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LAGAAN LOOSES OSCAR FALLS IN "NO MAN'S LAND"FROM BOSNIA.

Topic started by SHYAMSUNDAR.U. (@ 61.11.79.75) on Mon Mar 25 01:59:38 EST 2002.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

VERY IRONIC in a picture on cricket(LAGAAN) the oscar award has landed in "no man's land" from BOSNIA.SADLY,SHYAM SUNDAR.U.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Bharath (@ 156.153.255.134) on: Tue Mar 26 11:55:36 EST 2002
  
  To be honest, the racism issue always confused me. At one end i see sidney pottier who in his life had to struggle a lot to become someone.
  
  but then there are the biggies like oprah winfrey, michael jackson, OJ simpson, Mohd. Ali, the whole hip hop guys etc. They are all hugely hugely popular and are (were) respected.
  
  there is also this south african team selection, which i can blatantly say is unfair. some black players were selected because of the color and not because of the cicketing abilities. the resulting chaos lost them the aussie series.
  
  it was fun to see the indian media..none of them ..not even 1 single person writing an opinion piece about that isssue. because they were all afraid. that it might be construed as their commentary on our own reservation system..
  
  i have seen some oprah wnfrey shows about blacks not being recignised and some abt this equal opportunity policy.
  
  I think you have to give more time for blacks to grow in america. no artificial means can help them grow
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 12:04:30 EST 2002
  
  About the Racism thing - and what African-American actors have to say about the recent Oscars - check this out:
  
  http://www.globeandmail.com/frontpa
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 12:06:13 EST 2002
  
  Let's try once again:
  
  http://www.globeandmail.com/frontpage
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 12:13:26 EST 2002
  
  And really - what was Halle Berry saying when she accepted the award on behalf of Lena Horne and Dorothy Daindrige and "other actresses of colour" ? What was Sidney Poitier saying when he accepted his Lifetime Achievement Award?
  If Rasicm is too harsh a word for our oh-so-sensitive ears - then how about "systemic discrimination" based on skin pigmentation? Would that make it an easier pill to swallow.
  
  And about African-Americans scoring in "supporting" categories - isn't that telling?
  Whoopi Goldberg and Cuba Gooding Jr (in recent times) playing nice-nice second fiddle to white protagonists like Tom Cruise and Patrick Swayze/Demi Moore. Denzel Washington won Best Actor after a gap of 40 years (after bravura performances in Malcolm X, Hurricane, Philadelphia, and Courage Under Fire...) That's revealing, if not enlightening.
  
  
• From: (^!^) (@ 208.24.179.211) on: Tue Mar 26 12:22:31 EST 2002
  
  Life always evens out - for all the 'unfair' absence of awards to black performers in the movies, there are many 'unfair/undeserving' multi-millionaires out of the hood for writing strings of cuss-words and speaking it in rhythm with some heavy bass music, otherwise called as rap. You bet, that it is said tongue in cheek, but not without an element of truth :-)
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 12:23:16 EST 2002
  
  Here is another interesting analysis of Race/Power in Hollywood - particularly in the portrayals of African-Americans (and the opportunities which come their way.)
  
  http://www.igc.org/solidarity/atc/87Keizer.html
  
  There is another fine documentary about "Racism" in Hollywood, the name of which I can't recall rightaway. But I will post it when I can confirm the title. Thanks.
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 156.153.255.134) on: Tue Mar 26 12:24:15 EST 2002
  
  well.. we also have british actors/actresses complaining about bias..
  
  8 out of every 10 actors actually miss out on an oscar after very good performances. The list can go on and on..
  
  i am saying the probability of a black actor falling in the 8 is very easy.
  
  yes racism exists..but I have my own reason why black actors actresses dont get the biggies.
  
  if you take about 200 hollywood movies released every year 10 would have black male/female in the lead. if you filter out the successfull movies it sometimes is 1 or zero.
  
  over all these years you can come up with 3 denzel washinton movies i can come up with 2 morgan freeman movies.
  
  compare the list of white-stars-good-performance-ingored Vs black-star-good performances-ignored.
  
  you will know the truth. which is that black stars dont get to play that many roles. because the audience are essentially white sometimes black stars act in movies dealing with black issues and so have lesser target audience..
  
  consequently less of everything else..
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 12:41:19 EST 2002
  
  Bharath - thanks for your post. Please do read the two links (esp. the first one which is a report from NY). They underscore a few of your points.
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 12:43:43 EST 2002
  
  And BTW - I can come up with more DW and MF movies if that is indeed your wish (I pointed out the DW movies in random...)
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 156.153.255.134) on: Tue Mar 26 13:19:43 EST 2002
  
  good posts Naaz,
  
  though i have some minor quibbles with the secoond link. the author rips apart savin private ryan unjustly.
  
  the author is factually incorrect and is also unreasonable.
  
  
• From: sarat (@ 128.192.5.156) on: Tue Mar 26 17:00:09 EST 2002
  
  did anybody explain how rajini movies were such major hits in japan?
  
  
• From: sarat (@ 128.192.5.156) on: Tue Mar 26 17:01:07 EST 2002
  
  I forgot to add 'Land of Kurosawa'
  
  
• From: Bharath (@ 156.153.255.126) on: Tue Mar 26 18:01:47 EST 2002
  
  sarat,
  
  they were amusing themselves.. something equalant to cartoons..
  
  we shouldnt kid ourselves that they were intelluctually stimulated by muthu..
  
  remember the di di's comedy show ..
  
  
• From: sarat (@ 67.34.132.42) on: Tue Mar 26 20:33:11 EST 2002
  
  bharath
  
  Thats a convenient answer
  
  
• From: K (@ 63.48.63.101) on: Tue Mar 26 20:37:09 EST 2002
  
  I heard that there was no "Proper Recommendation" from "High Places" inspite of Aamir Khan's efforts. Is it true?
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Tue Mar 26 23:01:55 EST 2002
  
  A conspiracy theory.....
  
  Major awards were given to "blacks/colored" this year to further support US War propaganda in the Third World.."Hey look, we are a democratic, free and fair country - we up hold our minorities!"
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Tue Mar 26 23:09:17 EST 2002
  
  >>Oh dear, now there is no way out of this endless song-and-dance impulse. It is "us" after all...Or is it?<<
  
  Bharat, Naaz..
  
  Don't forget that we are discussing these things in newtfmpage...Tamil Film Music....TFM has brought forth many genius talents.
  Films with songs have given these 'genius talents' the fodder to bring out their best giving them a reach and following which even clasical musicians can't muster. And remember that we are from a land that has one of the world's richest music and dance systems. So our films too will naturally have strong roots in them - you can't deny films are a socio-cultural phenomenon.
  If film technology existed in the west prior to the Industrial Revolution, you would have found them filled with Mozart, Beethoven, Bach's...compositions and countless Operatic and Ballet dream sequences !!!
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Tue Mar 26 23:27:19 EST 2002
  
  Why the Industrial Revolution happened in the West and not the East ? Why did Gandhi have to say "I think it is a very good idea" when asked what he thought about western civilization....I still wonder...will I feel like a fish out of water if I didn't have this "Matrix" like trappings of westernity on me or can I....these question strike me often..
  
  The Industrial Revolution has brought us on one hand to the brink of nuclear and environmental disaster within 300 years of its birth..on one hand...on the other hand new possibilities and horizons have opened up...
  
  The West..the rich top half of the globe....after shaking themselves off from the control of the Church (Dark Ages) spawned a period of renaissance in thinking that led to the development of material sciences...with the Church out of power and the French Revolution..the elite were in danger of losing their position...and when they found that inventions from the material sciences could be put to commercial use and still hold sway over the masses...major investments were done and thus you had the Industrial Revolution, a change in the social structures of the West...as factories needed raw material..thus began the journey of the parasitic leviathan called 'Colonialism'.
  
  And what were we doing in the bottom half of the globe which was richly gifted with natural abundance ? We were all busy with Philosopy and the Inner Universe...lost in a kind of Virtual Reality until the "parasitic leviathan" stalked in and pulled the plugs.
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Tue Mar 26 23:33:52 EST 2002
  
  And Bharath..since you were mentioning MTV...does MTV have a discussion forum like newtfmpage where you can have serious and quality discussion about a particular musical style of a group, band or composer ?
  
  
• From: Naaz (@ 24.76.127.63) on: Tue Mar 26 23:58:51 EST 2002
  
  It is undeniable that the Indian Film Industry has given "us" some great and admirable personages...in music, acting, lyrics, direction,writing...
  
  I just have a bit of a hard time accepting that "song and dance" sequences (perfectly choreographed from the disco floor to the paddy fields - with amazing "transistorised" voices and chorus) are a reflection of the Indian "socio-cultural" psyche (a troubling monolithic without heterogeneity?? That's already beginning to sound like a generalisation...)
  I mean, yes, dance-dramas and dance/music traditions from India pre-date their "Western" counterparts, and are rich and invaluable in the many sensory delights they offer...But how does running around trees (or thrusting one's hips with a bevy of extras in the middle of Vijay Path) a reflection (or outcome?) of the Indian "socio-cultural" psyche...
  I think "pastiche," in this song-and-dance case, would be a better word, for it highlights the "artifice" (which is the "musical" or even "opera") and makes sure that it is never confused (substituted) for/with "actuality"
  Romantic? Yes. Realism? Oh no,no.
  
  
  
• From: cosmician (@ 194.170.127.161) on: Wed Mar 27 00:22:59 EST 2002
  
  Ah...Naaz...all those MJ style gyrations and pelvic thrusts are an unfortunate decadence brought forth by the urbanization of our culture and the huge growth in a impoverished segment that is neither rural nor urban but trapped in between and now have their own sub-culture...and whom these song and dance sequences are targetted at ! Correct me if I am wrong.
  
  

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