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Old Songs

Topic started by TFM Group on Tue Jan 27 15:47:28 EST 1998.
All times in EDT/EST +9:30/10:30 for IST.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Hema (@ snfcba06-16.splitrock.net) on: Mon Sep 13 18:51:27 EDT 1999
  
  Hi,
  Can someone tell me which film is this song from..
  Chittu kuruvi mutham koduthu
  senthida kandane..
  I think the cast is Devika.
  Thanks,
  Hema
  
  
• From: sk (@ azure.nus.edu.sg) on: Mon Sep 13 21:00:19 EDT 1999
  
  Hema:
  
  It is from pudhiya paRavai starring Sivaji Ganesan
  and Saroja Devi. You can listen to the song in
  real audio from here..
  
  members.xoom.com/ppp_songs/ps.html
  
  
• From: Bhasker (@ ppp-89-25.bng.vsnl.net.in) on: Tue Sep 14 06:38:03 EDT 1999
  
  Pala:
  
  aththikkAi definitely means antha thik kAi. Similarly, iththikkAi means intha thik kAi. It is really curious that in song full of kAi, only one really refers to the vegetable.
  
  Let us next analyze entha oor endravanE and see how many refer to real places.
  
  
• From: Pala (@ proxy.primus.com.au) on: Tue Sep 14 07:00:58 EDT 1999
  
  Bhasker
  Thanx for the clarification.Kannadhasan KAIYAI vaithu oru thiruvilaiyadale pannittaru.He was a truely great song writter.
  Can you elaborate on your suggestion of ENTHA OOR ENDRAVANE!( or Sendravane).
  I still think Athi Kai is avery nice song.The more I listen, the more I like the song.
  
  
• From: Bhasker (@ ppp-89-25.bng.vsnl.net.in) on: Tue Sep 14 07:33:37 EDT 1999
  
  Pala:
  
  Here are some lyrics from entha oor endravanE (it IS 'endravanE'):
  
  udalooril vAzhnthu vandhEn
  uravooril midhandhu vandhEn
  karuvooril kudi pugunthEn
  maNNooril vizhunthu vittEn
  
  I know there is a Karuvoor (Karur). Do the other places also exist?
  
  
• From: Pala (@ proxy.primus.com.au) on: Wed Sep 15 08:36:21 EDT 1999
  
  Bhasker
  The Karuvoor refers uterus(foetus in womb).
  The place you mentioned could be Karoor not Karuvoor.Hope someone from TamilNadu can clarify this(Karuvoor or Karoor)
  
  Udalooril Vazhnthirunthen
  Uravooril Mithanthirunthen
  Karuvooril Kudi Pugunthen
  Mannooril Vizhunthu Vitten
  Kannooril Thavzhnthirunthen
  Kaiyooril Valarnthirunthen
  Kaalooril Nadanthu Vanthen
  Kaalaiyoor Vanthuvittaen
  
  Velooraip Paarthuvitten
  Vzhiliyooril Kalanthuvitten
  Paaloorun Paruvamennum
  Pattinathil Kudi Pugunthen
  Kaathaloor Kaattiyaval
  Kaattooril vittuvittal
  Kanniyoor Maranthavudan
  Kadalooril Vizhunthuvitten
  
  Pallathoor Thannil Ennai
  Parithavikka Vittu Vittu
  Maettooril Antha Manggai
  Maelaeri Nindru Kondaal
  Keezhlooril Vaazhlvatharkum
  Kilimozhiyaal Illaiyadaa
  Maelooru Povathrkum
  Velai vara villaiyadaa!
  
  I believe VELOOR is not a place(?Vellor prison).
  This is a song full of OOR but none with refernce to actual OOR(place).
  
  
  
  
• From: Pal (@ 208.227.135.231) on: Wed Sep 15 10:37:10 EDT 1999
  
  Pala & Bhaskar!
  
  Again we are looking at the word play of Kannadasan.
  
  All the 'oors' are available in Tamil Nadu.
  But all the oors are referred here in different
  context.
  
  The whole song he is talking about a life of a guy. Here the explanations for all the oors(There could be a difference of opinion).
  
  Udalur - father's body.
  uravur - koodal
  karuvur - mother's womb
  mannoor - earth.
  kannoor - everyone's eyes. being beatiful everyone looked at me.
  kaiyur - hands. kaigalil anaithu konjinargal.
  kaloor - legs started walking.
  kalaiyur - youth. I had grown up.
  
  veloor - girl's eyes . vEl pOnra kangal
  vizhiyur - Our eyes started talking.
  paloorum - adolescent love
  kadahloor - love
  kaatoor - love failure
  kanniyur - girl . I forgot the girl
  kadaloor - tears
  pallathur/mEtur - she left me and married some one in a higher society.
  keezhur - earth/boolagam
  melur - heaven
  
  Hope this one clarifies you.
  
  
  
• From: sk (@ azure.nus.edu.sg) on: Wed Sep 15 16:59:22 EDT 1999
  
  Pal:
  
  neengal oor oorAi sutri 'the down under' pOi
  chErndheergaLO? :-)
  Very nice explanations! innum oru wordplay
  paadal eduththu ezhudhungaL please!
  
  
• From: Bhasker (@ ppp-89-56.bng.vsnl.net.in) on: Thu Sep 16 03:38:11 EDT 1999
  
  Pal, Pala:
  
  Kannadasan is great at punning. This song is full of them. I know that kadaloor exists. Pal's explanations are wonderful.
  
  Let us try pArthEn sirithEn from veerAbhimanyu next. Here are my favorite lines:
  
  endha malai thEn idhuvena malaithEn
  
  
• From: Bhoori (@ synvpn.synplicity.com) on: Thu Sep 16 17:03:39 EDT 1999
  
  Excuse me, how is this different from "Kannukku Mai Azhagu" song? This is a formula song that has acquired a patina of greatness because of its antiquity and the fact that is written by an acknowledged genius. Would anyone consider me a great poet if I write like
  
  
  "Kalaiyuril ezhundirundhen"
  Kappiyoorai kuditthuvitten
  Car-ooril yerik konden
  Kadaloorukku poi vitten!"
  
  
  
• From: sk (@ azure.nus.edu.sg) on: Thu Sep 16 18:17:44 EDT 1999
  
  Bhoori:
  
  Of course you are a great poet by modern standards. neengaL
  ezhudhiya nAladiyAr pOdhum adhai nilai niRuththa! Kannadhasanin
  endha oor paadalaiyum adhaRkku Pal avargaL ezhudhiya
  viLakkaththaiyum padikkum pOdhu neengaL kaNNooril nindru vitteer!
  konjam thalaiyoor varai sendru sindhiththu padiyungaL. appOdhu
  neengaL ezhudhiya 4 varigaLukkum endha oor-il uLLa
  varigaLukkum irukkum viththiyAsam puriyum. :-) I think you made
  your comment in some haste after a hurried look at endha oor.
  The song does not stand because of Kannadhasan, but because of
  its own strength. Further, your comparison of this song with
  VM's kaNNukku maiyazhagu is improper. adhu suththamAna varNanai
  idhuvO vArththai viLaiyAttil thaththuvam.
  
  
• From: Sriram Lakshman (@ spider-wo014.proxy.aol.com) on: Fri Sep 17 02:30:07 EDT 1999
  
  Guys, do not forget 'Therottam aanantha seNbaga poovaattam' from Noolveli.
  SK, another KD song for a similar situation as in 'Entha oor', 'Mayakkam enathu thaayagam' from 'Kungumam'.
  
  
• From: Bhasker (@ ppp-89-53.bng.vsnl.net.in) on: Fri Sep 17 07:35:40 EDT 1999
  
  Guys:
  
  There is another classic from poovA thalaiyA but this one is from Vali. It is madhuraiyil parandha meen kodiyai. Again this is also varNanai but the way he uses the various parts of Tamil Nadu in the comparison is excellent.
  
  
• From: Pala (@ proxy.primus.com.au) on: Fri Sep 17 08:02:16 EDT 1999
  
  Bhasker
  I'm sorry I can't chip in this time as I do not have the lyrics of VEERA ABIMANYU.I remember having the audio, but the cassette is not with me .As usual I believe someone has borrowed and not return--one way street.
  Sorry I pass.
  Hope Pal,SK,MS orKOOTHTHAN can contribute their views on this.
  Pal's explanation and analysis of OOR is fantastic.
  SK's reply to Bhoori is very intelligent analysis.
  I have very limited access to the Tamizhl songs lyrics.
  
  
• From: Pala (@ proxy.primus.com.au) on: Fri Sep 17 08:17:19 EDT 1999
  
  Bhoori
  Can you analyse your 4 line and see if that makes any sense!
  I believe there is no link between lines 1-2-3-4.
  If you look at lines of ENTHA OOR ENDRAVANE there are 24 lines and they are all linked,in sequence.
  However, your contribution has been well received and appreciated.Very good of you to come up with your own creation.
  
  
• From: Kishore Krishna (@ unknown-11-132.clorox.com) on: Fri Sep 17 22:16:26 EDT 1999
  
  There's no place (thread?) to make recommendations for old good (rare) musicals, so I'm going to do it here. Definitions of good/rare are of course subjective.
  
  I got 'kalyaanam panni paar' by Vijaya films - it appears to have been made close on the heels of missiamma. Music by S Rajeswara Rao and lyrics by Thanjai Ramiahdass. A very pleasant comedy with Gemini, Savitri, Thangavelu, EV Saroja, TR Ramachandran, Jamuna, Balaiah & SV Ranga Rao.
  
  The songs were all good, the more hummable ones being - pOthum unthan jaalamE..., kaiyum kaiyum kalanthidavaa jollyaagave..., and aanandam paramaanandham baalakrishnanin leelaiyai unarntha bhaktha kOdikke brahmaanandham... There is also a copy of brindaavanamum nandhakumaranum with the same interludes.
  
  
• From: Bhoori (@ user-33qtioe.dialup.mindspring.com) on: Sat Sep 18 03:34:50 EDT 1999
  
  Pala & SK:
  
  I am sorry, but I find it difficult to accept that Endha Oor is written well. Good melodious tune, nice voice, probably a good scene in the movie too but the lyric is gimmicky. If you take the gimmick out, there is nothing in the lyric.
  
  Pal: I am surprised that you were actually looking for a link! The point is adding oor at some places in a normal thought stream doesnt make a good lyric.
  
  SK: IMO, the similarity between this and Kannukku Mai Azhagu is the algorithmic approach taken by the lyricist. Many, including me, pillory VM for his Objectukku Property Azhagu formula. Kannadasan also has followed a similar approach here. It looks like he decided the song should be a life in a nutshell. Take any sentence like Kadalittha Penn Kai vittu vittaal. Kannadasan simply converts it into
  
  Kadhaloorai Kaattiyaval
  Kaattooril Vittu vittaal.
  
  
  Alternatively,
  
  Kadhallooril Vaazhndha Mangai
  Kaiyoorai Kazhuvi Vittal.
  
  These lines are approximately equally poetic. Whats the big deal? What purpose does the "Oor" suffix serve here? It is a gimmick, pure and simple. Just doesnt make much sense. You could apply the same algorithm to a sentence like "Kalaiyil Ezhundhu Kaappi Kuditthen" and convert that into
  
  Kalaiyooril Ezhundhirundhen
  Kaapiyoorai Kuditthu Vitten
  
  Its the same algorithm applied to a mundane activity.
  
  If you are still not convinced, look at the following lines:
  
  Ennaadu Endravale
  Irundha Naattai Sollava
  Annaadu .... (dont know the exact lines here)
  
  Udal Naattil Vazhnthirunthen
  Uravu Naattil Mithanthirunthen
  Thai Naattil Kudi Pugunthen
  Thamizh Naattil Vizhunthu Vitten
  Kann Naattil Thavzhnthirunthen
  Kaal Naattai Nadanthu Vanthen
  Kai Naattai Valarnthu vitten
  Kaalai Naadu Vandhadaindhen
  Vel Naattai Paarthuvitten
  Vzhi Naattil Kalanthuvitten
  Thenadum Paruvamennum
  Thirunaattil Kudi Pugunthen
  Kaathal Naadu Kaattiyaval
  Kaanaatril vittuvittal (Kaanaatril - Kaattu nadhiyil)
  Kanni Naadu Maranthavudan
  Kavalai Naattil Vizhunthuvitten
  
  Palai Naadu Thannil Ennai
  Parithavikka Vittu Vittu
  Mel Naattil Antha Manggai
  Maelaeri Nindru Kondaal
  Keezh Naattil Vaazhlvatharkum
  Kilimozhiyaal Illaiyadaa
  Mael Naadu Povathrkum
  Velai vara villaiyadaa!
  
  With Naadu, if I can write this algorithmic song in 5 minutes, how can anyone accept this as a truly great lyric? Some of you may point out that I am just modifying an existing song which is lot easier. I would like to point out that I am Bhoori and that was Kannadasan and our capabilities are vastly different. In fact, with naadu, it may have better from a pun point of view. Naadu could hv been used as in country, naadu as in seeking, Kainaattu as I hv used it, combining aaru as in river in some places, a good wordsmith may actually do a better job than with oor.
  
  Also, contrast this with the atthikkai song. Atthikkai has lot of kais. In very few instances, these kais point to an actual vegetable. Our enjoyment of that lyric comes from the fact each kai is there not as a part of gimmick. Without the kai, the song cant exist. Take the oor out in this song. What difference does it make?
  
  Hope that I hv made my thought process clear here...
  
  
• From: Bhoori (@ user-33qtioe.dialup.mindspring.com) on: Sat Sep 18 03:36:34 EDT 1999
  
  Oops! I hvnt provided a mail link to myself in my postings...
  
  

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