Raga of song please
Topic started by Gopal Prasad (@ greed.cs.umass.edu) on Sat May 17 07:42:45 EDT 1997.
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Hindi Raaga of Songs Thread
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- From: vijay (@ 129.252.25.96)
on: Tue Sep 11 20:09:12 EDT 2001
in fact the first 2 lines of this this song reminds me of "andharangam yaavume" ..
- From: IR (@ 38.220.167.229)
on: Wed Sep 12 10:29:07 EDT 2001
MS, Vidh: The song seems to be a combo of both Sudhdha Dhanyasi and Shrothasvini - Just my observation
- From: IR (@ 38.220.167.229)
on: Wed Sep 12 10:38:16 EDT 2001
IR Fan: Nilavu Pattu is in Sindhu Bhairavi - which itself is an offshoot of Thodi. The song has more shades of Sindhu Bhairavi and it is hard to place it under Thodi! For example the line (charanam 1) KuyilgaLin Iruppidam Isayaal AriyaLAM (ni3) is clear Sindhu Bhairavi...
- From: IR_Fan (@ 202.88.154.169)
on: Thu Sep 13 00:29:44 EDT 2001
thank you IR and MS....
The song "vaarthai thavari vitai kannamma maarbu thudikkudhadi" in the film "Sethu" is based on what raga? Whenever one humms the song " nallathor veenai seiythe" from Marupadiyum (sung by Janaki) it seems to lead to "vaarthai thavari vittai" in Sethu...that "marupadiyum" i am told is based on charukesi...or is it? help pls...
- From: Gayathri (@ 64.26.195.78)
on: Thu Sep 13 01:15:35 EDT 2001
nalothor veenai seithen - i thought it might be Gowri Manohari.
- From: IsaiPriyan (@ 164.164.86.66)
on: Thu Sep 13 23:12:31 EDT 2001
Was listening to "How to Name It ?" last night. Wow, what a terrific composition it was by the maestro !!
BTW, I tried to make out some of the ragas. Pls clarify...
1) How to Name it ? (Veedu BGM) - Shanmukapriya
2) Mod Mood Fugue (2nd piece in A side)- Kalyani
3) And we had a talk (3rd piece in B side) - MMG
Can isai experts clarify ?
TIA
- From: IR_Fan (@ 202.88.154.169)
on: Fri Sep 14 01:49:18 EDT 2001
-----------------------------------------------
The song "vaarthai thavari vitai kannamma maarbu thudikkudhadi" in the film "Sethu" is based on what raga? Whenever one humms the song " nallathor veenai seiythe" from Marupadiyum (sung by Janaki) it seems to lead to "vaarthai thavari vittai" in Sethu...that "marupadiyum" i am told is based on charukesi...or is it? help pls...
From: Gayathri - ,"nalothor veenai seithen - i thought it might be Gowri Manohari."
---------------------------------------------
IR, MS ....comment please....
- From: MS (@ 129.252.25.204)
on: Fri Sep 14 02:46:49 EDT 2001
IR Fan :-)
vaarththai thavari vittai is in vaguLaabraNam as I can understand. NalladhOr veeNai is in chaarukEsi. the confusion is because of the ri2 in VB and r3 and chaarukesi. All the other notes are same.
- From: MS (@ 129.252.25.204)
on: Fri Sep 14 02:47:42 EDT 2001
oh colossal mistake ! r1 in VB and r2 in ChaarukEsi ! sorry !
- From: IR_Fan (@ )
on: Fri Sep 14 04:56:54 EDT 2001
:-) thanks a lot MS...
1) Kukkukkoo koo koovum kuyilakka - From the movie "valli", what raga is it? it leads to "sangeetham paada kelvi gnanam idhu potum" from the movie "ithu namma aalu"....help please
2) what raga is "sharanam bhava karunamayi" from
"Sethu" ?
MS.. your take on these two songs...
- From: RR (@ 192.122.134.249)
on: Fri Sep 14 05:25:15 EDT 2001
'kukkukko' is mohanam. 'saranam bhava' starts like kalyani but seems to change raga later on. What do you think, MS?
- From: IR_Fan (@ 202.88.154.169)
on: Fri Sep 14 07:07:01 EDT 2001
Thank you RR... :-)
i heard a very astonishing thing... someone said the folk number 'vaadi en gappa kizhangu' from the film "alaigal oiyvathillai" is based on some raga...i very vaguely remeber the person mentioning "Kaaviyam Paadava thendrale" from "idhayathai thirudaathe" as another example ...well, the latter i am told is "BHAGESHRI"... then what is "vaadi en kappa kizhange" ?
- From: IsaiPriyan (@ 164.164.86.66)
on: Fri Sep 14 09:55:12 EDT 2001
IR fan..
1) "Kukukkoo" from "Valli" is Mohanam. Reminds me of "Ninnukkori Varanam" in the charanam
2) "Charanam Bhava" is Kalyani, but I dont find any change to Raga towards the end
As RR said, can MS clarify ?
And makkaley... andha "How to Name It ?" doubt-a yaaravadhu clarify pannungappa ::-))
- From: IR (@ 38.220.167.229)
on: Fri Sep 14 10:24:18 EDT 2001
hi guys - thought it would be a little easier if you also gave audio links for some of these songs :-)
- From: IR (@ 38.220.167.229)
on: Fri Sep 14 10:55:50 EDT 2001
CharaNam Bhava karuNaamayi Guru Dheena DhayaLo is a lovely melody in KalyaNi.
RR, the version I heard (the 2 minute piece) did not have any other raga changes. If you listen carefully, you would notice that the main reason this song sounds so melodious and light is because Ilayaraja has used the "sa and pa" notes sparingly! If you listen to other KalyaNi based songs like vandhaal Mahalakshmiye, veeNai adi nee enakku - you would find that sa and pa notes are touched more often! The third stanza in charaNam Bhava is a good example of the sa and pa note usage I am talking about!
Some additional info on the song: This song is a Carnatic Krithi - a compostion of Guru Suraajanandha. It was originally tuned in a raga called Hamsavinodhini by Vidhwan T.M Thyagarajan and popularised by M L Vasantha Kumari, Sudha Ragunathan and others..
- From: IR (@ 38.220.167.229)
on: Fri Sep 14 10:58:09 EDT 2001
oops - sorry NarayaNa Theerthar and not Guru Suraajanandha
- From: MS (@ 129.252.25.204)
on: Fri Sep 14 21:59:17 EDT 2001
kukkukoo:
Yes predominantly in mohanma except for the lines "aatrangarai mEttilE thendral sollum paattile..then pothigai kaattile thEn iRaikkum pookkaLE" - use of M2 here.
sharaNam:
kalyani. RR, the charaNam seems slightly hamsadhwanish, but hamsadhwani itself has the same notes of kalyaNi. IR holds that it is a way to sing kalyani.
Isaipriyan:
how to name it is a medley. It has many ragas. For eg. the main theme contains - simmendhra madhyamam, shaNmugapriya and gowri manohari ( I guess I am right about the last raga..the start seems to be more of shrotasvini)
for the last portion let me try writing down the swaras
sa ga3 ma1 pa ni3
ga3 ma1 pa ni3 pa
ga ma1 pa sa g3
sa ni3 ni3(or d2 - not sure) pa
ni3 pa pa ma1
pa pa ma1 ga3
pa pa ni3 sa
sa ga3 ma1 pa ni3 ni3 sa
If that note is d2 it is GM or it shd be shrotasvini
veedu BGM is another aviyal. A fantastic soul stirring composition though.I woudl rather not attribute any raga to this.
I can't recognize the names though I have all those pieces imprinted on my mind. Yes. I vaguely remember the "rose color cassette" with a photo of musing Maestro inw hich the second piece is starts with violin punches and then alead violin starts palying kalyaNi witht he follwoing notes:
saaa nirisa ni dha pa madhapama ri ga
IF that is the one your atalking about then it is kalyani.
In the b-side of that "echo" cassette, I guess chamber Welcomes thyagaraja is the one which has "thulasi dala mulasi" and allied MMG orchestrations.
Idhayaththai thirudaathe - kaviyam paadava thendrale has a good chaya of baageshri. But bageshri has a structure mroe complicated thatn I can interpret :-) IR ,please comment.
vaadi en kappak kizange , aNNe aNNe sippai aNNe and en sogak kadhaiyak kELu thaaikkulame - all three are supposedly in some melakarthas. the last one is dhEnuka I guess (engeyO padichcha nyaabagam). The first two are in rishabap priya ? (once again..EPN).
I was listening to paalum pazum+ paavamannippu of MSV-ramamorrthy. I found one shubapantuvaraaLi number by susheela. "indha naadagamidum" is a beautiful song.
- From: IR_Fan (@ 202.88.154.169)
on: Sat Sep 15 01:43:01 EDT 2001
thank you MS & IR & RR & ISAIPRIYAN....can you validate the following?
Natai - Unna Nambi Nethiyile - Chittukuruvi
Natai - Maadathile Kanni Maadathile - Veera
- From: MS (@ 129.252.25.204)
on: Sat Sep 15 15:23:59 EDT 2001
IR / RR:
Can you please lay down the differences between naattai and chalanaattai ? AFAIK the other allied ragas
Jog---- |s r3 g3 m1 pa n2 s|---|s n2 pa m1 g3 r3 s|
thilang-- |s g3 m1 pa n3 s|---|s n2 pa m1 g3 s|
gambeeranattai-- |s g3 m1 pa n3 s|---|s n3 pa m1 g3 s|
These ragas are soooo close in swaras and feel that they are pretty confusing too. U can also provide an explanation for IR fan's qn based on these.
- From: Ramesh (@ 203.199.247.7)
on: Sun Sep 16 06:02:34 EDT 2001
==============
thank you MS & IR & RR & ISAIPRIYAN....can you validate the following?
Natai - Unna Nambi Nethiyile - Chittukuruvi
Natai - Maadathile Kanni Maadathile - Veera
==============
Hi, I think "Maadathile Kanni Maadathile" is in the rag Brindavana Saranga.
- From: RR (@ 192.122.134.249)
on: Sun Sep 16 22:57:05 EDT 2001
For 'maadathile', see: http://newtfmpage.com/forum/2755.ros.html
belongs to vagadeeswari family, according to carnatic authority IR :)
- From: IR Fan (@ 202.88.154.169)
on: Mon Sep 17 00:41:46 EDT 2001
still not getting a concrete reply for "madathile kanni maadathile" from Veera...(RR thanks though for the link, but it did not pinpoint anything particular)...
- From: IR (@ 4.3.189.81)
on: Mon Sep 17 10:14:54 EDT 2001
RR - evlo naaLa enna pazhi vaangaNum nnu aasai ippadi :-)
IR Fan - when a song does not confirm to the grammar of any raga, it is difficult to point out the raga. IMHO, it would be safest to conclude that it belongs to "a family" under such circumstances.
- From: IR (@ 4.3.189.81)
on: Mon Sep 17 10:24:48 EDT 2001
MS - Gambeera Naattai and Naattai are offshoots of the parent raga - Chala Naattai and hence they would sound similar.
Chala Naattai is the 36th melakartha
Sa Ri3 Ga3 Ma1 Pa Dha3 Ni3 Sa
Sa Ni3 Dha3 pa ma1 ga3 Ri3 Sa
Naattai: Sa Ri3 Ga3 Ma1 Pa (dha3) Ni3 Sa - Sa Ni3 Pa Ma1 Ri3 Ga3 Ma1 Ri3 Sa.
Gambeera Naattai: Sa Ga3 Ma1 Pa Ni3 Sa
Sa Ni3 Pa Ma1 Ga3 Sa
Thilang and Jog are closely related ragas. MS - I think Jog notes are a little different from what you have mentioned. I believe it takes both the nishadams like thilang. Would get back to you with proper Jog scale. THilang is more straight forward and Jog is a vakra raga.
Would anybody have a link on the net for "Senthamizh PaNN Isayil" from Thodi Ragam ? I am wondering if that song is in Jog! or may be thilang!!
- From: Raghu (@ 164.164.79.36)
on: Mon Sep 17 11:49:43 EDT 2001
Gr8 work guys for i was always gettin confused btwn jog and tilang.all the songs i name as jog, one of my relatives used to call it tilang.
Jog - excellent song in metti - metti oli kathodu en nenjai thaalatta.the vioilin interlude is just marvellous.And also janaki's humming.IRs voice just fits into the song like anything.
Other egs (sorry i know only malayalam egs. pl bear with me)
Pramadavanam veendum - by raveendran in his highness abdulla - i think most of the tamil music lovers will also be familiar with this song.
parayaaan maranna paribhavangal from the film garshom sung by hariharan.
Sruthiyamma layamachan by vidyasagar in the film
Madhura nombarakkattu.
Vaarmukile by raveendran in the film Mazha.
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