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TFM without IlayaRaaja

Topic started by mfm (@ 203.120.115.1) on Tue May 12 22:59:35 EDT 1998.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

Shall we imagine what would have happened to TFM, if there is no IR since 1976 till say, the debut of Deva, ARR etc., Ofcourse, everybody said that he made Tamilians to divert from Hindi songs. Won't it be interesting, if we can go into more detail

Without the debut of IR,
1. would MSV continued to rule TFM? for how long?
2. who would have took TFM from MSV? again for how long?
3. what would have happened to those films in which IR is the hero? (Not to mention everybody knows)
4. would there be so many no. of tamil films produced/released in that period
5. would TFM sought a MD from North India like RD Burman etc.,

Note: I would say IR is the inspiration for the present MDs.

Firstly Deva, he won't even exist without IR 'cos his compositions is Deva's Film Music Reference Manual, Dictionary, Encyclopaedia. Sirpi, SA R.Kumar etc., would also fall into this category

I welcome any corrections to my second point. Thin k about ARR... (1) he breathed the air that IR breathed (2) he was brought up under the shelter of IR (3) he learnt what is the definition of a complete Film MD (4) he is a sincere student(which ARR failed to mention) from the SCHOOL of IR specialised in complex orchestration & mixing(manual) (5) Can anybody add more...

All these not for 1 yr or 2 yrs or even 5 yrs but for 10 years - a DECADE experience for ARR with IR.

Can ARR or his fans rule out the fact that he did not benefit anything under the shadow of IR to attain the place he is enjoying now?? As many of us exclaim that IR is great creation of GOD, I think GOD also created ARR [not as great as IR anyway :-) ] to grew with IR and oneday get atleast a group of people to say that he replaced IR(which I do not agree anyway).

A few would ask why not VS Narasimhan or other veteran player in IR's team did not come like ARR. Well that's why I say ARR is a sincere STUDENT of IR School. GOD created ARR to be smart, intelligent and courageous enough to study IR for such a long time and get ARR to perform something different from what IR did. I think it can happen only for a limited period, but I wish ARR a long life in TFM & otherFM. B'cos IR is a ocean by himself, it will be a miracle if anyone can do things different from him for a long time.

Before I continue, let me get my views validated by the experts out there in DF.

Though I am hard-core, devotee of IR, I do not dislike or "hate" other MDs(ofcourse I do not listen to their songs:-). I believe there are geniune TFM fans/experts who can contribute to the imagination of "TFM without IR" and make this topic interesting & healthy.

mfm

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Machi (@ 128.226.107.5) on: Sun Jan 21 11:08:15 EST 2001
  
  "Though I am hard-core, devotee of IR, I do not dislike or "hate" other MDs(ofcourse I do not listen to their songs:-). I believe there are geniune "
  This is the same punch line I hear from every HCIRF. Given the trend in this DF that IR is equated to anything between a saint and a God, you need not tell this. Just tell us that you are a HCIRF, we will make out the rest. Cut the crap like "I do not hate other people's work" etc. etc.
  
  
• From: S T S (@ 65.3.195.189) on: Sun Jan 21 13:24:24 EST 2001
  
  TFM without IlayaRaaja
  
  ...Does not make any difference to deafs.
  
  
• From: G. Kuppusamy (@ 156.153.255.195) on: Mon Jan 22 02:53:09 EST 2001
  
  Where as IR-SJ combination had given 1000 solo numbers during the period 80 to 90 and haraly 10 songs are remembered today...
  
  a.a, how many numbers of MSV (or) MSV-TKR (or) KVM songs are remembered now?? how many gems of MKT and T.R.Mahalingam are remembered now?? does it mean that they were unpalatable songs...never.
  
  TFM is yet to find another 'thirai isai thilagam'; yet to find another 'mellisai mannar(gaL)'; yet to find another 'isai gnani'. they all ARE phenomenon in one or more aspects of very broad spectrum called TFM. Their non-existence would definitely have had its toll in TFM.
  
  you don't like IRs music that much. fine..nothing to worry because that aspect of TFM you do not like it doesnt mean that you should underestimate a phenomenon. if same kind of setup or trend or whatever it is followed by ARR, then ARR is also a phenomenon of this part of TFM nobody can refute it.
  
  Maarudhal yenbadhu ulagin niyadhi/iyalbhu TFM is not an exception to this.
  
  NOM
  
  -kupps
  
  
• From: Kupps (@ 156.153.255.195) on: Mon Jan 22 03:03:06 EST 2001
  
  tfm without IR...
  
  till 92 people would be sinking in 'jigar' 'magar' 'dil' kind of Hindi SARs/Devas' songs.
  
  wud have lost some of the best tunes of TFM ever had.
  
  wud have lost people's awareness among WC and IC fusion stuff
  
  wud have lost many 'man vaasanai' songs...
  
  wud have lost a composer who cud compose in 7 days for an entire movie.
  
  wud not have given birth right(IR v/s ARR) of TFM DFers.
  
  wud still have marched ahead with some other trend or trend setter ( imo SG wud have done some better movies).
  
  wud have devoid of mukkals and munangals in song even though them seem to fit to the scene.
  
  wud have march past sheding extra burdens in the name of tavsar et al.
  
  wud have found X v/s ARR...
  
  
• From: vengayam (@ 202.54.94.54) on: Mon Jan 22 07:11:06 EST 2001
  
  Ilayaraja's skill is undoubted but it was he who started the trend of diminishing the values of lyrics the budding partnership with vairamuthu was broken... & so we had some great music without soul. a beautifully made up body in the evening is garish the morning after. that is the fate of most of IR's numbers( considering his output yes about 5% would stand the test of time.no mean feat by itself) Where ARR scored over was he took it to the next step backwards, forwards Or sidewards wherein you should not at all know the lyrics or even the language & preferably sung by a non tamilian. so we have people craving for more..
  In this context i once again strss that visu-ramu with kannadasan is the best thing to have happened to TFM by a long mile. Period.
  
  
• From: Fliflo (@ 130.203.161.68) on: Mon Jan 22 08:35:56 EST 2001
  
  Forget IR's 70-80's. How many of you hear rahman's gentleman, kadhalan, roja and so on. his songs have much shortened life somewhere between 2-4 years.
  
  
• From: rjay (@ 206.150.228.62) on: Mon Jan 22 09:44:27 EST 2001
  
  How many of you listen to old songs, by KVM, MSV,
  IR and ARR, anyway!
  
  I think lack of longevity is more due to availability of more and more choices rather than
  quality of the songs themselves.
  
  Also, there might be few other factors. "Pasumai
  niraindha ninaivugalae" is a very long-living song, because there is no other song suited to the college farewell evening. The next choice would be "Mustafa".
  
  
• From: Bala (@ 203.197.137.172) on: Wed Jan 24 14:52:15 EST 2001
  
  Well said rjay. When 50th year of independece was celeberated at Nehru stadium GangaiAmaran and his orchestra with his brother and his sons could not trace even a handful of Patriotic songs composed by IR for his films from 76-96. Such songs to suit occasions and sentiments were really lacking. Only love, a group 'Kolavai noise', a old Kelavi speak, Aatha, Rasa etc phrased songs were his highlights.
  
  Even right now TFM without IR,is currently prevelant. With due respects to his precedence, be it good or bad, TFM without IR is still continuing its glory from a glorious past to a glorious future, 1. with newer recording / orchestration techniques, 2. adherence to shruthi (even when MDs sing), 3. innovative ideas and lyrics, 4. newer vistas of Keyboard sounding, 5. PROPER GENUINE PAYMENT TO MUSICIANS, even if their previous samples are used, 6. increased oppurtunities to vocalsits, 7. RESPECT AND DIGNITY TO SOUND RECORDISTS(trusting local talents - No import from Bombay to mixdown), 8. Sharing of work among MDs without greedy overbooking for themselves, 9. Everybody gets fair chances, 9. musicians are treated humane without bossing over in talk-backs and 'bandhas' like ringing the bell (Kalyanam bell) to announce the entry of the MD into the studio, 10. due respect to the film producers with a courteous wait, rather than asking them to come on 'Q', 11. no alteration of the composing room with a special pedestal for the MD to sit on a deer-skin, 12. Asst.music directors and arrangers are treated with dignity and given due publicity acknowledging the team work instead of projecting it as a one man show, 13.even amidst busy scheduldes fans can have a glimpse of the MD AND apart from all these the present day tfm is getting best quality songs on par with the international audience. Leave the boasts of NO hindi songs in TN with IR. But there were Hindi technicians Bombay recordings for tamil movies and other state singers. The current day MDs have made the present TFM without IR, presenting songs which are hot cakes all over the world, North, South, East or West of India, Tamil songs being bought on Q line in France, Italy, Germany, UK and USA and even to the level of the present tamil tunes being lifted hindi and telugu films on popular demand.
  
  This is happening today in TFM without IR. It is the Humility which always wins!
  
  
• From: Machi (@ 128.226.107.53) on: Wed Jan 24 15:16:11 EST 2001
  
  1. Without IR, we would have lost so many scintillating BGMs.
  2. Without IR, we would have not witnessed some beautiful and well thought out orchestrations, and some magical interludes.
  
  
  
• From: S (@ 208.24.179.207) on: Wed Jan 24 15:28:45 EST 2001
  
  Bala,
  looks like you were one of those directors who stood in queue...
  
  
• From: poda (@ 198.4.92.5) on: Wed Jan 24 16:14:00 EST 2001
  
  france italy germany? are you talkign about gopal palpodi?.
  
  1919. ok? Did raja stop anyone from making patriotic movies? or he refused work for those movies?. NO one made patriotic movies thats all, what anyone can do about it. If he can make a songs like manidha manidha, ram ram..what more you want?.
  
  1212. With which MD should he share his movies? Shankar ganesh or chandrabose? 13123. These people did do well with what they got, why are blaming IR?. 34534. It was TNs fate that we had only one decent MDs in 80s.
  
  222. if MSV's own sons want IR to work in his movie, what can IR do about it?. 444. Did IR do things like lata, like treating directors who comes back to him?. 434. Bagyaraj used IR again and again going back to differnt MDs, he still got great songs from him. 898. Same with rajni kanth and others. 4645. What do you know about asst. music directors? why is VSN, arunmozhi are still with IR?. 23423. IR is not having a rock band, where people can come and play what they want. He is western classical style composer, he gives the notes, anyone has to play is notes and its end of story. 88989. Yeah it is one man show, as it was with mozart and beethovan. 23423. Can you meet ARR every wednesday morning during breakfast?
  
  
• From: cry baby (@ 64.208.81.180) on: Wed Jan 24 16:39:37 EST 2001
  
  aiiiiiiiiiiiiiin bala mama ir mamava kurai solarar...aiiiiiiiiian amma.....mmmiuuuu mmmmmmmm
  mmmmmmmmmmm.....uuuuuuu m mmmmmm uuuuuuu
  yaravadhu ir mamava parthu kurai sona nan sathama azuven....poda mama....pola....
  ammma paruma...indha bala mamava....
  aiiiiiiiiian amma.....mmmiuuuu mmmmmmmm
  mmmmmmmmmmm.....uuuuuuu
  
  

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