here we discuss the tamil songs copied from others.

1.Vedha:i know he always go for a hindi tune in his films(mostly for Modern theatres).No alterations! he just copy a full hindi song !

best examble:Manam ennum medai mele(Gil tho ye kulu yahag)

2.MSV: i hear that(from Sujatha's book"Neerkumiligal") "thulluvatho elamai" was a song copied from english to almost all famous indian langages.Is there any other songs MSV copied?

3.Illayaraja:Even the GOD of MUSIC Raja sir did some thing like this.He just used that "I love you"style from BOneyM Sunny for "darling darling"in priya.I have heard a totally same song like "Kanavu kanum valkkai yavum" in Hindi also.(i forgot the film).

and i dont know who is the MD for the song"ehu pal vadiyum mugam! ethai parpathu than sugam".But i heard the same song in an english film.

4.ARR : i was told from my friends that he did copying intelligently.drum beats and some music styels from cassettes like "enigma,ace of base".And the humming before the song "thillana thillana" is a 100%copy from the film"the island of Dr.Mozeru".

5.SA Rajkumar : a lot of help from hindi! best example "mallikai puve malligai puve parthaya" from "didi tera thevaru thevana"

5.DEVA:hee..hee..the master.(better we see how many songs he did on his own instead of seeing how many songs he copied!)

like wise there is a lot of songs are copied from Tamil to Hindi also..

Now its your turn friends....

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: aruLaracan (@ psiphi.umsl.edu) on: Thu May 4 21:54:34 EDT 2000
  
  prakash,
  
  what is an LS?
  
  
• From: Athi (@ proxy1.spaceproxy.com) on: Fri May 5 01:13:00 EDT 2000
  
  
  MS
  Some of us wanted to have a copied songs page. What do you want ?
  
  Exposing copies is ok. But why
  should a self-proclaimed expert
  group control it ? They are biased and they
  don’t have the credentials to do it.
  Their motives are all suspisious. Not one point raised by me has been answered.
  Krishna was very correct in his
  points. Even he was shut up by rajaG
  who said he doesn’t believe in democracy in
  this is newtfmpage. Howcan he say that?
  Krishna, ravi, murli, echo all told something against this expert group idea and they were
  all either shutup or ignored.
  
  Whoever finds out copy can give the readlauido/ mp3 files of the original and the copied
  song and let everyone discuss it. and
  vote on it. I was happy arun or someone gave proof about hello.mr.edhir kaatchi copy.
  Why should one selected group
  decide what is copy and what is not?
  people like srikanth have no decency.
  he may have written in newtfmpage for 2 years but
  he uses bad words and shout at others. However high a person might think of himself, his real colours come out with his use of bad words against others to just shut them up.
  
  : srikanth (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu May 4 14:26:02 EDT 2000
  echo ..what you say is bucket of _bull_shift,
  
  I donot know how administers of newtfmpage
  allows use of such bad words. everybody
  knows what srikanth meant when he said
  'shift". How is that newtfmpage administers
  are all silent seeing such bad behaviours
  here? Do they approve use of such words in newtfmpage? What are they going to do to
  control people who openly use bad words against otherpeople they don’t like?
  
  Ravi - yours posting is good. But the expert group should not be there. If
  the self proclaimed musicians and experts like srikanth, rajaG, MS and all people
  want to form a expert group and certify themselves, they can do it privately
  in e-mail. newtfmpage needs to be democractic,
  and no portion of newtfmpage should go into
  control of one selected group of people. The administers of newtfmpage are doing good
  job but they should not be silent seeing such activities of selfproclaimed experts.
  
  Athi
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.9) on: Fri May 5 01:26:31 EDT 2000
  
  Athi:
  
  Can you point out one sentence of mine where I have claimed to be an expert ? If not your arguement is baseless. Try highlighting and if I had done it I shall apologize.
  
  
• From: musicfan (@ cc563006-a.narltn1.nj.home.com) on: Fri May 5 01:35:05 EDT 2000
  
  well said prakash.
  I completely agree with you.
  That kind of Paranoia is what I fear is gripping us.
  I used to think about copies and stuff few years ago. Now I've resigned to what I think is the fact that all of IndianFM is no big deal reg. quality or originality.
  If the real joy of listening to music is clouded by the restlessness caused by doubts about originality mostly due to personal biases, one will certainly feel that he no longer gets the pleasure he once enjoyed.
  Every MD will ultimately get his due. One may point out what may think are copies keeping in mind that tfm or for that matter any Indian FM is nowhere the greatest music created.
  If we really want only 100% original music then I'm afraid we'll have to hear to Beethoven and stuff(if at all they are that original).
  
  
• From: murli (@ stealth.kirenet.com) on: Fri May 5 02:37:10 EDT 2000
  
  Athi, yes, newtfmpage should not be dominated by few people who shun off many others.
  
  MS you wrote Murli, believe me, nobody is dominating here. It is the content of the posts of a person that speaks for him.
  srikanth (@ 216.190.255.35) on: Thu May 4 14:26:02 EDT 2000
  echo ..what you say is bucket of _bull_shift,
  
  according to content of the above posting of srikanth, what "speaks for him" and what it says about him and his character? please enlighten us.
  
  you say that you arenot expert, but the expert group includes you with them. this itself shows how biased and `good' the group is.
  
  Please do not dominate and shout at others and throw them off. newtfmpage.com is not owned by this expert group.
  
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ qdsl153.sttl.uswest.net) on: Fri May 5 02:55:34 EDT 2000
  
  is it really unparlimentry in saying bull s...
  come on give us a break, when a person trashes every individual here with a clear personal vengance...I think using the word bull s is perfectly valid. Also dont call newtfmpage.com and gain a pity on you...The bull-nonsene (makes no big difference) continues in various forms.
  
  
  
  
• From: UV (@ wwwgate32.motorola.com) on: Fri May 5 05:38:15 EDT 2000
  
  "is it really unparlimentry in saying bull s... "
  well, that depends, to me even saying words like "S.O.B", f***** etc are not unparlimentary. How about you ?
  
  
• From: Krishna (@ mailserver01.sb.com) on: Fri May 5 08:14:56 EDT 2000
  
  RajaG:
  
  I wrote a similar word of caution when there was a seperate review thread opened up. I cautioned that people with biases against certain MDs could write bad reviews just to influcence others either not to listen nor support that MD's album. And you would see it in IR's album review's thread that it happened. Reviews are just but someone's opinions.
  
  It is similar here. Unless you have the scoresheets of compared songs for everyone's analysis, all the other opinions expert or otherwise are just that opinions. Without such note to note analysis, people could differ on what is similar and aht are not. The first line of a song could have some similarities but may have changed at the end of the first lien...The rest of the song would be totally different and so on. Some people would call the songs similar just based on the starting and others would argue it is dissimilar because the rest of the song are different. So I do not have a problem for people individually to express their views on such matters. Thats where discussion forums are useful. But where i think it becomes ingenuous is when some people are nominated to adjudicate the issue just because they have expressed their thoughts here in musical technical jargons previously.
  
  To a skeptic, such analysis couls raise some questions. I want to be sure that I do not mean disrespect to any reviewer but genuinely asking about questions one might have. For example, kiru pointed out a song with similarity to another. The comment back from the expert was along with some jargon on the beat cycles that kiru had just mistaken because of both songs had similar ringing of cowbells. Two issues: 1. How do we know the techinical explanation was true? 2. Was what kiru heard and comprehended just based on his sense of hearing and comprehension false and no merits? 3. How do we know that the expert's bias to an MD had nothing to do with the analysis of the songs simialrities?
  
  I mean no disrespect to the expert reviewer. He has sounded exteremely knowledgable about music. The musical training he has gone through sounds very impressive. And when he dedicated a song to IR, I sent a note of congratulations on a marvellous gesture. But he has also been never shy to express his biases (pro MSV, pro ARR, highly critical if not biased against IR). That is his right. I am strongly biased also. I am totally the opposite. I am a highly biased towards IR. It is ok for both of us just like anyone else to express our opinions as to anything about anyone's songs on any matter. But when a group decides that the opinions of a small group of people have more legitmacy than others, it becomes ingenuous and against how discussion forums go.
  
  I am sure the more vocal people in this group seem to be for this idea of the expert panel. Therefore, I am going to wager here. After the dust settles down, the discussions in this thread will become proMSV, pro ARR and anti IR to such an extent that IR may be depicted just being close to Deva in copying.
  
  Once again, I just want to be sure. I have not meant and do not mean any disrespect to any individual on the expert panel. But it is just the cynic in me that expects that the worst treatment will be meted out to IR and the principle that one of group of opinions are more legtimate than the others that bother me.
  
  
• From: srikanth (@ qdsl153.sttl.uswest.net) on: Fri May 5 09:39:51 EDT 2000
  
  
  "he has also been never shy to express his biases pro MSV,
  pro ARR, highly critical if not biased against IR
  
  frankly, bias applies towards one person,when it becomes more than 1, word bias cannot be used,
  once who is biassed,
  also the above person talks for Mr.Kiru, how did I come to a conclusion, expect for my inconclusive beat judgement, I was correct in every thing i mentioned, my postings did not hurt anyone, i just told technical aspects period and not copy, they are differened, I also added later, the present std of music has converted us
  as cop, so doubts are bound to happen.
  
  Kiru sir, tell me did I hurt you feelings here.
  
  Our poor friend is not able to digest things, he has personal vengance against me no arr or msv or not any one else.
  Also he failes to read many good points I post to support good music, including his idol.
  
  Also It is sad thing you failed to read my friend...suma ore 2nd postinga parthu just dont have opions on people,
  
  Where you few days ago, do you know the background of all this, we are doing this to stop musicians from flicking that is all, if you dont me what can I do, you have block....you can always start a group and go ahead, sure i am sure i will not fist fight with your motives.
  
  Secondly your claim for this thread will be anti-ir, how ? i dont think so, raja is great musician, no one can blame him for copying, unless it is proved perfectly with a score sheet , I dont have a fear in my mind on raja or msv, madiil ganame illai, why be afraid.
  
  "I have already posted this thangathee le ore kurai iruthanlum tharathil kurvadundoo" you did not read it or you read it and ignored it.
  
  Like you have every right to object,
  I have every right to participate here,
  
  I will contribute for betterment of music,
  let what people or abuse me tell me I dont care.
  
  
• From: MS (@ 129.252.22.9) on: Fri May 5 10:00:06 EDT 2000
  
  you say that you arenot expert, but the expert group includes you with them. this itself shows how biased and `good' the group is.
  
  Murli, nope. Your approach is like saying the tumbler is half empty. The above statement just shows that even fledgelings like me can participate in a good venture. If you are interested you are also welcome to contribute. It would rather be a better approach to start criticizing the actions than the persons on the basis of your presupposed misconceptions. So please let the discussions come up and when you find them not objectionable, you may raise your voice with valid points.
  
  It is like allowing somebody to make a software. Let the software come out and when you find bugs, report them. Please do not try to stop the software from getting churned out. Ofcourse, in the software industry it is not just the "experts" who make the software. Everybody contributes. It is just a team work. But the team has to be there. That is it.
  
  And if you are hell bent into knowing the qualifications of the members, well, you may wish to contact them privately and be convinced. After all, to you if it is just the ability of the panel people that is dubious, you may do what I said. If it is a question of an ego-clash, I must excuse myself as I donot feel I have any suggestions on hand.
  
  

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